Basic Digital Home Recording Setup - For Little $$$

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mesboogie

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This may have been addressed before, but bear with me--I am new at this.

I just bought a copy of Guitar Tracks to record songs on my computer. I'm a novice guitarist at best but would like to get some quality recording nonetheless without spending a bunch of cash. The soundcard in my computer (Dell P3 600 w/256MB RAM & a 20GB 7200 RPM hard drive) is a Turtle Beach Montego.

My guitar is a 57 Reissue Strat, and my amp is a Mesa/Boogie Subway Rocket. I've tried running my amp's recording output into the amp, but it sounds like crap.

Ultimately, my question is this: What do I need, given what I have, to be able to lay down decent guitar tracks, vocals, and possibly add some others sounds electronically (bass/drums)? Do I need a mixer between the instruments and the soundcard (yeah--I know a better soundcard would help)? What is a good all-around mike (Shure SM57?).

Thanks for your help in advance. I've hesitated in posting this for a while as I've tried to figure out how to get a decent sound with my setup.

-MesBoogie
 
Don't know what a subway rocket is, but anyway. Yeah, you want some kind of mic, and some type of preamp. Using these 2 devices you should be able to achieve a better sound. Montego is probably not a bad sound card, being turtle beach. So, preamp or mixer - many to choose from, whats your budget? Mic, yeah a 57 will do the trick.
 
A Subway Rocket is a Mesa/Boogie 22W Combo Amp with four -12AX7 preamp tubes and 2 EL-84 power tubes powering a 10" speaker. Pretty nice amp, but noisy.

Is there anything that I need to be aware of when lining into the soundcard? I've heard something about impedance mismatch. I was thinking about buying a POD. Do you know if a vocal mike can be run through it with any success?

Would I benefit greatly by picking up a small mixer instead of using the software mixer provided with the Guitar Tracks software?

Thanks!

-MesBoogie
 
Budget? As little as possible at this point. I'm hoping to spend less than $500 on the missing elements (preamp/mixer/mike/etc)

-Mesboogie
 
You want a preamp if you are planning on micing. Preamp in the form of a mixer, or a dedicated standalone type.

$200 will get you an Art preamp and a SM57. A few hundred more($700) and you could get an even better setup.

The software mixer is only after the fact. This is assuming you have got a decent signal into it, in the first place.
 
Mesboogie,

How about direct recording. I am recently looking into buying a Voodoo Labs CABTONE. As i understand it, much cheaper than a pod, and it yields good tones for recording. Look into it!

El Tipo
 
Pod

I would recommend getting a Pod, unless you absolutely love the sound of your amp, but of course, you could go and try a Pod and like it more than your amp.

One thing to keep in mind is that the Pod is not limited to what you see on the front panel, it comes with software that lets you hook up the Pod to your comp (which would be perfect for your setup) and change things like: bright switch, gate threshold/decay, presence, delay time, reverb type/decay/tone/diffusion/density/level, etc. etc.

Bottom line? Pod is an extremely flexible (more so than my girlfriend. well... maybe not THAT flexible) recording tool for guitarists.
 
The POD is great for its simplicity. It's just SO easy to setup and there are so many tones hiding in there!

But, be warned. The more you use the POD, the more you'll be "suprised" when you hear a good amp. That is, the POD sounds great, until you compare it to a real fender blackface cranked to 11. :) Seriously. For a while I was absolutely amazed by the POD...for months in fact...and while it still sounds way better than my junky Peavy amp, it doesn't have the big sound of a real amp.

Get a POD if:

1) You want a lot of different tones and cannot afford a lot of different amps...or even ONE amp.

2) You ever want to record after hours or in a location where you can't make much noise.

3) You're in a location where there's a lot of background noise.

4) You need a plug-n-play tool...something simple that you can plug in and start using immediately.

5) You want a tool that can make big fat mesa boogie sounds with little hassle. The POD does a great job at the heavy stuff in my opinion.

6) You want a practice gadget that sounds awesome in headphones.

Don't get a POD if:

1) You're looking to recaptures some vintage tube amp sound.

2) You're expecting some great effects.

3) You're thinking of using it as a preamp. Yes it *works*, and even has a "tube preamp" setting that sounds like absolute shit.

If I were you I'd start by getting a microphone and a good mic preamp. No matter how loudly you sing, the POD is not a microphone :) And it's not a good preamp either. Besides the fact that it's very noisy, it just doesn't sound *great* with anything but a guitar plugged into it.

You might consider spending $200 on a ART Dual Tube MP (the single channel tube MP for $100 is small, clumbsy, has no power switch, and loves being stepped on as it sits on the floor...and then look for mics. You can rent microphones from your music store...usually 5 bucks a day...and sometimes they'll apply the rental fee to the purchase price if you decide to buy it. An SM57 is a good mic cause it's cheap and indestructable and works well on a guitar amp. It's not much on vocals or on an acoustic though.

That would leave you with about $250 of your $500 budget. You can probably find a used POD for that. I really think you'll want a microphone though unless you're sticking to guitar instrumentals...so do shop for mics before you shop for guitar gadgets.

Disclaimer: I am a complete amature at recording. I started out with a cheap amp and an SM57 and an ART Tube MP (the "crap i stepped on it again" model) and then bought a POD several months ago. The above opinions are from my personal experience.

Anyway, welcome to the club. Be prepared to never be satisfied :)

Slackmaster 2000
 
I picked up a Behringer 8 Channel mixer last night on ebay. From what I've been able to research, a stand-alone mic preamp or a mixer with a preamp is highly recommended. Since I wanted to get a small mixer anyway, I'm killing two birds with one stone. I've heard mixed reviews on Behringer products; although the majority are very positive when one considers the cost/features/value ratio. If the choice was between an SM-57 and SM-58 for recording instruments and vocals, which one gets the nod? I don't want to spend a ton of cash on microphones.

I do want to get a POD for the guitar. I'll probably try to pick up a used one on ebay. Practically everything I own musically is second-hand. It seems many buy musical equipment on impulse and then change there minds. I'll gladly free a person of their unwanted musical equipment is the price is right.

Thanks for the input. More is appreciated!!

-MesBoogie
 
I'm sure you're kidding as there are currently around five used ones for sale on ebay.

Unfortunately, my wife will not go for me buying one right now. I'm hoping to pull it off at Christmas. Last year I picked up a few used effects pedals off ebay for Christmas. I'd rather buy stuff used than new. You can get a much better deal, and thus far I've had no problems with the items I've purchased.

-MesBoogie
 
mesboogie,

One of the dumbest debates of the century has to be "what is the difference between the SM57 and the SM58"...not because the question itself is dumb, but because of the wide array of answers you'll get.

Without getting into it, the difference is basically that the SM58 was designed to be a vocal microphone. It has some bass rolloff allowing you to get right up into the microphone and sing. (get right up into an SM57 and say "puh puh puh" rather loudly...you'll notice a "booming" sound that's less than desirable. Move back a few inches and notice how the "booming" sound decreases drastically. The SM58's design compensates for this proximity effect, allowing you to get right up and slobber all over it's ball...kinky)

I believe that the concensus is that it is the design of the windscreen on the SM58 that gives it this characteristic...and supposedly brightens its midrange response. At any rate, you'll often hear people say, "dude, the SM58 is just an SM57 with a $20 windscreen!" That's true, but the implication is false.

I have an SM57. I've found that it's possible to use it as a vocal microphone as long as I use a pop filter. I've also used a Beta 58 which I would describe as a really loud SM57 that I could sing into without a pop filter.

If I were you I'd get a 58 before a 57 simply because you'll be singing into it, especially if you're getting a POD. You can still use it for instruments too and you'll get results similar to a 57. But neither is going to do anything for your voice unless you're a screaming punk rocker. And now we've come to the border of "friggin expensive vocal microphone land"....

Here are some links:

http://www.shure.com/catrecording.html
http://www.homerecording.com/mics.html

Slackmaster 2000
 
Thanks for the mic info. I'd read through some of that stuff before. After reading your thoughtful response, I think I'll try to hunt down a used SM58.

If you'll allow me to further pick your brain...

When I get the SM58, all I should need to get is an XLR cable to connect the the Behringer Mixer that I just purchased via ebay--correct? Anything special I should know regarding using this setup to recording into my pc's sound card (see original message).

Thanks!

-MesBoogie (34 year old amateur)
 
If the mixer has preamped XLR mic inputs then you're set. Just go buy a mic cable. To hook the mixer up to your soundcard you'll need the proper cable as well. Your soundcard's line in will be a 1/8" stereo plug and the line out or monitor out or whatever on your mixer might be, say, RCA. So you'd need a stereo RCA to 1/8" cable. Pretty simple...just buy a wire with the right thingies on the ends :)

P.S. make sure that you're really taking a LINE out of the mixer. Don't send a big signal into your soundcard!

Oh, and check the main homerecording site. It's kinda hard to navigate but there's a lot of basic setup information that can get you started! http://www.homerecording.com

Slackmaster 2000
 
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