EQing Question: Creating Space Without Losing Tone???

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BigF

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As we all know, guitarists live and die by "their tone". Sometimes they have spent years refining their tone and trying to get their instrument to sound a certain way, and while I can bitch about their primadona ways, the truth is that, along with their actually playing, often times this tone is a signature and identifier...something that differentiates and individualizes them. It's their SOUND.

Well, here is the problem:

I have two guitars - lead and rhythm, as well as vocals, stepping all over each other in certain ranges, and I have to find a way to create space to clear the mud.

So my question is; how can I EQ the guitars/vocals to create that space without drastically altering their tone? Cutting here and boosting there is certainly bringing them out in the mix, but it is significantly altering tone and driving everyone nuts.
Are there other tricks to separating instruments that I am missing? Suggestions?

Thanks
 
Before resorting to EQ, are you sure it's not an arrangement problem??? Could it be that the 2 guitars are playing parts either too similar, or too close to each other on the fret-board, or maybe even just the sounds are too similar.

Without hearing an example of you're talking about, I can only specualte. But my GUESS would be that it's not an EQ problem as much as it's an arrangement problem. Just a guess, though.
 
1. 90% of tone is in the fingers, not in the amp settings. Coax your guitarist(s) into playing the parts diffeently, and not lean so much on amp settings to get some mythical "tone".

2. Cut down on the amp gain distortion on at least one of the parts. Over-distortion on recordings sounds like too much distortion more than it does live, and leads to both too much "competition" on the recording and too many phase issues.

3. Decide which part "prefers" or "leans towards" a particular frequency range. IOW, one probably sounds a bit deeper than the other and the other probably tends to "like" the crisper detail part of the sound better than the other. Use those potentials to your advantage. On the "deeper" or "fuller"-sounding one, bump the deeper or fuller-sounding frequencies in a wide spread by just a dB or two, while simultaneously cutting the other part in the same range, again by just dB or two. Don't over-do it, just a little each way to emphasize the difference. Then do a similar thing the other way around for the upper mids to emphasize the other git up there.

4. Read the other threads in this forum on "Getting a Clean Sound" and "Making Space".

G.
 
Personally I've never had tone in my fingers, lol. I agree with Rami in that it's probably something you can address in the arrangements. If not or in addition to you can use panning, EQ, compression, delays and reverb and active crossovers to clear up some mud.
 
Can we hear what you got...?...that way, it's easier to talk about it. ;)

There shouldn't be too much problem to mix just a single rhythm guitar and lead guitar without them stepping on each other.

How are they panned...?
 
Some good suggestions above. If after trying those out, you still aren't quite happy, there's a couple of EQ things that can accomplish what you're after.
1. Do a frequency sweep of each track and find the "sweet spot". I'm talking about taking a bell parametric EQ with a 2.5 dB boost and a Q of 1.0 and slide it up and down the freq range until you find the one frequency that makes that track sound the best. Once found, leave it there.
2. Now go to each other track and do a cut at the same frequency only this time more narrow, with a Q of 1.4-2.8.
3. Do this for each track. Boost the sweet spot and cut all the other tracks at that freq.
4. You can also send your vocal track to a buss. On that buss add an EQ with a deep low shelf cut at 4.5k and a large high shelf boost at 4.5k. Then slowly bring that up under the main vocal track. Not too much, just enough to bring the vocal forward enough without it sounding weird.

These little tricks can give you more separation and bring the vocal forward some without sounding weird or losing tone, if done correctly.
 
BigF said:
Cutting here and boosting there is certainly bringing them out in the mix, but it is significantly altering tone and driving everyone nuts.
Click to expand...

I've found that many 1st time studio-goers expect their guitars to sound just like they do in their bedrooms when they're playing solo. I often have to explain to them that space needs to be made for everything else in the mix, especially in the low end. Could this be part of the problem?

It may help to have them really listen to their favorite records to realize how much LESS distortion and low/high end they probably need to get good recorded guitar tone.

But it's tough to say for sure without actually hearing the tracks.
 
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