broke-all-the-rules master

  • Thread starter Thread starter jeffmaher
  • Start date Start date
Its a good tune, but it sounds like its record in a box. Dig the music though.:cool:
 
You were right , David. Went back and checked the EQ graphs....HF's were way down. I goofed. I fixed it. It'll only get so good, though...I got crap gear; but my ears and instincts haven't outgrown it, yet.
 
I love the tune! Makes car rolling nice on the highway :)
I find the rhythm section absolutely solid. You would try to make the vocals sound a little brighter, maybe?
 
It don't sound bad. Nice little song. It's pretty squashed, but I've heard way worse in here. You still have good levels on everything.
 
Yeah...the thing sounds better with the eq fixed...and I might re-sing it...had a cold. I got so excited that I never checked the EQ. Maybe a little flange or something?

But the point is, that I've tried to get that kind of excitement in a master following advice like 'don't squish'....as if every recorded track and compiled work must be a pristine representative of its parent(s) in reality. So I went bonkers going to the other extreme....and the result sound like an old Beatles record from '64...'Twist and Shout' comes to mind......and the thing I'd prefer to do is to have something that makes people want to move, instead of noting what a fine example of clean careful and tasteful recording it is.

And, obviously, the tune is a reference, in part, to early Beatles.

But more, I think this is a sound that will sell my stuff....once I hone it a bit. So I reckon I'm leaving the careful responsible mastering behind, and going Pearl Jam on the limiting and compression and widening and excitement.
I want to convey emotion. This smashup makes it happen. A happy accident!
 
jeffmaher said:
But more, I think this is a sound that will sell my stuff....once I hone it a bit. So I reckon I'm leaving the careful responsible mastering behind, and going Pearl Jam on the limiting and compression and widening and excitement.
I want to convey emotion. This smashup makes it happen. A happy accident!
Click to expand...

Personally, I cant agree, sorry.:o The drums sound terrible, especially the snare. Even the panning is affected, it sounds sort of mono.

Out of curiousity, do you have any nonsmashed versions? I would be interested in doing an a/b.
 
DavidK said:
Personally, I cant agree, sorry.:o The drums sound terrible, especially the snare. Even the panning is affected, it sounds sort of mono.

Out of curiousity, do you have any nonsmashed versions? I would be interested in doing an a/b.
Click to expand...

I agree. It doesn't sound awful, but it's not great. It does sound sort of mono. It most certainly can be much better. Trying to make a soft ditty like this done with intermediate level equipment compete with professionally mastered tracks is a fight you won't win, and your listeners will probably agree. There's nothing wrong with squashing and limiting to "master" a song, but it has to be done tastefully. You shun dynamics, but this is the kind of music that relies on dynamics. It's not a Pearl Jam song. Having everything blasting you in the face doesn't work. I'm not a pristine tracking/dynamic nazi by any means, but don't fall into the loudness trap.
 
I dig it man. I like it when stuff is just a little different than what you're used to hearing all the time.
 
David...I'll re-make the thing very dynamically, and post it in the morning.. Try tweaking the vox a bit. Are you really a LEO?
 
http://download.yousendit.com/994DA42447C78052

This is the same mix...just before I went nutz. [for the requested A/B]

A thought occurred to me. Remember Phil Collins' "In the Air Tonight"? That snare was whack. But every song on the radio for the next couple years was lifting it. Sounded nothing like reality. Genius, when a real engineer does it , and an error otherwise?

A second thought occurred to me [it was a big day!]. I know two guys who make money with their recording. One is a perfectionista...film music symphonies. Great musician. Great, responsible recordist with 20 years at it. He's very careful with his mastering. You guys would love what he does.

The second guy makes metal ditties, and mashes mercilessly....I was present when he finished one....right the the ass threshold. He took a couple lessons at a studio 15 years ago. He uses an electronic drum kit...and pieces together bass and guitar parts Frankenstein-like...he's a drummer. It's the stuff of late-night car commercials. LOUD. OBNOXIOUS. But he's got six publishers, and clients like NASCAR that use his stuff. He'll tell you he doesn't know a lot about recording; but his clients hear excitement. And they license it. He makes a great chunk o' change. You guys would say it's over-loud, compressed-to-death dreck. And it is. And it sells. His publishers send him projects.

Go figure.

Anyway, I'm heading off in the direction of 'new rules'. Careful and responsible and dynamic is not selling. And I prefer the mashed sound on my ditties. Even I find it exciting. And my cheep samples sound a lot better.

Call me the masher. :^)

ps..David...I meant are you a cop. The hat n' all...... I just retired with my 20 last year to be a musician again for tax purposes. I think I'm gonna live a lot longer and happier life. :^)
 
If you think this sounds good enough to sell, then go for it. Good luck.
 
With this statement you win:
"I prefer the mashed sound on my ditties.... my cheap samples sound a lot better."
However, this is because it's YOUR preference.
What sells often smells - not sour grapes, just reality.
We all end up prostituting some degree or aspect of our talent/values/ideals for whatever individual reason/gain/achievment.
Go for it & bon chance but remember that when you post a track in this forum you'll get a range of opinions (that's supposed the purpose of posting), comments & suggestions. What you take from these is up to you but even the things you don't take on should be accepted for what they are with good grace.
 
I have to agree with Greg and David.

I don't hear this "energy" you're talking about, that's supposed to come from this mix/master. I hear a pretty good tune that sounds like it was recorded into a tape recorder in mono. If that's the sound you're going for, then you've accomplished it. But muffled drums and no dynamics doesn't equal "retro, high energy" to me.

But like Greg said, it's not that bad. I wouldn't even be mentioning the "squashed-ness" of it if it wasn't brought up in your original post, because I would have heard this as a not bad, low-budget home recording.

I'm more concerned with the mix, which sounds pretty good. I'd let someone else master it, though.
 
jeffmaher said:
http://download.yousendit.com/994DA42447C78052

This is the same mix...just before I went nutz. [for the requested A/B]
Click to expand...

Its a lot easier to listen to. Its not as grating on the ears. It has a few balance problems but its easier to hear.

ps..David...I meant are you a cop. The hat n' all......
Click to expand...

No, I am a violinist. The picture is Senator Larry Craig.:D

A second thought occurred to me [it was a big day!]. I know two guys who make money with their recording. One is a perfectionista...film music symphonies. Great musician. Great, responsible recordist with 20 years at it. He's very careful with his mastering. You guys would love what he does.

The second guy makes metal ditties, and mashes mercilessly....I was present when he finished one....right the the ass threshold. He took a couple lessons at a studio 15 years ago. He uses an electronic drum kit...and pieces together bass and guitar parts Frankenstein-like...he's a drummer. It's the stuff of late-night car commercials. LOUD. OBNOXIOUS. But he's got six publishers, and clients like NASCAR that use his stuff. He'll tell you he doesn't know a lot about recording; but his clients hear excitement. And they license it. He makes a great chunk o' change. You guys would say it's over-loud, compressed-to-death dreck. And it is. And it sells. His publishers send him projects.

Go figure.

Anyway, I'm heading off in the direction of 'new rules'. Careful and responsible and dynamic is not selling. And I prefer the mashed sound on my ditties. Even I find it exciting. And my cheep samples sound a lot better.
Click to expand...

All this is irrelevant to the spirit of this forum. We arent publishers and dont work for Nascar, we simply help each other make our recordings sound the best they can be. We have no agendas, and want others to help US with plain and simple answers. Selling songs has to do with skill, marketing, image, luck, advertising, labels, radio play, on and on. Compressing a song wont make it sell any more copies.;)
 
jeffmaher said:
http://download.yousendit.com/994DA42447C78052

This is the same mix...just before I went nutz. [for the requested A/B]

A thought occurred to me. Remember Phil Collins' "In the Air Tonight"? That snare was whack. But every song on the radio for the next couple years was lifting it. Sounded nothing like reality. Genius, when a real engineer does it , and an error otherwise?

A second thought occurred to me [it was a big day!]. I know two guys who make money with their recording. One is a perfectionista...film music symphonies. Great musician. Great, responsible recordist with 20 years at it. He's very careful with his mastering. You guys would love what he does.

The second guy makes metal ditties, and mashes mercilessly....I was present when he finished one....right the the ass threshold. He took a couple lessons at a studio 15 years ago. He uses an electronic drum kit...and pieces together bass and guitar parts Frankenstein-like...he's a drummer. It's the stuff of late-night car commercials. LOUD. OBNOXIOUS. But he's got six publishers, and clients like NASCAR that use his stuff. He'll tell you he doesn't know a lot about recording; but his clients hear excitement. And they license it. He makes a great chunk o' change. You guys would say it's over-loud, compressed-to-death dreck. And it is. And it sells. His publishers send him projects.

Go figure.

Anyway, I'm heading off in the direction of 'new rules'. Careful and responsible and dynamic is not selling. And I prefer the mashed sound on my ditties. Even I find it exciting. And my cheep samples sound a lot better.

Call me the masher. :^)

ps..David...I meant are you a cop. The hat n' all...... I just retired with my 20 last year to be a musician again for tax purposes. I think I'm gonna live a lot longer and happier life. :^)
Click to expand...

Denial is a strong drug.


You're kind of weird, man. Sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder because not everybody told you how incredible your "Brokeback rules" mix sounds. Now, you're turning it around with "you guys" this, and "you guys" that. This isn't some isloated segment of society here with mix tastes completely different than the rest of the world.

I'm sure if you present this to 20 different forums, the overwhelming majority would give you the same opinion: "It's way too squashed and sounds like shit compared to how good it CAN sound". But, then I can see you're the kind of guy that would still think everyone's wrong but him.

Good luck with the engineering career.
 
Dude, Jeff, the second clip is infinitely better. There's much more space in the mix and the main vox and backing vox sit together much better. I seriously don't see how you don't hear this as better. :confused:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top