cstockdale
supafly killa homey
Tony Levin.
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Flint Loveless
New member
Jerfo, I guess I have a different idea about music. I heard Dominique Di Piazza's bass Solo on "Marie" and I wasn't impressed. Granted, it sounds freaking' sweet, don't get me wrong, but it's got that "GT3" soundtrack to it. I just don't get a kick out of that kind of music. I love how his lines seem to change every other beat but I just don't like the sound he puts off. Sporadic, it seems to me. Am I making sense? He's very technically amazing, though. I can play like that, however. I guess what I meant by my original question is "Are they're any bassist that are technically amazing that I don't know about" and perhaps it was a foolish question to ask. I just feel that the bass doesn't get enough recognition and it deserves it, DAMN IT! I'am almost embarrassed to tell people I play bass but then I realize that I can play bass better then most people who play guitar.
-Flint
BASS in '08
-Flint
BASS in '08
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Dalius
New member
Tony Levin and Chris Squire for the win!
leddy
Well-known member
Flint Loveless said:
I'm thinking you'll go farther in life if you tone it down a notch. You are what, 19 or 20 years old? Some of the players you are so quick to dismiss have shoes older than you. I've been getting paid to play for as long as you have been alive. Most, if not all, players I know would never hire you, and probably make fun of you to boot if they heard you say shit like you've been saying here (no matter how well you may play).
If you are serious about being a respected player, lose the bravado.
Just trying to help.
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robin watson
New member
Flint Loveless said:
Let's see you play the guitar then. Go on, impress me.
ibanezrocks
New member
I'm not much for bass knowledge, but Tim Commerford from Audioslave and Rage Against the Machine has always impressed me.
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Flint Loveless
New member
Town it down? Why wouldn't they hire me? You don't make any sense. I am 20 years old and why should that matter? If I'm good enough, what's age have to do with anything? Do you also think that you can't marry someone who's 5, 10 or even 20 years older then you are?
I've run across this type of attitude before and I think (not sure) that it has to do something with your own playing. I'm not going as far to say jealousy but I've known a decent amount of people who've picked up the bass and had a real hard time with it. They, who I'm assuming you are like, don't like to talk about themselves much because they don't have a strong sense of talent so they down talk everyone else. I'm not saying that this is true, but the last guy I owned on bass was a guy who played for 9 years and went to collage for it. I've been playing for less then 3 with no schooling.
And I am moving on to classical guitar because I've been told by many people that I need to put my talents to good use... Which, don't get me wrong, I find offensive! I love the bass and I have a hard time picturing myself as a guitarist but I've been knock'n it around and maybe it'll be good for me. I don't see it hurting. It just seems that people choose guitar over bass because it sounds good but the truth is that it isn't hard to play. Anyone who's played any low gauged long neck knows playing slap riffs in 16th's at 140bpm through an entire 3 minute song can prove violent on the ol' fingers.
Am I close with this one?
-Flint
I've run across this type of attitude before and I think (not sure) that it has to do something with your own playing. I'm not going as far to say jealousy but I've known a decent amount of people who've picked up the bass and had a real hard time with it. They, who I'm assuming you are like, don't like to talk about themselves much because they don't have a strong sense of talent so they down talk everyone else. I'm not saying that this is true, but the last guy I owned on bass was a guy who played for 9 years and went to collage for it. I've been playing for less then 3 with no schooling.
And I am moving on to classical guitar because I've been told by many people that I need to put my talents to good use... Which, don't get me wrong, I find offensive! I love the bass and I have a hard time picturing myself as a guitarist but I've been knock'n it around and maybe it'll be good for me. I don't see it hurting. It just seems that people choose guitar over bass because it sounds good but the truth is that it isn't hard to play. Anyone who's played any low gauged long neck knows playing slap riffs in 16th's at 140bpm through an entire 3 minute song can prove violent on the ol' fingers.
Am I close with this one?
-Flint
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Sal4001
New member
Hey Flinty, maybe you SHOULD switch to classical guitar. Your attitude is embarassing. I've been playing bass longer than you've been breathing, and can play circles around 99.999999% of the other bass players out there, but you don't see me bragging about it!!! You're 20? Been playing 3 years? I see you're in Oregon-I bet it's real hard to be as good as you, up there in that musical hotbed. When your only musical competition is a beaver banging on a log, it's pretty easy to brag about what a great player you are. You're embarassed to tell people you play bass? I'm embarassed that you think you're a bass player!!!!! Lose the 'tude, and maybe you can find people who can tolerate you long enough to let you get some musical experience, and maybe you'll go far in life..........................peace
Chris Squire
John Entwhistle
Geddy Lee
Steve Harris
Jaco
Jack Bruce
Willie Dixon
Me
Chris Squire
John Entwhistle
Geddy Lee
Steve Harris
Jaco
Jack Bruce
Willie Dixon
Me
G
G. Simon
New member
Wow - This is GREAT!!!!
I was thinking a lot of these things about Mr. 'Hey Nineteen' (that's a reference to an obscure 70s NYC jazz-rock band called 'Steely Dan'), and then a number of you started posting them!
Thank you - I find the middle school tone embarrassing, as well. What's next? " Hey I bet none of you can fart arpeggios over the circle of fifths like me"...
I was thinking a lot of these things about Mr. 'Hey Nineteen' (that's a reference to an obscure 70s NYC jazz-rock band called 'Steely Dan'), and then a number of you started posting them!
Thank you - I find the middle school tone embarrassing, as well. What's next? " Hey I bet none of you can fart arpeggios over the circle of fifths like me"...
leddy
Well-known member
G. Simon said:
Steely Dan is not really obscure, but speaking of them - Chuck Rainey's bass playing on those albums is incredible. Check him out: http://www.chuckrainey.com/
J
jerfo
Member
I respect that. Every person has his or her own musical preferences. However, I hope that you can appreciate its technical merits.Flint Loveless said:
Do you have any soundclips of your playing? If you really can play like that, you've got quite a gift! We'd all love to hear what you can do. I have to admit that I'm skeptical. When you make statements like "I love how his lines seem to change every other beat," it implies to me that you really don't comprehend the tonic modulations / chord substitutions that he's constantly using throughout the piece. Without that harmonic knowledge, it's impossible to "play like that."Flint Loveless said:
Harmony, groove, and feel are probably more important to being a good bass player than pure "chops." That's why I could listen all day to a guy like Tony Levin, who is not the most technical player, than to a player like Billy Sheehan (sorry, ermghoti), who has chops up the wazoo but who doesn't play with much groove or melodicism.
I think that we can all agree with this statement. I'm a guitar player by trade, but I can't tell you how much I appreciate a good bass player. However, you yourself may want to give some recognition to the guys whom you dismissed at the beginning of the thread, like Les Claypool and Victor Wooten. Both are highly visible players who have brought loads of recognition to the instrument.Flint Loveless said:
- Jerfo
leddy
Well-known member
Sal4001 said:
lol
..............
J
jerfo
Member
I think that he was being sarcastic with the "obscure" comment, but at least it was a good excuse to bring up Chuck Rainey's name. He does some fantastic work on albums like "The Royal Scam" and "Aja." The song "Peg" is a great example of combining chops, taste, and groove into a single entity. Speaking of SD bassists, I've always thought that Anthony Jackson's contributions on "Gaucho" were highly underrated.leddy said:
I'm very impressed with a lot of the contributions in this thread. Folks have mentioned a lot of great players from a lot of different genres.
- Jerfo
G
G. Simon
New member
Zen and the Art of the Fretless J-Bass
I agree that there are many uninspired bass players (frustrated guitarists?), and for those of us who like to go 'the other way', it's hard to hear that 'less is more'. So, I can see where many of us seek out those who take the roads less travelled.
I think it's that ever-elusive balance between chops, expressiveness, and theoretical grounding that my favorite bassists ultimately seek in their playing. Blowin' yer wad constantly over every verse just seems more about 'look at me, look at me' and less about what I would consider to be real musicianship.
-- Glenn
ps: Funny that Flint mentioned classical guitar. I actually started there as a kid 30 years ago. After a few years, upon discovering rock music (as well as the increased attention received from the girls of my junior high), I discovered how easy it was to transfer much of the right-hand rest stroke over to the bass. That grounding in the classical guitar literature by Sor, Bach, Carcassi, and Ponce (along w/the theoretical understanding that goes with it) was totally valuable to me as a musician.
I agree that there are many uninspired bass players (frustrated guitarists?), and for those of us who like to go 'the other way', it's hard to hear that 'less is more'. So, I can see where many of us seek out those who take the roads less travelled.
I think it's that ever-elusive balance between chops, expressiveness, and theoretical grounding that my favorite bassists ultimately seek in their playing. Blowin' yer wad constantly over every verse just seems more about 'look at me, look at me' and less about what I would consider to be real musicianship.
-- Glenn
ps: Funny that Flint mentioned classical guitar. I actually started there as a kid 30 years ago. After a few years, upon discovering rock music (as well as the increased attention received from the girls of my junior high), I discovered how easy it was to transfer much of the right-hand rest stroke over to the bass. That grounding in the classical guitar literature by Sor, Bach, Carcassi, and Ponce (along w/the theoretical understanding that goes with it) was totally valuable to me as a musician.
E
ermghoti
New member
jerfo said:
Nothing wrong with that, J. The kid was looking for a meedlymeedlymeeedly bass player, and that's the first one that sprang to mind.
G
G. Simon
New member
ermghoti said:
love it..
J
jerfo
Member
I believe that Zappa used to refer to it as "spoo."G. Simon said:
- Jerfo
leddy
Well-known member
Flint Loveless said:
Because you make silly, immature statements where you try to stroke your own ego and diminish the talents of others. Most folks don't like people who do that. No matter what you do in life, be it music, plumbing, truck driving, law, medicine, etc., your professional opportunities will be limited if you come off like a jerk.
Flint Loveless said:
Because you are inexperienced. Period. Experiences change and educate people. Your lack of experience shows in your statements. If you were a 20 year old with 1,000 gigs under his belt with dozens of different professional players, then your age would not matter...but you're not. If you were, you would not make immature, uneducated statements.
Flint Loveless said:
Perhaps I came off a bit crass, but I was trying to help. I can assure you that you have nothing for me to be jealous of. I don't even play electric bass. Being twice your age and probably a 1,000 - 2,000 gigs past you, I thought I'd pass on some advice.
Sounds like you don't need it.
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Bassman Brad
New member
Hey Flint,
First of all, I should say I am another of those people here who have literally been playing bass longer than you have been alive. I should also mention that I personally find your attitude rather refreshing. Heck, I can remember when I was 20, and thought I knew everything there was to know about the bass (and everything else for that matter). Ah, the sweet insanity of youth!
However, as soon as I started playing music professionally, to support myself, I learned that having monster chops totally doesn't matter. Playing bass is NOT about being able to play impressive licks, it is about learning to play exactly what is appropriate for a given song -- nothing more, nothing less. In fact, when I started to do a lot of studio work, I developed a style of playing (exclusively for use in the studio) that could only be called "minimalistic." You would probably be surprised how many notes can be cut from a bass line, once you start asking yourself, "O.K. Now which of these notes actually HAS to be there, and which ones can go?"
You have been given some very good advice here, Flint. For example, the person who told you that you probably wouldn't be hired in a band due to your attitude is absolutely correct. When I was playing bass to support myself, I HAD to learn how to get and keep gigs. It was a matter of survival. If I didn't play, I didn't eat. And I can tell you that I took a lot of gigs away from other bass players who had astounding technique, but were just impossible to work with. Either they had such a humongous egos that the other band members just couldn't stand the guy as a person, or the dude would think that every measure of every song was supposed to be a bass solo, and would overplay to a ridiculous degree. You will go a lot further if you learn to keep the ego in check, and learn to play what the song NEEDS, not the riffs that show off your technical virtuosity.
My advice to you would be to study the work of the true masters of the bass, some of which have been mentioned here. Not just the ones with virtuoso-like playing skills, such as Jaco and Victor Wooten, but you should ESPECIALLY make a point of listening to those who played incredibly simple bass parts, but are STILL considered to be masters of the art. Try some of the old school groove guys like James Jamerson or Donald "Duck" Dunn, for example. And, when you do listen to people like Jaco and Victor, who can certainly play with some "flash" when they want to, listen to how they make the bass parts work in the context of the song. I personally feel that Jaco's best work, for example, was his stuff with Joni Mitchell. He is not playing anything flashy or difficult on those gigs. But it's just oh so perfect that it's positively sublime. Even when he's showing off some of his technical skills, such as some of the Weather Report stuff, he always plays exactly what the song calls for. He is NOT showing off for showing off's sake. And THAT, my young friend, is truly what separates the men from the boys in playing bass, not the technical skill that you bring to the table.
Lots of luck with your musical ventures!
First of all, I should say I am another of those people here who have literally been playing bass longer than you have been alive. I should also mention that I personally find your attitude rather refreshing. Heck, I can remember when I was 20, and thought I knew everything there was to know about the bass (and everything else for that matter).
Ah, the sweet insanity of youth!However, as soon as I started playing music professionally, to support myself, I learned that having monster chops totally doesn't matter. Playing bass is NOT about being able to play impressive licks, it is about learning to play exactly what is appropriate for a given song -- nothing more, nothing less. In fact, when I started to do a lot of studio work, I developed a style of playing (exclusively for use in the studio) that could only be called "minimalistic." You would probably be surprised how many notes can be cut from a bass line, once you start asking yourself, "O.K. Now which of these notes actually HAS to be there, and which ones can go?"
You have been given some very good advice here, Flint. For example, the person who told you that you probably wouldn't be hired in a band due to your attitude is absolutely correct. When I was playing bass to support myself, I HAD to learn how to get and keep gigs. It was a matter of survival. If I didn't play, I didn't eat. And I can tell you that I took a lot of gigs away from other bass players who had astounding technique, but were just impossible to work with. Either they had such a humongous egos that the other band members just couldn't stand the guy as a person, or the dude would think that every measure of every song was supposed to be a bass solo, and would overplay to a ridiculous degree. You will go a lot further if you learn to keep the ego in check, and learn to play what the song NEEDS, not the riffs that show off your technical virtuosity.
My advice to you would be to study the work of the true masters of the bass, some of which have been mentioned here. Not just the ones with virtuoso-like playing skills, such as Jaco and Victor Wooten, but you should ESPECIALLY make a point of listening to those who played incredibly simple bass parts, but are STILL considered to be masters of the art. Try some of the old school groove guys like James Jamerson or Donald "Duck" Dunn, for example. And, when you do listen to people like Jaco and Victor, who can certainly play with some "flash" when they want to, listen to how they make the bass parts work in the context of the song. I personally feel that Jaco's best work, for example, was his stuff with Joni Mitchell. He is not playing anything flashy or difficult on those gigs. But it's just oh so perfect that it's positively sublime. Even when he's showing off some of his technical skills, such as some of the Weather Report stuff, he always plays exactly what the song calls for. He is NOT showing off for showing off's sake. And THAT, my young friend, is truly what separates the men from the boys in playing bass, not the technical skill that you bring to the table.
Lots of luck with your musical ventures!
Incanus
Nerd-man
Well, some ass tried to give me negative rep for my simple list earlier in this thread and said I was a retard for liking the music of Primus and RHCP.
I suspect it was the thread starter, but since it was unsigned, I can't prove it.
You asked for opinions on 'bassists that rock'. I gave a few opinions in the form of a list. What's the problem? You don't have to agree with me or anyone else who has posted here, but you asked for opinions.
If I read you right, out of all the great bass players brought up here, you are the only one who really 'rocks'. You're going to have to put your money where your mouth is, dude. Anyone can say that they are great. Doesn't mean shit, does it? Lets HEAR what you've got. There is an mp3 mixing clinic on this bbs. Post some music there. It better be dazzling fantastic, jaw-dropping good. Otherwise, shut up.
I strongly suspect you are the fool you appear to be, but I'd be happy to retract all my statements the moment you prove me wrong. Until then. . .
I suspect it was the thread starter, but since it was unsigned, I can't prove it.
You asked for opinions on 'bassists that rock'. I gave a few opinions in the form of a list. What's the problem? You don't have to agree with me or anyone else who has posted here, but you asked for opinions.
If I read you right, out of all the great bass players brought up here, you are the only one who really 'rocks'. You're going to have to put your money where your mouth is, dude. Anyone can say that they are great. Doesn't mean shit, does it? Lets HEAR what you've got. There is an mp3 mixing clinic on this bbs. Post some music there. It better be dazzling fantastic, jaw-dropping good. Otherwise, shut up.
I strongly suspect you are the fool you appear to be, but I'd be happy to retract all my statements the moment you prove me wrong. Until then. . .