Drum Machines vs Stand Alone Software vs Electronic Drums

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halfwatt

halfwatt

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Hi All,

I am new to the forum (and home recording) and have some question(s) about drum machines vs stand alone drum software like iZotope iDrum, or perhaps an electronic drum kit.

I am about to pull the trigger on a DP-24 and to finally start getting some of my musical ideas realized. After a lot of research and consideration I felt like this was the right place to start for me. I worked professionally as a FOH engineer in another lifetime and having something physical with faders that resembles a "real" board appeals to me. I also work on a computer all day for a living and felt that this kind of set up would be more spontaneous to use and fun (this is supposed to be fun, right ?) - so that's why I am not going the full blown DAW route, at least not right now.

I was going to get a drum machine at the same time as the DP-24, but the more I researched them, the more I was concerned that trying to do any programming was going to be more labor intensive than I was hoping for, so then I started considering something like iZotope iDrum, which sounded like it would be easier to program even though it brings me back to the computer, which happens to be upstairs while my music space is downstairs. Also, my initial approach to recording would probably be to first record a rhythm guitar part and perhaps a working vocal, and then add in the rest, which I know is not the traditional way of doing things. And finally I thought about an electronic drum kit, but haven't researched them enough to know if I can record direct to the DP-24, or if a computer needs to be involved. And do I have enough potential drum chops to even pull that off. It sounds like I can record drums on iDrum as a .wav file and take them downstairs and load them on the DP-24 no problem. The only audio program I have used is audacity, but with that or something else like it, I should be able to take things done downstairs and add iDrums to it upstairs. Which may eventually lead me in the direction of doing the final mix and mastering on the computer upstairs...but for now I am hoping to keep most, if not all, of the actual music creation downstairs.

So....I was hoping those of you who are further down the road would share some comments, advice and experience with me about these things before I head too far down the wrong road.

Thanks a bunch to all of you who make this such a great forum. Now, I am all ears....
 
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EZ Drummer 2

...or of you want to step up a bit with mixing options...

Superior Drummer


EZD2 is good for songwriters that just want a fast drum sound, and not much messing around....while SD lets you treat the drums samples same as you would recorded live drums, so you have more options...and more decisions to make.

There are are other good drum programs....Steven Slate Drums-SSD4, Addictive Drums, etc....so I'm sure other folks will chime in.
I think it's safe to say that for more serious/involved studio drum tracks, the choices among the majority of users end up being either SSD4 or Superior Drummer....or some people use both.
For more simple drag-n-drop kind of drum tracks.....the new EZD2 is getting great reviews.
 
Pretty hard to nudge the snare up by 2db and raise the compression ratio a smidge when you've got your drum tracks as a stereo .wav file via Addicitive Drums or whatever and you're trying to mix it on a standalone. I know. I've tried. You'll get lots of exercise going up and down those stairs.

I was a hold out on standalone machines for a long time - I didn't want to go PC recording ... and I could make up a gee whiz rationale as to why I liked faders as well, specially the motorised ones I had.

Ultimately it was fucking round with drum software like you're about to do that forced my hand and so I went the PC / interface / Reaper route.

And then I realised how much time I'd wasted dealing with the ridiculous constraints of standalone machines. The album I've got in my sig probably would never have seen light of day had I stayed with the standalone.

But of course, YMMV... it depends upon your creative aspirations to a large extent. :eek:
 
Armistice said:
Pretty hard to nudge the snare up by 2db and raise the compression ratio a smidge when you've got your drum tracks as a stereo .wav file via Addicitive Drums or whatever and you're trying to mix it on a standalone. I know. I've tried. You'll get lots of exercise going up and down those stairs.

I was a hold out on standalone machines for a long time - I didn't want to go PC recording ... and I could make up a gee whiz rationale as to why I liked faders as well, specially the motorised ones I had.

Ultimately it was fucking round with drum software like you're about to do that forced my hand and so I went the PC / interface / Reaper route.

And then I realised how much time I'd wasted dealing with the ridiculous constraints of standalone machines. The album I've got in my sig probably would never have seen light of day had I stayed with the standalone.

But of course, YMMV... it depends upon your creative aspirations to a large extent. :eek:
Click to expand...

Thank you Armistice ! That is exactly the kind of thing I need to hear. And you answered my next question as to what "host" to use, i.e. Reaper, which I was tending to anyway.

At this point in time the focus is just getting things out of my head and into the material world - that is primary...while a super-fine finished product is a worthy goal, it is secondary at this point.

Based on what I hear you saying, all things considered, it sounds like getting the guitars and vocals and other single input instruments tracked downstairs with no efx on the DP-24 and doing the rest, including drums and effects, upstairs in Reaper is the best "compromise" solution for my situation at this point.

Thanks again !

p.s. enjoyed your album
 
No probs... you don't really need a 24 track machine to track, however.

I don't have an upstairs and a downstairs, however my main recording PC is a heavy duty desktop unit with multiple monitors that never goes anywhere, however I've just bought a new general purpose laptop and installed all the various interface drivers, Reaper and other music software things on it so I can use it for tracking or production when I'm away from the main PC merely by transferring some files between machines.

It doesn't take that much grunt to track, so there's one solution. Other is to just use a good laptop for both upstairs and downstairs....

If you really must have faders, then do you really need 24 tracks, would be my question.
 
I think youy're going to get tired of the 'upstairs/downstairs' commute. You're going to need monitors in both locations, acoustic treatment in both locations ...

As another person who went the stand-alone route first, I always recommend going right to a computer and audio interface now.
For the interface - what is the maximum number of simultaneous inputs you will want to record separately at one time?
With the cost of desktop computers these days, it's not that much more expensive to get a new one and an interface compared to a stand-alone recorder.
 
Or get your iPad out and interface it with the controls in Reaper. Then as long as you're in the wifi you can use the pad for stop/play/record and just run an IR headset upstairs/downstairs to listen in. No more stair trips...

Would still recommend doing the whole thing in one room. Also, if you're anything of a drummer, recording yourself and running through SSD or any of the others is a really good option. You can quantize yourself closer (or move some of the far outs) to get the timing right if needed.

Be careful, though, when looking at e-drums. I spent what I considered reasonable money for what I though was a reasonable drum kit (Alesis DM-10 Studio) and it needs a lot of work to get it running. The pads are very unrealistic, the cross-bleed is not a lot of fun to deal with. Lots of tweaking and I'm still going to have to convert the heads to mesh to get a decent feel.
OTOH, I played through a Roland V-Drum custom kit that ran about $5000 this weekend and was amazed at how easy and fun it was to play. Point is, to get a decent e-kit you're either going to spend the money for a good DW kit, or spend a LOT of your time and resources getting it to perform like a real drum kit...bottom line, the real thing is much easier and with correct tuning and good heads, a $1000 Pearl or Tama set will play much easier than a $1000 electric set and sound just as good if not better. Unfortunately, I don't have the neighbors for a real drum kit...

If you love having the "real" sliders, take a look at Reason. It's based on an SSL 9000J series board and I am absolutely in love with the interface. I still use Reaper as well, because the Reason interface does not deal (for stability reasons) with third party VSTs and only some VSTi's (ones that can be brought in via MIDI only).
 
Not sure if this is relevant, but I was looking at the standalone recorders for mobile recording last year. After a long search, I decided to go cheap laptop (like $225) and a Tascam 1800. Just for tracking. It was about the same amount of money as a portable with more options. Plus, I can still do on the cheapo laptop what can be done on any standalone (EQ, compression, minor effects).

This setup allows me to track anywhere, then come back to my main mixing station and do the final mixing. I have taken it out a couple of times and works perfect. 14 tracks at once, save the project on the laptop, then share out the folder when I get home, open the project on mixing computer, keep going.

I am not against portastudios, but the above really seemed an easier route and I didn't have to relearn the interface.
 
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