An even bigger holy fucking shit. Davisound as a company really exsists!!!!!!!!

[Gidge]

"eBay does permit pre-sales on a limited basis, as long as the seller guarantees that the item will be available for shipping within 30 days from the date of purchase (i.e., the day the listing ends or the date the item is purchased from a store front listing)."

 

[Dot]

RE, of course there's a side of me that's intrigued - especially because I'm working on TLS and I'm knee-deep in mic pres and the SC connection. And you're certainly right that trying first-hand is the only way to go.

One of the things I enjoy most about reviewing gear is being able to shine a light on lesser known designers and products.

That's a very generous offer. I'll contact you privately.

 

[regebro]

On the contrary, DaviSound's website is the way it is BECAUSE they're trying to give some REAL education...

So you mean it's a confused jumble of undecodable information and bad design because he want's to educate his customers?

In that case I think he should stop trying, if it results in a website which is understandable and navigatable.

No, enough sarcasm! Obviously, the website is like it is because he can't make websites. He has absolutley no clue of how to do it. And what I mean with hiim getting management, is that any kind of reasonbly good manager would realize that teh website sucks, and pay somebopdy to do it instead. Then Mr Davisound himself could concentrate on building the goods and shipping it, and he would get more money, and happier customers, AND have a website that isn't unintelligable.

But of course I realize that this would cause all his customers to run screaming away and buy behringer instead. Oops, I got sarcastic again. Sorry.

 

[Recording Engineer]

Well since you obviously see yourself as authority on web design and management, trying to reason with you is about as useless as trying to reason with Outlaws with all his hostility he's displayed... How's about that for sarcasm? Or was it?

 

[regebro]

I don't know about authority, but since I make web management systems for a living, I do like to think I know a little bit about web management, yes.

And honestly, RE, do you really thing his webpages look good and are easily navigatable? Say for example that you have heard from a friend that Davisounds mic pres are the bees knees. If you go to that web page, where do you find the mic pres? Where do you find an overview over which mic pres he has?

What you need to do is to first klick on "toolboxes" which doesnät exactly sound like "preamps" or "products" does it? Then you have to read, or skip, down over a long text discussing design philosophy and pinouts. And then you have all the products, one after another on the same page. Compressors mixed in between preamps, and things called preamps but "inner tubes" who's function is not exactly clear, and stuff like that.

The whole webpage is like an opaque blob which you need tospend loads of time to dissect to find the information you need.

It sucks. Completely.

It's not the worst sire I have ever seen, because it do contain information. The worst sites caim the do, and then you can never find any information at all.

But it still sucks.

Does realizing this make me impossible to argue with? Yes, if you want to argue that their webpage is great, easy to navigata and looks fantastic, then you gonna have trouble arguing for that. In fact, I would only laugh at you if you did, because I can't believe that you would be of this opinion.

If you want to argue that a crappy webpage makes no difference, then you would have an easier time to argue. You may be right. I, however, am if the opinion that a good webpage surely is not a drawback, and is not more expensive to get than a crappy one.

And if you want to argue that a good webpage is a bad thing (which seems to be what you are saying) then you would need somearguments for that. Just claiming that I am not open for arguments is not an argument. It's just avoiding to present arguments, that's what it is.

 

[jslator]

If you want to argue that a crappy webpage makes no difference, then you would have an easier time to argue. You may be right. I, however, am if the opinion that a good webpage surely is not a drawback, and is not more expensive to get than a crappy one.

But Regbro, he hand-builds audio equipment. Therefore, his website could not possibly be bad. Nor could he possibly be considered to have delayed delivery of a product beyond reason or have failed to communicate a delivery date properly. And, further, anyone who questions anything about Mr. Davisound, his business practices, his policies, his website or his E-Bay auctions is not to be trusted. Such a person is necessarily a liar and a scoundrel. After all, Mr. Davisound can do no wrong because he HAND-BUILDS AUDIO EQUIPMENT!

There's no point in trying to reason with anyone who doesn't understand that.

(How's that for sarcasm?)

 

[jet-rocker]

(How's that for sarcasm?)

You're mean. I'm telling.

-Jtt

 

[Recording Engineer]

regebro,

You fail to realize that DaviSound has designed their website NOT as a site to easily browse-around, in search for something specific; at least NOT on initial few visit. They want you to read the ENTIRE website, in a specific order... In the order things come-up... I've mentioned this on more than one occasion.

And I see it BOTH ways, as far as THAT being a wise or not so wise move... But quite frankly, more than likely, it's those who are interested enough to read the entire site that are the ones who are more inclined to appreciate and eventually purchase their gear.

In all honesty, as far as navigation, those who are genuinely interested, have browsed and read a good portion of the site on quite a few occasions, that they quickly figure-out and remember where everything is.

Has it ever occured to you that THAT is how DaviSound wants their website... NOT because they CAN'T come-up with their own "typical" website, or at the very least, pay someone like you to do such a thing?

Their website DOES represent all that is DaviSound! MOST DEFINTELY NOT your typical gear. MOST DEFINTELY NOT your typical company. MOST DEFINITELY NOT your typical website! MOST DEFINTELY NOT your typical point-of-views.

And me, being someone who intially came to know DaviSound exclusively through their website, without ANY recommendation from ANYONE, nor finding ANYONE who had EVER dealt with DaviSound what-so-ever themselves or them even knowing of ANYBODY, they CERTAINLY caught MY interest right off the bat, enough for me to read their ENTIRE website and evetually buy my first piece of gear from them.


And jslator,

Thus far, it's YOU who's really been the most unreasonable, when it come to DaviSound, in order to have a honest conversation with. All the sarcasm gone!

 

[jslator]

And jslator,

Thus far, it's YOU who's really been the most unreasonable, when it come to DaviSound, in order to have a honest conversation with.

Huh? What have I said that was unreasonable?

If we're voting for "most unreasonable", I'd have to go with csus7 who raves about how outstanding the Davisound pre's are and strongly recommends them to people, when by his own admission he has never even tried one (or heard one).

 

[regebro]

You fail to realize that DaviSound has designed their website NOT as a site to easily browse-around, in search for something specific; at least NOT on initial few visit. They want you to read the ENTIRE website, in a specific order...

Well, that just once again tells me that they have absolutely no fucking idea of what they are doing.

Why the hell do they want me to read about pinouts before I come to the products? I know enoough about pinouts to know that I don't have to read that until I actually HAVE the product. And why should I be forced to read about "inner tubes" and compressors before I come to preamps, if it is the preamps I'm intersted in?

And I see it BOTH ways, as far as THAT being a wise or not so wise move... But quite frankly, more than likely, it's those who are interested enough to read the entire site that are the ones who are more inclined to appreciate and eventually purchase their gear.

So, once again, you imply that unless you like the fact that their website is crappy, you won't like their products. Very strange indeed. To me that sounds like only people with no critical eye who are able to enjoy that badly things by calling it "special" will enjoy their products. I don't think that is what you are trying to say, but that is what it sounds like.

In all honesty, as far as navigation, those who are genuinely interested, have browsed and read a good portion of the site on quite a few occasions, that they quickly figure-out and remember where everything is.

You shouldn't need to figure out and remember where it is. There is no need to. There is NOTHING on that sire that prevents it from being done in a proper way, where you can find information easily the first time.
The fact that you NEED to figure out and remember where the information is is in itself proof that the web site design is a failure. And you don't have to take my word for that. You can ask ANY web-design guru/expert/teacher/whatever, and they will say the same thing.

Has it ever occured to you that THAT is how DaviSound wants their website... NOT because they CAN'T come-up with their own "typical" website, or at the very least, pay someone like you to do such a thing?

Yes, it has on svereal occations occured to me that they want their website to drive away potential customers who are not worthy of buying their products. It has occurd to me because you keep repeating that this is how it is. And I still think that is stupid, and a bad business policy.

Their website DOES represent all that is DaviSound! MOST DEFINTELY NOT your typical gear. MOST DEFINTELY NOT your typical company. MOST DEFINITELY NOT your typical website! MOST DEFINTELY NOT your typical point-of-views.

Blablabla, yes, you have said this before. You still can't come up woth any good arguments to why "non-typical" has to mean "bad" when it comes to web sites.

And me, being someone who intially came to know DaviSound exclusively through their website, without ANY recommendation from ANYONE, nor finding ANYONE who had EVER dealt with DaviSound what-so-ever themselves or them even knowing of ANYBODY, they CERTAINLY caught MY interest right off the bat, enough for me to read their ENTIRE website and evetually buy my first piece of gear from them.

And yet again you imply that only the people who are worthy are allowed to buy stuff from Davisound. And you claim that this is their business practice, and that it is intentional. I have no way of telling of you are right, but you may very well be. I still don't see in what way that is good business practice.

 

[Recording Engineer]

regebro,

Please, I'm begging you, do not turn what was becoming a reasonable and respectable conversation between us, into crap again; as some of your comments in your last reply are degressive.

I will reply when I get the time.

Weston Ray
Weston House Recording

 

[regebro]

And here I thought I was just repeating myself... Ahwell.

I look forward to your respons. I won't repeat myself any more though, three times is enough.

Unless you have good arguments for why a bad website is a good idea, I don't think we can get any further here.

 

[Rev E]

You shouldn't need to figure out and remember where it is. There is no need to. There is NOTHING on that sire that prevents it from being done in a proper way, where you can find information easily the first time.

Wes. As I've said before, my issue has been solved (by you) that DaviSound in some way does inform purchasers of its loose policy on completion and delivery deadlines. Your pointing this out was applaudable, because it cleared up a major issue that many, including myself, commented on.

However, on the issue of the website and the difficulty in accessing information, I think that you're way off course. I agree with Regebro that there is a serious organizational issue on that website. Other than performing a marketing function, a good website conveys information efficiently. DaviSound's website doesn't even come close. If I asked you how much you charge, I certainly wouldn't expect you to give me a history of studios in order for you to tell me just that simple information (however, I fully realize that you may want to justify your fee if it appears high, but that would only come after you told me what I wanted to know).

The DaviSound website isn't the absolute worst website there is known to man, but to say that it effectively and efficiently conveys information is almost laughable (not clearly "laughable," because it appears that you really do believe that the site conveys information effectively).

If I were keeping score, I'd say that you clearly won on the most important issue of the thread... that DaviSound states up front that it abides by no definite deadline. There is still the question of whether that non-definite deadline is reasonable. Reasonable is a function of the customer and will be decided when people order or refrain from ordering DaviSound's wares. However, I think you're trying to win the unwinnable argument if you intend to persuade that the website is more cogent than it is confusing.

 

[Rev E]

One example.

On the Toolboxes link, it takes you to http://www.davisound.com/ToolBoxes.html In order to learn what "toolboxes" DaviSound makes, you've got to scroll down a long and somewhat confusingly worded page just to figure out what the @#$@ the guy sells. A better site would have simply provided a list at the top of the page that lists or shows TB1 - TB10 and briefly (in 2 or 3 words) says something like TB10 - TB-10 DaviSuper Preamplifier (or mic preamp) or TB4 - independently-switchable equalizer. Then, if I wanted to see what each of these items were I would click on the link for more detail.

Perhaps this point has been stressed by Regebro till it appears to be cliche, but I shouldn't have to read about anything until I want to. DaviSound's site forces you to read it all whether you want to read it or not. Perhaps one would say that I should read the entire site before deciding on what I want... but I'd retort that I don't have to read Neumann's history and manufacturing techniques IF all I want to know about is their M149.

Take a gander at the Lawson Microphones website. http://www.lawsonmicrophones.com/ Notice from jump, that all mics(products) are neatly organized (in brief) from the first page. I learn from the first page that Lawson appears to make 4 microphones. At least two of the mics (two of the L47s) are tube mics. The L47SH is a FET mic. Also from the first page... some sporty one-liners from reviews (not the whole review), links to order information and links to each of the mics mentioned before. I, the CONSUMER, makes the choice as to what I want to read, what I want to know about. If I want to gander at the FET mic, I can do so without reading the verbage about the tube brethren. If I already know about Lawson's mics or read a convincing review and need no more info or convincing, I can link out the order page without further ado. (or I can call the 1800 number located on the first page).

Although, there are a lot of good and great websites, a site doesn't have to have all of the whiz-bang graphics, java or whatever to convey info simply, cogently and effectively. The Lawson site (as one of many examples) does this with little effort. To compare, Lawson is also a small audio company that had builds (or hand assembles) their products. The craft (the handbuilding or assembling) has nothing to do with accessing information. Lawson demonstrates this quite clearly.

 

[regebro]

Ooh. "Infinitely Variable Patterns". Devilishly simple, yet very clever. Why haven't I thought of that?

Ehm. Probably because I don't make microphones...

 

[jslator]

Wes. As I've said before, my issue has been solved (by you) that DaviSound in some way does inform purchasers of its loose policy on completion and delivery deadlines....

However, on the issue of the website and the difficulty in accessing information, I think that you're way off course.

The issues are obviously related though if the only way they inform purchasers about their loose deadlines is to bury some mention if it deep within a mind-boggling website. If that's the case, I'd argue that the purchaser hasn't really been informed about the policy at all.

 

[Rev E]

The issues are obviously related though if the only way they inform purchasers about their loose deadlines is to bury some mention if it deep within a mind-boggling website. If that's the case, I'd argue that the purchaser hasn't really been informed about the policy at all.

Yeah, but a customer is on notice about the funky things going with DaviSound regarding providing cogent information after reading (or not-reading) the site . Given that notice, the customer has to accept responsibility for any information provided/buried on the site... Bottom line, if someone still orders after seeing the mind-numbing disorganization of info that is the DaviSound website, that customer has to take full responsibility for what's there, whether hidden or in plain view.

 

[mshilarious]

Well the auction ended, unsuccessfully of course, at $202.50 and only 2 bids. It's likely that the auction was never intended to sell, just rather to advertise, which is fine too. The listing fees on that auction would have run about $25, and it got around 1,200 page views, probably 75% from participants in this thread . . .