DP-24 - I love it (so far)

  • Thread starter Thread starter cwhowell2
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Hi. Forgive my ignorance here, but can someone enlighten me with the "Virtual Tracks" function? Everytime I attempt to create one it erases the one I just did. I thought I could do 8 takes on one track and then go back and review. Thanks in advance!
 
boxy said:
Hi. Forgive my ignorance here, but can someone enlighten me with the "Virtual Tracks" function? Everytime I attempt to create one it erases the one I just did. I thought I could do 8 takes on one track and then go back and review. Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...
I hope I can explain it without making it sound more complicated that it is.

OK, here goes. First of all, don't confuse "Takes" with "Virtual tracks". Their concept can sort of overlap in a sense.

"Takes" refers to when you're recording a part with the "punch-in" function on. You keep recording the same part over and over again and then choose the take you want to keep.

Now......forget that.........:D

To help understand what I'm going to try to say, it's important to understand the difference between a TRACK and a CHANNEL, which is why I'll capitalize those two words whenever they come up.

"Virtual tracks" are complete tracks that can replace each other in the mixer. Think of the 2488 (or NEO, or DP-24) as a 24 CHANNEL mixer that can only "hold" 24 TRACKS at a time. When you open a new song, it happens to have TRACKS 1-24 on CHANNELS 1-24 (makes sense). Now let's say you've filled up TRACKS 1-24 with music. .....

Now, let's say you have a guitar track that's on channel 1. You might want to replace it but you don't want to erase the one you have. Since all 24 CHANNELS and TRACKS are full, you have to call up TRACK 25 and put it in mixer CHANNEL 1, and you have a blank TRACK 25 in mixer CHANNEL 1. You can now try another guitar track on TRACK 25 (which is in mixer CHANNEL 1)without erasing TRACK 1 that was there originally (and still exists in the "Virtual Track" menu.

So, in theory, you can fill up 99 TRACKS with music. But you can only mix 24 at a time because that's all the CHANNELS you have.

I hope this makes some sense and helps.
 
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Thanks for the quick reply!

Actually, I just got the DP-24 and I'm trying to use the Virtual Track function. Was having a bit of trouble understanding how it worked but after I posted I went back to tinkering with it and I think I have just figured out how to use it.

Don't wander off too far because I may be chiming in with another problem! :)
 
boxy said:
Hi. Forgive my ignorance here, but can someone enlighten me with the "Virtual Tracks" function? Everytime I attempt to create one it erases the one I just did. I thought I could do 8 takes on one track and then go back and review. Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...

Well, haven't tried it, and I just sent off my machine today for exchange.....But....judging from my experience with the machine and Manual (which assumes you know things) I would record a first take, click on virtual track, then assign a separate virtual track, then record another take and so on and so on.....if you DON'T assign to do a virtual track, apparently it doesn't just automatically do it for you....

That's my understanding of page 59 of the Manual...the problem with the Manual is they interrupt their train of thought, instead of giving you a step 1, 2, 3, 4 approach.....you can see steps 1. 2. & 3. On the right side of pg. 59 Follow that and you should be good to go......

For me, I just record 6 tracks of acoustic guitar on physical tracks, A/B side to side and comp....then I erase remaining tracks, and record 7 lead vocals side by side....I comp it down as well.....I personally would rather be able to A/B side by side and use the mute button etc....it's really fast that way....

I personally would go crazy trying to decide between virtual tracks.....I'd rather comp side by side...I got this machine to get stuff done, not wallow in endless decisions....I know if I sing something all the way through 7 times I got MORE than enough good phrasing

Hope this helps....follow page 59 steps 1. 2. & 3. And you should be good to go.....
 
Thanks for your reply!

Yes, I figured that out. I am still just learning to use some of the features, with this digital format being new to me.

I had a PortaOne many years ago and then I got a 388, which I love but unfortunately she is quite sick and I am not sure what's wrong and whether or not to have it repaired.

So I got the DP-24 because I like the stand alone format and for the price it is turning out to be a nice machine.

Anyway, I may be calling again!
 
hey guys, I have been reading with interest your comments re the DP24. I got mine about a month ago and so far, so good...except; I intend to use the machine as my recording tool and use Sonar 8 Producer to generate midi tracks (primarily drums etc) which I will bounce over at mix down stage.
Problem is, when using DP 24 as 'master' for syncing using MTC, and therefore using the 24's transport controls, the midi tracks in Sonar either start slightly out of sync or drop out entirely at random points during playback/record. I have tried setting up everything in reverse ( Sonar as master, generating MTC), but the DP 24 will not recognise the signal at all.
I have checked and double checked settings in Sonar and the 24 and cannot see why I'm getting these problems - and obviously can't decide which unit is to blame?
Any ideas anyone?

Dual core PC - XP (sp2) - 2G ram - Focusrite Saffire firewire audio/midi interface - Sonar set to ASIO drivers.
 
Gravity Music said:
hey guys, I have been reading with interest your comments re the DP24. I got mine about a month ago and so far, so good...except; I intend to use the machine as my recording tool and use Sonar 8 Producer to generate midi tracks (primarily drums etc) which I will bounce over at mix down stage.
Problem is, when using DP 24 as 'master' for syncing using MTC, and therefore using the 24's transport controls, the midi tracks in Sonar either start slightly out of sync or drop out entirely at random points during playback/record. I have tried setting up everything in reverse ( Sonar as master, generating MTC), but the DP 24 will not recognise the signal at all.
I have checked and double checked settings in Sonar and the 24 and cannot see why I'm getting these problems - and obviously can't decide which unit is to blame?
Any ideas anyone?

Dual core PC - XP (sp2) - 2G ram - Focusrite Saffire firewire audio/midi interface - Sonar set to ASIO drivers.
Click to expand...

Well....I know that the DP24 does not Slave to my Korg Triton Extreme....It Masters like a champ....I set it to Master and the Midi to CLOCK......of course my Triton Extreme is set to EXTERNAL.....For my purposes I don't use MTC....

Don't have a DAW.......but you would need your Sonar to Slave....On the DP24 do you set the MIDI to CLOCK?

It is my understanding that the DP24 doesn't send any Midi, so that is why I can't slave it in my situation....

Set the DP 24 MODE to Master and Sync Generator to Clock......let me know if that works for ya.....

It's what I do.....
 
Gravity Music said:
hey guys, I have been reading with interest your comments re the DP24. I got mine about a month ago and so far, so good...except; I intend to use the machine as my recording tool and use Sonar 8 Producer to generate midi tracks (primarily drums etc) which I will bounce over at mix down stage.
Problem is, when using DP 24 as 'master' for syncing using MTC, and therefore using the 24's transport controls, the midi tracks in Sonar either start slightly out of sync or drop out entirely at random points during playback/record. I have tried setting up everything in reverse ( Sonar as master, generating MTC), but the DP 24 will not recognise the signal at all.
I have checked and double checked settings in Sonar and the 24 and cannot see why I'm getting these problems - and obviously can't decide which unit is to blame?
Any ideas anyone?

Dual core PC - XP (sp2) - 2G ram - Focusrite Saffire firewire audio/midi interface - Sonar set to ASIO drivers.
Click to expand...

I am using the DP24 as master and the clock as MTC. Boss BR1600CD as slave. It does take about 3 bars for the sound to kick in from the boss once I start the DP24. I have had a problem where the sound from the boss will drop out for a few seconds and then kick back in. It is intermittent and I haven't solved it yet. If you are having the same symptom with a different slave device, it indicates the DP24 might be the source of the issue.
What I do is pick the tempo for the song and record the synced slave device back into channel 23/24 of the DP24. It is taking a couple of goes to get the entire song length recorded with no drop outs but then I use channel 23/24 as my click track and disengage the slave device. It's not too much of an issue for me as I'm recording live drums later to replace 23/24.
I wish the DP24 had the option to loop an audio phrase like the Boss BR1600CD because then it would be easier to change tempos for song writing and arranging.
Oh yeah, I found another limitation as well. In the metronome section, you can only pick whole beats per second!! 60bpm or 61bpm, NOT 60.7bpm.
This is a pain because I have songs half finished on my boss at 117.3bpm than I want to complete on the DP24 but now the bar count wont line up... I am hoping there is a firmware upgrade to fix the MIDI master clock drop outs and to allow partial BPM for the metronome.
 
jedcannon said:
I am using the DP24 as master and the clock as MTC. Boss BR1600CD as slave. It does take about 3 bars for the sound to kick in from the boss once I start the DP24. I have had a problem where the sound from the boss will drop out for a few seconds and then kick back in. It is intermittent and I haven't solved it yet. If you are having the same symptom with a different slave device, it indicates the DP24 might be the source of the issue.
What I do is pick the tempo for the song and record the synced slave device back into channel 23/24 of the DP24. It is taking a couple of goes to get the entire song length recorded with no drop outs but then I use channel 23/24 as my click track and disengage the slave device. It's not too much of an issue for me as I'm recording live drums later to replace 23/24.
I wish the DP24 had the option to loop an audio phrase like the Boss BR1600CD because then it would be easier to change tempos for song writing and arranging.
Oh yeah, I found another limitation as well. In the metronome section, you can only pick whole beats per second!! 60bpm or 61bpm, NOT 60.7bpm.
This is a pain because I have songs half finished on my boss at 117.3bpm than I want to complete on the DP24 but now the bar count wont line up... I am hoping there is a firmware upgrade to fix the MIDI master clock drop outs and to allow partial BPM for the metronome.
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Hey Jed, it's interesting that we appear to have similar symptons on different slave devices :/
I agree with you that recording midi tracks (albeit temporarily) onto the 24 is an option, but I tend to continually 'tweak' midi tracks as the audio tracks develop. In any case, we shouldn't have to go down that route - surely that's what sync facilities are for?
I'm going to get in touch with Tascam for their view on this - will post results when I get them.
Thanks for your input
 
SteveAlton said:
Well....I know that the DP24 does not Slave to my Korg Triton Extreme....It Masters like a champ....I set it to Master and the Midi to CLOCK......of course my Triton Extreme is set to EXTERNAL.....For my purposes I don't use MTC....

Don't have a DAW.......but you would need your Sonar to Slave....On the DP24 do you set the MIDI to CLOCK?

It is my understanding that the DP24 doesn't send any Midi, so that is why I can't slave it in my situation....

Set the DP 24 MODE to Master and Sync Generator to Clock......let me know if that works for ya.....

It's what I do.....
Click to expand...

Thanks for your comments Steve - Sonar is set to slave but won't respond to clock messages (only MTC). Believe me, I have tried every possible combination of settings to get these units to stableize :(.
Will be contacting Tascam/Sonar for their thoughts and will post replies when I get them.
 
I really appreciate this

cwhowell2 said:
Commercial CD import: It worked fine. Will save me tons of time. Hit the CD button - put a CD in the tray - select import track and 15 seconds later the stereo track is in the Audio Depot folder. Then create a new song and import the track from the folder.
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Thank you.
 
I am learning the ins and outs of this machine day by day via trial and error. :)

One thing I am not too keen on is the panning knob. Suppose I want the guitar lead to go back and forth. It is impossible to go from far left to far right in one sweep, like I could do on the 388. However, I think the way around this will be to place two identical takes on different tracks, pan one far left, the other far right, and then use the two faders up and down in opposition to create a panning effect.
 
boxy said:
I am learning the ins and outs of this machine day by day via trial and error. :)

One thing I am not too keen on is the panning knob. Suppose I want the guitar lead to go back and forth. It is impossible to go from far left to far right in one sweep...
Click to expand...

Say what now!?

Please tell me you're mistaken....'cause if that's true it's, frankly, an incomprehensible design fault by Tascam.

What's the point in having a dedicated pan knob if it doesn't actually work properly?! :confused:
 
I too am confused I just got my dp24 and the pan works fine here..........I take it your using the dp24 as a mastering? and your doing panning on the final mixing master??? I take all tracks to my pc and master in SonarX1.
 
Gdub1 said:
Say what now!?

Please tell me you're mistaken....'cause if that's true it's, frankly, an incomprehensible design fault by Tascam.

What's the point in having a dedicated pan knob if it doesn't actually work properly?! :confused:
Click to expand...

It pans right to left fully but since it's a digital knob it must be rotated several times around to go from one end to the other. An analog knob has a complete swing of maybe 300-330 degrees from one side to the other.

James Bell said:
I too am confused I just got my dp24 and the pan works fine here..........I take it your using the dp24 as a mastering? and your doing panning on the final mixing master??? I take all tracks to my pc and master in SonarX1.
Click to expand...

Yes, as I stated it works fine, just not able to sweep completely with one rotation.

I will use it for mastering. I have yet to step into the world of using a computer for audio. I'm really trying to avoid that if at all possible.
 
ok yeah.. your right, you would have to be darn fast with the hands to get it to sweep.....ya know I hate using the computer also but this recorder is digital. Your tracks are wav files, so don't feel bad about mastering on the pc cuz thats what your doing right now anyway. I stay away from anthing that is not recorded from a mic. I try to keep as real as possable.

good luck with that...good point man.

James

James
 
boxy said:
It pans right to left fully but since it's a digital knob it must be rotated several times around to go from one end to the other. An analog knob has a complete swing of maybe 300-330 degrees from one side to the other.
Click to expand...

Hi boxy!

I just naturally assumed the pan control could be assigned to pan from one side to t'other.
Like you, I really like to experiment with real-time sweeping of guitars, etc.

Sigh!

Please let us know how you get on with your 'fader idea' to sweep guitars.

Cheers. :)
 
On the DP 24 or NEO Does anyone import wav. files which has drum patterns programmed on them already??? If so where do i find them?
 
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Gdub1 said:
Hi boxy!

I just naturally assumed the pan control could be assigned to pan from one side to t'other.
Like you, I really like to experiment with real-time sweeping of guitars, etc.

Sigh!

Please let us know how you get on with your 'fader idea' to sweep guitars.

Cheers. :)
Click to expand...
It will sweep from one side to the other, it just requires MANY rotations. :(

I am sure the two track fader method will do the job without a problem. When will I get around to doing it, THAT is the question. :)
 
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