Do I need a direct in box to capture DI track for reamping...

T

twangbuck

New member
Or can I just plug straight into my interface? I have a high impedence input for guitar on my zoom r-8, which I'm using as an interface. So I'm plugging straight into that to capture the DI track. Would going into a direct in box first give me any advantage? I'm not worried about monitoring purposes by the way, I'll use amplitube for that.
 
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That is likely something that you need to find out by trying. Likely not so much, but it really depends on the interface you have and what you are giving it.

I have heard that some direct boxes can make a difference in the tone of amp sims. I think Waves actually sold one for the GTR3 stuff. ?? I have never used them so my opinion is worthless here.
 
I would use a real DI in front of the Zoom in order to record the unmolested guitar output at the same time. Somewhere on this forum is a picture of DI vs mic'd and shows how much easier it is to edit the DI track. However, I could just be babbling, if it turns out the zoom has a true direct out split from the input :) I guess I'll go RTFM now
 
Yup, looks like you plug into the instrument in, set the switch to Hi-Z and make sure everything is unity gain on the way to the recording circuit and you are good. You might get people arguing all day and night how much more uber it will be with a zillion dollar DI, but as someone who owns every flavor of uber DI you can think of, it won't make much audible difference (if at all)
 
There should be no essential difference between the high Z input on the Zoom and a DI box into a mic pre although the latter could introduce a little "character" especially if it is a passive, transformer jobbie.
Also, passive DIs are rarely above 200k Ohms input Z, many much lower and this could make the guitar a little dim.

But, the thread title mentions "Re-amping"? Just for completeness, you are not thinking that the signal to the guitar amp needs some form of impedance boost? This is a common misapprehension, guitar amps do not care about the impedance of the source.

Dave.
 
Exactly what ecc83 said.

A passive DI has a bit too low in-Z, which will cause a rather subtle but definitely noticeable difference in the very top end "zing" from a passive guitar. Can be a blessing if you're not going to an amp or sim, but... It will also cause a volume drop, which will have to be compensated at some point and will almost certainly add noise in that process.

An active DI will have less of those issues, but will be pretty close to the same circuit that's in the interface to begin, so a bit redundant....

...Except that a lot of the Instrument inputs on these interfaces add 9 or 10db of gain (or less attenuation, it's all relative) compared to its line inputs. This can push hotter pickups into clipping the input circuit. That alone is not a huge deal if you're just going to distort the thing at the amp anyway, but the little bit of "purist" left alive in me doesn't love it. Worse, though, is that you then end up having to pad it back down on the way to reamping. ITB amp sims seem to be coded with this bit of boost in mind, but your guitar amp won't sound the same if you send it a signal that's 3 times as loud. Yes, there are plenty of places to adjust that level on the way, but the only way to be sure you're hitting the amp with the same level it would get out of your guitar is to not change that level!

I record all of my guitars through a buffered guitar pedal (usually my Boos GigaDelay nowadays, but most anything that is not True Bypass works) into the Line Inputs on my machines. If you've got such a pedal, you don't have to buy a DI.
 
ashcat_lt said:
...Except that a lot of the Instrument inputs on these interfaces add 9 or 10db of gain (or less attenuation, it's all relative) compared to its line inputs. This can push hotter pickups into clipping the input circuit. That alone is not a huge deal if you're just going to distort the thing at the amp anyway, but the little bit of "purist" left alive in me doesn't love it. Worse, though, is that you then end up having to pad it back down on the way to reamping. ITB amp sims seem to be coded with this bit of boost in mind, but your guitar amp won't sound the same if you send it a signal that's 3 times as loud. Yes, there are plenty of places to adjust that level on the way, but the only way to be sure you're hitting the amp with the same level it would get out of your guitar is to not change that level!

I record all of my guitars through a buffered guitar pedal (usually my Boos GigaDelay nowadays, but most anything that is not True Bypass works) into the Line Inputs on my machines. If you've got such a pedal, you don't have to buy a DI.
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One of my inputs on my zoom has on option to switch from mic/line to hi-z. I was leaving it on hi-z to capture the dry signal but I'll try switching it to mic/line. I'll also figure out which of my pedals isn't true bypass. I have a bunch kicking around so hopefully one of them will fit the bill. It might take some googling...
 
"I record all of my guitars through a buffered guitar pedal (usually my Boos GigaDelay nowadays, but most anything that is not True Bypass works) into the Line Inputs on my machines. If you've got such a pedal, you don't have to buy a DI. "

AFAIK all Boss pedals are buffered. Definitely ALL Blackstar pedals are and if you want gazzillions of headroom and output go for the HT-XX range.

There are of course many other "proper" buffered pedals but I don't know the details.

Dave.
 
" I'll also figure out which of my pedals isn't true bypass"
'S'easy Twang. Just rig the pedal without power, if it passes a signal it is of the daft "true" bypass variety.

Ashcat, you point about added gain is well taken. Many AIs have far too much gain on their high Z inputs and this causes the headroom to be low. This is especially so in AIs that use only USB bus power as supply rails are limited (WTF are we going to get some affordable USB 3.0 AIs? Those extra 400mA will make a huge difference to headrooms and spook juice capabilities, might even get a decently pokey headphone amp!) .

The design is the more silly since there is no need to design for the wimpiest plywood Strat clone to easily hit way over 0dBFS. The gain should be such that a really weak guitar manages just about neg 20 leaving room for the buckers and actives. But! I suspect such things are decided by the marketing men and not the electronics minions!

Dave.
 
Just plug into the instrument input on the interface. The only time that wouldn't be great is if you have active pickups and the interface input doesn't have the headroom to handle it. In that instance, a DI box would be the better way to go.
 
For the most part, if a pedal is True Bypass, the manufacturer will use it as a selling point, and it will probably say so right on the pedal. Otherwise it will definitely be in every scrap of description they create.

The not-super-hot HBs on my SG clone will push the instrument input on my PodUX1 to clipping when I really hit the thing. The super hot GFS rail HBs in my other guitar just slam the thing. With active pickups you can usually turn down the volume without fucking up the tone. Passive guitars always change when you turn that knob.

All that said, it's only a problem if it's a problem. If you're not clipping, you're fine. Even if you are clipping, if your amp is overdriving much at all, you're probably fine. Just remember you might have to turn down a bit before it gets to the amp.
 
ashcat_lt said:
For the most part, if a pedal is True Bypass, the manufacturer will use it as a selling point, and it will probably say so right on the pedal. Otherwise it will definitely be in every scrap of description they create.

The not-super-hot HBs on my SG clone will push the instrument input on my PodUX1 to clipping when I really hit the thing. The super hot GFS rail HBs in my other guitar just slam the thing. With active pickups you can usually turn down the volume without fucking up the tone. Passive guitars always change when you turn that knob.

All that said, it's only a problem if it's a problem. If you're not clipping, you're fine. Even if you are clipping, if your amp is overdriving much at all, you're probably fine. Just remember you might have to turn down a bit before it gets to the amp.
Click to expand...

In addition to the above..."Studios" almost all work on the "unity gain" principle. This basically means that all signal exchanges are done at a standard "Operating Level", almost universally +4dBu about 1 volt rms. If they just hooked things up and tweaked knobs they would be in total, un repeatable ***t in no time!

You can follow a similar procedure here. Plug the guitar into the amp, Set guitar pots to max then adjust the amp's controls for the sort of level and tone you want. Now, when you plug in the re amp signal instead, you adjust THAT, not the amp's controls, to produce the same level as best you can.

Said it before, every home recording jockey should be capably of making a pot in a tin!

This really is NOT rocket science.

Dave.
 
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