rob aylestone
Moderator
This one explains how I created another of the songs - obviously the actual vocal is just a guide and was not used in the actual shows.
Papanate
Well-known member
What do you do these songs for? Do you know how many tracks of vocals the Carpenters used? It doesn’t sound like either one of them of the background vocals except for Karen kind of comes through I think.
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rob aylestone
Moderator
Think tribute acts - this was actually an aborted one. We were ready to go and the 'Karen' suddenly announced she was pregnant and was dropping out. She sounded quite similar in tone, but of course not the sound of the real Karen Carpenter. As we had shows booked, I found a replacement who doesn't sound like Karen, but for the tributes the music is so well known, absolute authenticity is not actually needed. Not sure if the US has the same demand for tributes, but it's very strong business here. Over the next six months we have Tina Turner, Michael Jackson, Beatles, Whitney, abba and Queen shows all touring into my venue.
There are a few available books that purport to be the carpenter's arrangements, but they're full of errors. The system we do is to break the songs down into two bar sections and then with a keyboard, loop the two bars and listen for what is on the original release, until you identify every note that is sounding, who's voice it is, and where in the soundfield it is. We discovered very early on that they recorded the same things twice, and panned them left and right - sort of 'opened up' double tracking. Sometimes, she would even change how she pronounced words, or put emphasis on different syllables. Sometimes in the two bars, one of us would suddenly bash the keys and say - there's a F sharp in there, and sure enough, there it would be - then you had to work out where it came from. Sometimes, Richard would sing Karen's line for added texture and she would sing very low too, doing the same thing for him. The cleverness of it all really came through after listening this intently.
For simplicity, the dozens of tracks would be sent out as stems - so usually two stereo BVs - male and female, coming up on two channels. We had all the band recorded, and could shrink or grow the band depending on funding. Typically, keys, bass, guitar and drums - with the rest on the track, but sometimes the sax would be a real player doubling flute. If we lost say, the bass player, instead of a dep, we'd unmute the bass track. We did a couple of shows, and it fell apart - the singer wanted to do other things and the keys player died! He was the same guy in our Beach Boy tribute, so that was two shows that simply stopped.
There's a clearer breakdown of the parts in this video here
There are a few available books that purport to be the carpenter's arrangements, but they're full of errors. The system we do is to break the songs down into two bar sections and then with a keyboard, loop the two bars and listen for what is on the original release, until you identify every note that is sounding, who's voice it is, and where in the soundfield it is. We discovered very early on that they recorded the same things twice, and panned them left and right - sort of 'opened up' double tracking. Sometimes, she would even change how she pronounced words, or put emphasis on different syllables. Sometimes in the two bars, one of us would suddenly bash the keys and say - there's a F sharp in there, and sure enough, there it would be - then you had to work out where it came from. Sometimes, Richard would sing Karen's line for added texture and she would sing very low too, doing the same thing for him. The cleverness of it all really came through after listening this intently.
For simplicity, the dozens of tracks would be sent out as stems - so usually two stereo BVs - male and female, coming up on two channels. We had all the band recorded, and could shrink or grow the band depending on funding. Typically, keys, bass, guitar and drums - with the rest on the track, but sometimes the sax would be a real player doubling flute. If we lost say, the bass player, instead of a dep, we'd unmute the bass track. We did a couple of shows, and it fell apart - the singer wanted to do other things and the keys player died! He was the same guy in our Beach Boy tribute, so that was two shows that simply stopped.
There's a clearer breakdown of the parts in this video here
Slouching Raymond
Well-known member
For some reason, I got 'An Error Occurred, Please Try Later', on both the videos, and quite a few other referenced videos lately.
I'm on Linux.
I'm on Linux.
rob aylestone
Moderator
Hmm .. UK vs US youtube maybe? This ones has more breakdowns of the harmonies in goodbye to love.
DrewPeterson7
Sage of the Order
Not really a Carpenters fan but there's probably a decent amount that could be learned about arrangement from the process of deconstructing an existing arrangement - I'll try to come back to this on a slow day.
If this is a space you work in much, ever worked with Sally Olsen? Headlines a - again, not my scene, but I understand award-winning and rather good - Carpenters tribute show in Vegas. We went to college together, I only knew her casually then, but was pretty good friends with one of her suitemates.
If this is a space you work in much, ever worked with Sally Olsen? Headlines a - again, not my scene, but I understand award-winning and rather good - Carpenters tribute show in Vegas. We went to college together, I only knew her casually then, but was pretty good friends with one of her suitemates.