Do you really buy that expensive recording software?

[cobaltblue]

Just a thought, if every popular $300-600 studio software program were $50, how many more units do you think the software companies would sell, and how would it affect piracy rates?

Personally i've always been a bit dubious of the whole "piracy drives the increase of software prices". Whilst I understand software companies do feel the effect of piracy, the majority of users who aquire the software illegally would *never* afford or have the inclination to pay for it in the first place so would use a cheaper or free alternative IF the pirated software were unavailble. The whole sentiment seems very conveinient sometimes.

The higher end audio software is designed for commercial application no? therefore if you're making money using software you should pay for the software. A tool maker would have to buy his raw materials to manufacture his tools, it's the same concept.

The home/mid user should have more access to suitable programs, seriously, who in their bedroom, recording their band or solo project requires 64 tracks of audio? that's engineer snobbery i'm afraid. Less is often more remember

Im not sure where my point is going anymore, but I think software companies need to diversify their software even more than they do already to meet the demands and budgets of different types of user

 

[pacman9000]

Just a thought, if every popular $300-600 studio software program were $50, how many more units do you think the software companies would sell, and how would it affect piracy rates?

Personally i've always been a bit dubious of the whole "piracy drives the increase of software prices". Whilst I understand software companies do feel the effect of piracy, the majority of users who aquire the software illegally would *never* afford or have the inclination to pay for it in the first place so would use a cheaper or free alternative IF the pirated software were unavailble. The whole sentiment seems very conveinient sometimes.

The higher end audio software is designed for commercial application no? therefore if you're making money using software you should pay for the software. A tool maker would have to buy his raw materials to manufacture his tools, it's the same concept.

The home/mid user should have more access to suitable programs, seriously, who in their bedroom, recording their band or solo project requires 64 tracks of audio? that's engineer snobbery i'm afraid. Less is often more remember

Im not sure where my point is going anymore, but I think software companies need to diversify their software even more than they do already to meet the demands and budgets of different types of user

I agree for the most but you don't have to use all the tracks, for instance in tracktion you can use more then 64 tracks I believe but it's not hard to NOT use more tracks then you need, there is no need for a stripped down version of tracktion.


but the rest I agree with, and I do agree many companies are not responsive to the people who use their products, stay away from those companies...and there is alot of overpricing I agree, I think companies are hurting themselves.

 

[Toker41]

Studies show that piracy has no measurable impact on sales. It found that most people that obtain pirated music and software would still not buy it legally if they could not get it illegally.


Now, before I get blasted with negative feedback from all you trigger happy, holier than thou hypocrites, I am NOT condoning stealing of any kind, nor am I justifying it. I simply stated a relative fact. My recording software is paid for and LEGAL (N-track, which proves that quality recording software DOES NOT have to cost a lot)

 

[pacman9000]

Studies show that piracy has no measurable impact on sales. It found that most people that obtain pirated music and software would still not buy it legally if they could not get it illegally.


Now, before I get blasted with negative feedback from all you trigger happy, holier than thou hypocrites, I am NOT condoning stealing of any kind, nor am I justifying it. I simply stated a relative fact. My recording software is paid for and LEGAL (N-track, which proves that quality recording software DOES NOT have to cost a lot)

So you're saying that stealing is always absolutely wrong?

 

[soundchaser59]

I'm a programmer, I know what it takes to make that software happen. And now that I use the software, I know how much easier and more powerful it makes your life in the studio. My 7 foot rack and all the black boxes in it and my 24 channel mixer are all obsolete now... thanks to that software!

Support one of the last unregulated market arenas left in this country......computers and software!

 

[Toker41]

Nope, not saying that at all. Stealing to eat would be a necessary evil. Not being in a persons shoes, I wouldn't judge what they feel they need to do. However, there are many that justify their actions simply to feel good about what they know is bad. To each his own, and as long as your not stealing from me....doesn't really matter to me.

To my point....I'm saying that good, bad or indifferent, it's a bunch of BS when these companies say that the reason honest people pay so much is because of the dishonest people they lose money on. This makes the Companies themselves dishonest. If you really think there is a major company with a conscience, or one that really gives a shit about you, then you are naive. Only thing they care about is getting your money into their pockets. Does anybody really think they wouldn't lie, or exaggerate the truth to get a little more of it? Pirating is not a problem for major software compaines.....it's an advantage.

I guess people that don't believe this, also believe the reason cable television providers have to charge so much is because of people "stealing" cable, and the reason auto insurance companies charge so much is because of "trivial law suits", and uninsured motorist?

 

[pacman9000]

Nope, not saying that at all. Stealing to eat would be a necessary evil. Not being in a persons shoes, I wouldn't judge what they feel they need to do. However, there are many that justify their actions simply to feel good about what they know is bad. To each his own, and as long as your not stealing from me....doesn't really matter to me.

To my point....I'm saying that good, bad or indifferent, it's a bunch of BS when these companies say that the reason honest people pay so much is because of the dishonest people they lose money on. This makes the Companies themselves dishonest. If you really think there is a major company with a conscience, or one that really gives a shit about you, then you are naive. Only thing they care about is getting your money into their pockets. Does anybody really think they wouldn't lie, or exaggerate the truth to get a little more of it? Pirating is not a problem for major software compaines.....it's an advantage.

I guess people that don't believe this, also believe the reason cable television providers have to charge so much is because of people "stealing" cable, and the reason auto insurance companies charge so much is because of "trivial law suits", and uninsured motorist?

It's an interesting debate, especially in the music industry with all the downloading going on (way more then software), I have to say ultimately I still blame the record companies (switching topics for a minute) for their steep decline in record sales in the last two decades or so...look at all the crap they put out, one hit wonders who only have pop appeal with little girls, even parlaying one hit wonders into a career of the worst popular music ever created (justin timberlake) and then they have the audacity to blame kids downloading their music on their problems selling records???

It's absolutely absurd, although downloading is so prevalent now that I have to say it is a SERIOUS ISSUE, because now kids don't even value music like they used to, that's part of the reason they download so much, because the major labels have CHEAPENED music as a whole, made it like bubble gum pop cotton candy that's all fluff and no real substance and it's all about "who's hot" then they fade away and some new gimmick comes out, it's making kids value music less, well it already has.


As far as the software companies, I'm just not qualified to say if it's hurting them (free downloading) because I don't know as much about them like I do the evil record labels...but I don't think all companies are evil, I think most of the major corporations are, obviously there's alot of scumbag small bus owners as well...but I don't think that wanting to sell more products is evil per se (in and of itself), obviously when you go to all the trouble to design, produce, and market a product you think people will love and enjoy you want people to BUY IT and keep your business alive!....but with corporations it's just different, it's a different beast, alot of times the executives aren't even really concerned with the company's long-term health and they didn't start the business they really have no vested interest other then looking like they are doing a good job and getting multi-billion dollar salaries...corporations need to be outlawed.


www.TheCorporation.com

 

[Robert D]

This is so simple, despite all this incredable obfiscation. There's only two parties involved, the software rights owner, and you. Unless the software rights owner gives you permission to download and use their software for free, you're stealing it if you don't pay for it.

It has nothing to do with how much or how little money they, or you, or anyone else makes, or how overpriced there software seems to you. It is simply taking something that doesn't belong to you, making you a thief.

It isn't up to you or anyone else to decide if their business model makes sense, or if it's not really hurting them. If you want to make that case, call them and convince them. If everybody in this forum agrees with you, and they don't, you're still a thief.

Whether anyone judges you (besides God, if he or she exists) has nothing to do with it. You're either a thief or you're not. It's that simple.

 

[Toker41]

You're right, and I have never argued anything different. If you steal, you are a thief. What I said is that each circumstance is different for each individual, and since one can't possibly know what those circumstances are, one should not judge. Simply try to be the best person you can, and let God deal with other peoples sins. No one should be jumping up on a soapbox, pointing fingers at people they see as evil doers. I'm most referring to all the neg feedback I got on this thread saying things like "you're still a thief", and "you can't justify stealing, you thief". I never said I stole anything, and I never tried to justify stealing in anyway, yet I get judged as guilty for not judging. "Holier than thou" people are always on a crusade to persecute
"sinners".

 

[pacman9000]

This is so simple, despite all this incredable obfiscation. There's only two parties involved, the software rights owner, and you. Unless the software rights owner gives you permission to download and use their software for free, you're stealing it if you don't pay for it.

It has nothing to do with how much or how little money they, or you, or anyone else makes, or how overpriced there software seems to you. It is simply taking something that doesn't belong to you, making you a thief.

It isn't up to you or anyone else to decide if their business model makes sense, or if it's not really hurting them. If you want to make that case, call them and convince them. If everybody in this forum agrees with you, and they don't, you're still a thief.

Whether anyone judges you (besides God, if he or she exists) has nothing to do with it. You're either a thief or you're not. It's that simple.

you're the most ignorant crackhead on this site, LOL @ this pretentious cocksucker.

everybody is a thief, get off your highhorse you pathetic pool of defecation.

the founding fathers are thieves because they removed Injuns from the land they lived on and then claimed that THEY "Owned it" a concept the native americans didn't even understand because they did not see themselves as "owners" of the land...the whole concept of if ownership and privatization of everything should even exist in the first place...You are so far below me intellectually that I won't even bother destroying your weak psyche any further, kneel down you cocksucker.


So this is america, and everything is fair game, I'll take your fuckin daughters virginity then I own it, so now what, is that stealing??? no, I own it.

 

[pacman9000]

You're right, and I have never argued anything different. If you steal, you are a thief. What I said is that each circumstance is different for each individual, and since one can't possibly know what those circumstances are, one should not judge. Simply try to be the best person you can, and let God deal with other peoples sins. No one should be jumping up on a soapbox, pointing fingers at people they see as evil doers. I'm most referring to all the neg feedback I got on this thread saying things like "you're still a thief", and "you can't justify stealing, you thief". I never said I stole anything, and I never tried to justify stealing in anyway, yet I get judged as guilty for not judging. "Holier than thou" people are always on a crusade to persecute
"sinners".

i hear what you're trying to say but there it's not black and white like that "if you steal, u r a thief" it's jost not cut and dried like that there is many grey areas and wouldn't you consider a corporation paying a person far below a livable wage as "stealing labor" because it is and that employee is entitled to "take" what is owned to him and it is not "stealing" in any form except for in the psychotic and sociopathic mind of the corporation.


www.thecorporation.com

 

[wheelema]

you're the most ignorant crackhead on this site, LOL @ this pretentious cocksucker.

everybody is a thief, get off your highhorse you pathetic pool of defecation.

the founding fathers are thieves because they removed Injuns from the land they lived on and then claimed that THEY "Owned it" a concept the native americans didn't even understand because they did not see themselves as "owners" of the land...the whole concept of if ownership and privatization of everything should even exist in the first place...You are so far below me intellectually that I won't even bother destroying your weak psyche any further, kneel down you cocksucker.


So this is america, and everything is fair game, I'll take your fuckin daughters virginity then I own it, so now what, is that stealing??? no, I own it.

Are you older than fifteen?

 

[danny.guitar]

If you think companies are 'stealing labor' by providing low pay rates/no benefits (which is shitty I agree) then don't work for that company. This isn't communism, no one is telling you what job you have to have.

This is what college is for. Until then, get used to working shitty jobs.

I used to get paid $7.10/hr at Wal-Mart and that was for 3rd shit.

So I know what you're saying but it's not like Wal-Mart is the only option.

 

[Toker41]

That is the best point on this thread yet. If you are in a position that you feel you have to steal your software because your job just doesn't pay enough, then things are what they are. However, there is nothing stopping you from searching for a better paying job so that you don't feel the need to steal.
That doesn't cover the people that steal software and music simply because they can. I use to do that a lot with software. Would download things like Adobe Premiere, which is a $700 video editing software, when I had no use for it what so ever. I don't do it anymore, and have to say I feel a bit bad for it (people do change, and grow up). My point is, though, that I can't really explain why I did it. Getting off on the technology, maybe? had a ton of expensive software that I downloaded that I never had a use for. There are other that do this, any input from any of you? Can't really say the company was losing money, because since I didn't have a use for it to begin with, I certainly would never have bought it. Who is getting hurt there?

Again, I feel the need to say, before I get blasted with Neg feedback, that I am not condoning stealing with these comments. I am simply discussing issues, and seeking other views.

 

[Robert D]

So this is america, and everything is fair game, I'll take your fuckin daughters virginity then I own it, so now what, is that stealing??? no, I own it.

Fudgepacker 9000 - Good luck, my daughter is a lesbian, probably because of jerks like you.

How do you own someones virginity? I guess you cut the bloodspot out of the sheet and keep it forever to masturbate to while sniffing? What a clown.

 

[Robert D]

You're right, and I have never argued anything different. If you steal, you are a thief. What I said is that each circumstance is different for each individual, and since one can't possibly know what those circumstances are, one should not judge. Simply try to be the best person you can, and let God deal with other peoples sins. No one should be jumping up on a soapbox, pointing fingers at people they see as evil doers. I'm most referring to all the neg feedback I got on this thread saying things like "you're still a thief", and "you can't justify stealing, you thief". I never said I stole anything, and I never tried to justify stealing in anyway, yet I get judged as guilty for not judging. "Holier than thou" people are always on a crusade to persecute
"sinners".

There are holier than though people, which I don't care to have anything to do with. Then there a pragmatists who know that to be silent is to offer consent. I marched and protested in the streets of San Francisco before the invasion of Iraq because I know that concept is real. Most of us on the HR forums who speak up about piracy aren't in the holier than though camp, we're just pragmatic about the consequences of letting piracy go un-checked. So, for whatever good it does, we try to use peer pressure to deliver the message.

 

[pacman9000]

Are you older than fifteen?

you can't counter any of my points, so kindly fukkk off.

 

[pacman9000]

If you think companies are 'stealing labor' by providing low pay rates/no benefits (which is shitty I agree) then don't work for that company. This isn't communism, no one is telling you what job you have to have.

This is what college is for. Until then, get used to working shitty jobs.

I used to get paid $7.10/hr at Wal-Mart and that was for 3rd shit.

So I know what you're saying but it's not like Wal-Mart is the only option.

oh no?


what's the other options? cvs? call center? 7/hr for contruction work?


nobody should be paid under $11/hr in this country, and working at mcdonalds is more demanding them most higher-level management positions, college graduates are the lazy ones.


americans are so ignorant, I fail to comprehend the depth of their ignorance, just hope you don't run into someone like me on the street, all you pathetic faggots that support the status quo are the lowest of lifeforms, deadbeats.

 

[pacman9000]

That is the best point on this thread yet. If you are in a position that you feel you have to steal your software because your job just doesn't pay enough, then things are what they are. However, there is nothing stopping you from searching for a better paying job so that you don't feel the need to steal.
That doesn't cover the people that steal software and music simply because they can. I use to do that a lot with software. Would download things like Adobe Premiere, which is a $700 video editing software, when I had no use for it what so ever. I don't do it anymore, and have to say I feel a bit bad for it (people do change, and grow up). My point is, though, that I can't really explain why I did it. Getting off on the technology, maybe? had a ton of expensive software that I downloaded that I never had a use for. There are other that do this, any input from any of you? Can't really say the company was losing money, because since I didn't have a use for it to begin with, I certainly would never have bought it. Who is getting hurt there?

Again, I feel the need to say, before I get blasted with Neg feedback, that I am not condoning stealing with these comments. I am simply discussing issues, and seeking other views.

pull yerself up from yer bootstramps, eh? yeah, that's the ticket.

 

[pacman9000]

you're the most ignorant crackhead on this site, LOL @ this pretentious cocksucker.

everybody is a thief, get off your highhorse you pathetic pool of defecation.

the founding fathers are thieves because they removed Injuns from the land they lived on and then claimed that THEY "Owned it" a concept the native americans didn't even understand because they did not see themselves as "owners" of the land...the whole concept of if ownership and privatization of everything should even exist in the first place...You are so far below me intellectually that I won't even bother destroying your weak psyche any further, kneel down you cocksucker.


So this is america, and everything is fair game, I'll take your fuckin daughters virginity then I own it, so now what, is that stealing??? no, I own it.

this isnt' a joke u corny fukkks, these are very real points that you cannot withstand or counter in anyway...I've taken the high road, while you pitiful little status quo cocksuckers have taken the low road and tried to steer away from my incisive points...

...boy I'll cutcha.