Case of disappearing bass

[cecerre]

Here is something that seems to be plaguing recordings I work on. Bass, when playing upper registers, say, anything above a C on the A string or C on the E (8th fret I think) seems to just disappear from the mix all together. Its like, everything is booming along just fine, then, the musician plays some upper register riff, but alas, its just not there. I don't believe its a problem with the board, I have heard the same problem on other boards in a live sound situation. However, when recording, getting everything on disk is important, I can't figure out what the issue could be. Perhaps its just my ears but I was wondering if anyone had some advice.

Thanks

 

[moresound]

Are you doing any EQ adjustment or dynamic control at all?

 

[BentRabbit]

What kind of room are you recording/monitoring in?

 

[TeyshaBlue]

Sure sounds like node gremlins to me.

 

[moresound]

Sure sounds like node gremlins to me.

Those Bastards!

 

[Farview]

How much midrange are you pushing with that bass. This sort of thing tends to happen when you try to have a bass tone that is all low end. As soon as you get too far above all the frequencies you are pushing, everything goes away.

If you aren't compressing him pretty hard, that could be part of the problem as well.

 

[cecerre]

Moresound - No, no eq. I try and record everything flat, sometimes, depending on the player, some compression, just enough to keep between the lines, so to speak.

BentRabbit - Monitoring is done under a set of headphones, recording, bass, is done direct in. Though, if it helps, the room is about 10 x 10, carpet, no speacial treatments or anything.

Farview - Not pushing anything. Recording is normally done direct or through a simple pre, no EQ, if thats what you are referring to, with little or no compression.

 

[moresound]

And this happens with different bass guitars?

 

[FALKEN]

I am getting the same thing on a mix right now. you will just have to pull the fader up for that part

 

[cecerre]

Moresound - Yes, I have had different players, instruments and genres (Though mostly centered around some form of rock) in for recording. I can't say I ever got a good clear bass line when the musician started riffing in the upper register. Again, it's something I've noticed even out listening and mixing live bands on other equipment. Its devastating to a recording when the riff just sound like its suddenly out of phase or something.

 

[Kingofpain678]

compression and eq.


I picked up an old DBX compressor for like 20 bucks the other day.


Works wonders on bass.

 

[moresound]

Or a little lab's VOG unit!

 

[Chibi Nappa]

Forget compression and EQ. Yes, they could make that upper register audible. But if the source is bad enough that it's not audible to begin with, I doubt the results will be satisfactory after crow-barring the notes into existence with processing.

First of all, put your bass player into a bass amp and mic him up. DI doesn't work much better on bass than it does on guitar. That will likely be most of the battle right there.

Second, how hot is your mix? If you are running out of headroom you could very well have a situation where the bass is hogging up mix real estate making everything else duck and then losing the ducking effect on the "smaller" upper notes. This is unlikely but might as well look at it.

 

[moresound]

the bass is hogging up mix real estate

That comment just struck me funny!

 

[kentheriot]

Here is something that seems to be plaguing recordings I work on. Bass, when playing upper registers, say, anything above a C on the A string or C on the E (8th fret I think) seems to just disappear from the mix all together. Its like, everything is booming along just fine, then, the musician plays some upper register riff, but alas, its just not there. I don't believe its a problem with the board, I have heard the same problem on other boards in a live sound situation. However, when recording, getting everything on disk is important, I can't figure out what the issue could be. Perhaps its just my ears but I was wondering if anyone had some advice.

Thanks

PC - Yup. That happens to me all the time. An not just on the high notes either. Every now and then one single note in the mid-bass range will pop out like it's the only bass note in the mix. Here's what I do to fix it. First, I make a CD or mp3 of the mix so I can hear it in the car and on the ipod. This will hopefully eliminate a bad listening room as the culprit. I take notes on where in the song the bass disappears or pops. Then I go back to the studio (upstairs), turn the volume way down (to minimize the effect of the room) and zoom in on the bass line, watching each note on the screen. Now this may sound low-tech and time consuming (mainly because it is), but it has been absolutely the best way to fix this. When a note pops, I slice that note on the track and manually (mouse-ually?) reduce the volume. I do that for every occurrence. Then I do the reverse for notes that got lost, turning each note up (using the slice method). This usually results in just about every note of the bass line being its own slice, but that actually works in my favor because then I can slide a note left or right to align it with the kick drum, or the grid if it was slightly off in timing.

Compressors only get me so far. Until I am rich enough to afford a great monitoring room, and fantastic high-end compressors and EQ, this manual method works just fine for me.

Hope that helps.

Ken

 

[Farview]

In the mix, add some 800hz and compress the bass pretty hard. That should even it out a bit.

Put the compressor AFTER the EQ.

 

[Armistice]

It's sort of a standard issue for us HRers wot DI electric bass... Chibi's solution is probably the correct one for the reasons he's stated, but if you don't have a bass amp, like I don't, then DI it is and that sort of puts you in the realm of EQ and compression.

Tone selection at the start is useful too - a more "middy" tone helps generally with the cut through thing at all pitch levels, depending upon your genre etc...

Luck!