Could this be my problem, the interface

  • Thread starter Thread starter mark1971a
  • Start date Start date
It sounds like some of you are audiophiles, you don't think you would benefit from a device that can image a signal?
 
I don't get it. the lol face stuff. I feel like your laughing at me cause I m using mics. That is what musicians do, play live miced instruments.
 
Jimmy...you're such a brute.... ;)

mark

calm down before you get the boot.

We really ARE trying to help you, but your posts come off...."choppy"...like you are only typing half the words that you are thinking of.
You really need to move away from the 'scope view thing, and let's try and sort out what your source is, what it's getting plugged into and how it's getting to the DAW...and what if anything are you doing to it once it's in the DAW.

Greg is just....well, he's just Greg....don't let him fluster you, you'll get use to the LOLs. :D
 
miroslav said:
I kinda understand that you're seeing smooth waves and also jagged ones. I beleive you.

Thing is....what is the source and what is its signal path/chain beofre you look at it?
The only thing that should look like a sine wave on a 'scopre (analog or digital signal)...is a pure tone SINE WAVE.

If you're putting in a guitar track or keyboard tracks or any kind of audio tracks into the scope, YES, they will go up/down like waves but they WILL have sharp peaks and edges in the DAW, not smooth.....because they are not a pure tone sine wave.
So what kind of source signal *exactly* are you looking at in the 'scope...???

Again...you may be looking at one thing and thinking it should be something else and then drawing the wrong conclusion because you are seeing someting third....???
Click to expand...

I did not see this. Okay so what is the third thing Im missing? These are all all miced instruments that are running through the rack pre comp chain, and I take the reading at the imput to the toneport DA. That is normal wavey looking. If I record it on the DAW on scope the out, it is jagged/stepped no wave AT ALL. No vst pluggin fx applied. It sounds dead as it looks recorded in the DAW and output. If I plug the input ( wavey looking) to a headphone amp it sounds normal.

Drums are alsesis synth, whatever. And one clip had a bbe sonic max vst in the master section just to try.
 
mark1971a said:
I blew , you caught me. My apologies, Sir.
Click to expand...

No need to apologize to me mark. I have been told/called worse...

There are many here that give advice. Whether good or bad, you have to listen and take it for what it is worth. Paid price: $00.00.

I made a comment, then bowed out, because I do not have the knowledge to help you. You might want to be careful about blowing tho. This place has some great members who will learn from you, and direct you to what you are looking for. Try not to get offended if someone contradicts what you are saying. It may be the path to finding your answers....
 
Okay, I will try to answer as best as I can. My phone can do internet, so I monitor the post during the day. Kinda cool...or maybe not.


Like gregs I m a freak , in comparison to the jimi page song. You should be able to tell both players are talented, It is recorded so there are no noticeable mistakes. Its the page song that stands out with a clearer signal? Not that you cant jam and crank up , Im a freak. Content and style all secondary. I don't know much about eithers production, and just trying to give you an idea of what I might look for.

Jimmy , is gimme all digital? Anything on that page is real nice.
 
mark1971a said:
It sounds like some of you are audiophiles, you don't think you would benefit from a device that can image a signal?
Click to expand...

I like meters. I'm in no way, um, biased against them. I've used a scope to bias a transistor audio amp stage I built for fun. I've never had to set the bias on a tape deck but I certainly appreciated when HX Pro would back it off slightly on HF peaks so I could get a few more dB above the noise floor. I've watched the scope for many operations, including setting the bias on audio tubes. On the digital metering side I particularly like SSL's X-ISM that indicates likely intersample peaks.

When I digitize cassettes I set the azimuth by ear to the cassette as there's no other way to recover the HF information than to align the head to the tape itself if the original alignment was off. Since I only play back cassettes and never record them I don't really care if the head is officially correct. I'll make it right for the tape I'm transferring.

So, anyway...

I opened all your audio samples in Sound Forge. While I listened I also watched the waveforms in the same way as a scope would show them, with the ability to set the time and amplitude scales. I also had the spectrum analyzer open at the same time. I'm quite familiar with these tools and would instantly recognize many kinds of "wrong". Nothing looked or sounded wrong to me other than minor, fixable mix or tonal issues (direct guitar tone etc.).
 
mark1971a said:
Jimmy , is gimme all digital? Anything on that page is real nice.
Click to expand...

Recording wise, yes. Mic's for snare, bass and guitars are ran through a Vintech X73i on the way in to DAW (Cubase) via Tascam US 1800 line inputs. Vocals were done through the X73i and a vintage dbx 160x. Every other mic was straight through the mic preamps-A/D conversion of a $300 USB2.0 Tascam interface. The amps used are nothing digital. Tube amps and mic'd. The sound is recorded digitally. The playing is not.

And thank you. I like to think I am recording well with my limited knowledge. I learn more everyday. It seems more to do with good players than anything. The Michael Morrow (Gimme) record just happened without trying...

Link from another member who asked for exact recording chain:

LINKhttps://homerecording.com/bbs/user-forums-brand/dont-fear-reaper/usb-hardrive-backups-354767/2/#post4088935
 
Mark - not sure what you are trying to do/fix at this point. I looked through multiple pages where you are referencing wave forms on a scope? yeah, if you take a sine wave generated by the scope or an external device, then put it through a A-to-D converter (audio interface) you will then see a sine wave made up of lots of little stairsteps. The higher your sample rate, the smaller the steps. That's Digital Audio 101.
Your guitar (or any mic-ed instrument/amp or voice) is NOT a pure sinewave. If you are seeing a sinewave when you 'scope' this input, you are not seeing the input, you are seeing something else (the scope's generated signal, maybe?).

The answer is not in putting a scope on your sound to figure out what the problem is.

Not pouring through every page of this thread, did you ever post samples of the tracks 'old-this is what you want' and 'new-digital this is what I get' so we could listen and advise?
 
I am at the beginnings of my digital recording experience. I suppose what your saying could be correct. I did make samples , these clips, but they are just for illustration. I should have just used a single chord being played. No effect. No accompaniment.

I need to prove that , what comes in is what comes out. I have tools to do this. Every other simple recording device in my house, even my phone can do this. It can come out stepped a little bit, fine, normal. This is all waviness removed and a sawtooth pattern replaced. Why doesn't that happen if I record a simple tone to phone, and analyse the mp3 on the scope? I originally thought this was a installation problem.

I am not satisified with the toneport performance. I cannot mix back anything, and reverb is nothing to do with it. I cannot A B the input and toneports output for you.


Room noise is the same 26 db avg
To say put away the scope, is not right.

I need to get the flat( no eq) full signal recorded into the DAW, or as much of it as possible. Other people are obviously doing it.

I would like to thank you guys again for your patience. If I can get over to the mall, I want to look at the Tascam 1800, or motu. Have them demo it at GC.
 
mark1971a said:
I am at the beginnings of my digital recording experience. I suppose what your saying could be correct. I did make samples , these clips, but they are just for illustration. I should have just used a single chord being played. No effect. No accompaniment.

I need to prove that , what comes in is what comes out. I have tools to do this. Every other simple recording device in my house, even my phone can do this. It can come out stepped a little bit, fine, normal. This is all waviness removed and a sawtooth pattern replaced. Why doesn't that happen if I record a simple tone to phone, and analyse the mp3 on the scope? I originally thought this was a installation problem.

I am not satisified with the toneport performance. I cannot mix back anything, and reverb is nothing to do with it. I cannot A B the input and toneports output for you.


Room noise is the same 26 db avg
To say put away the scope, is not right.

I need to get the flat full signal recorded into the DAW, or as much of it as possible. Other people are obviously doing it.
Click to expand...
Not sure if this will help, look at your capture rate. Make sure it is something 16 bit 44.1 or higher. Maybe you have it set to like 8 bit which would degrade the signal. Look at your hardware setup and make sure it is at least 16 (you could go higher), 44.1 (This is CD quality) see if that helps you get closer to what you are expecting.
 
If I click on the asio, there are options to check.

What is latency compensation?

It is set to 44.1khz<>48khz, buffer offset 4ms, no compensation in or out. Buffer size 256, I put the slider in the middle.
 
Mark,
I'm not advocating checking everything with a scope but, out of interest, how are you viewing the digital waveforms?
In the computer? Is it a plug in your DAW, or are you actually scoping an analog output from your audio interface.

The reason I ask is that I don't think a visual representation in a DAW can necessarily be trusted.
I watched a video where a dude recorded an analog sine wave into his computer and viewed it. It showed steps of stairs.
Shock horror! It ruined his audio. :eek:

He ran that runied sine wave back out of the computer through an analog scope and it showed a perfect sine.
The 'problem' was non existent; Nothing got ruined.


I think I said early on, get a guitar, a mic, a cable and a preamp. Record to reel and listen to it. No effects or whatever.
Do exactly the same thing then to your computer. Same gear...line input.

If the difference is staggering, there's a problem.
 
It is being scoped out the phones port of the toneport , after being recorded on DAW for play back.

Another thing I can use the toneport as a guitar amp /pedal simulator. If I scope that gearbox output it is fine. That would tell me it is not the toneport box.

If I was doing midi trance or dance, with my keyboard, I would be the DJ King! It is so clear through the DAW. They have these free vst for midi keyboard, one is oatmeal. You can have random presets with one click, and it is inspiring.

Steen , I will record an A and E chord both ways tonight.
 
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mark1971a said:
It is being scoped out the phones port of the toneport
Click to expand...

And is your reel scoping being taken from a headphone output? If not, I'd keep all things equal.

I can't say for certainty, but I wouldn't be surprised if the headphone amps in budget interfaces were crappy.
 
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