An even bigger holy fucking shit. Davisound as a company really exsists!!!!!!!!

[Recording Engineer]

Rev E,

First-off I would like to Thank You for clearing quite a few things up.

I am now just finally understanding this point-of-view, assuming that is also all these other's as well. However, it seems I've stilled failed at expressing mine of how DaviSound works.

What is typical of DaviSound, is to state the average length, from order to delivery on the "Prices-Terms-Policies" page, which gets updated once or twice a year, and sometimes on the "News Updates" page, which gets updated at least once a month.

Following that statement, on their "Prices-Terms-Policies" page, it also says:

"This continuously fluctuates, of course, depending upon the volume of orders at any given time. It also varies somewhat from one type of item to the next."

Sometimes, DaviSound will tell you the most updated average time, when you put your order in, but they're usually pretty darn clear that they don't know how long it will actually really take.

The "Prices-Terms-Policies" page continues-on about "time" if you would like to read it yourself, including:

"The point is, if you want to own a DaviSound product ...
you can be sure that we can ALWAYS accomodate you as long you are willing to invest the little extra time and patience it may take to get it!"

Also, there are quite a number of paragraphs all through-out the website that mentions about "time" and empasizes it takes time and patience, and WHY.

In fact, here's a whole section that is about nothing but "time":
http://www.davisound.com/DaviStatements.html#TIME

 

[Recording Engineer]

jet-rocker,

Well I'm NOT giving Outlaws the benefit of doubt simply based on mine and other customer experience, as well as those who've actually had contact with DaviSound, that I've heard, being 100% positive.

As I've said, I'm willing accept that DaviSound MAY have dropped the ball on this one, but considering the above and the tiny bit Outlaws has presented, and the way he has presented it, I highly doubt it.

And AGAIN, you're assuming a deadline was ACTUALLY given, which I HIGHLY doubt one was! I've NEVER been given a "deadline"! Simply just given an current average time or what they were hoping!

Here's a little clip from:
http://www.davisound.com/DaviStatements.html#TIME

"At DaviSound, we can not and we do not accept orders based on "deadlines". We are always doing our best for a fast delivery but we must take whatever time is required to do it the right way. And, we can never know with absolute certainty just what all that entails until we are well into a project. This is true to some extent with our "standard" Tool Boxes just as it is to a greater extent with custom projects. This is why, after all of these years and all of those many projects, it is still difficult for me to make a close, specific, accurate delivery projection until right up to about a week or so before completion ... and, even then, I still sometimes miss the exact day!"

And no. DaviSound DID give progress updates; Outlaws himself said that. And if they were anything like what I've always gotten (and STILL get), DaviSound mentions they HOPE to get it complete by this week or that week, but it's pretty damn obvious, it's NOT a self-imposed deadline.

 

[Rev E]

Thanks Wes. I'm ignorant of DaviSound and it's policies. Thanks for clearing it up that they DO indeed state that the deadline is loose.

While I would admit that from reading the website, I find it confusing (because the info is on a set of long web pages, if it's in there it's in there. I'd still stress that providing notice is good sense for any business. I'm not sure what's going on with Outlaws's mic pre. But one thing is for sure, I have no more to say, because my issue was cleared up.

Outlaws,
I hope everything works out with your mic pre. And I hope that after all of this waiting and stress that it's worth all that you paid for it and more.

Es.

 

[jet-rocker]

Ok, I know that I'm right, and I'm willing to just leave it at that.

But for real, I have no vested interest in this, and am just curious to see how it plays out.

-Jtt

 

[Recording Engineer]

If you want to play the "fool yourself" game, who am I to stop ya...

I'm curious to see how this pans-out too...

 

[chessrock]

That sounds fair.

As long as the company states up-front that they're loose about their deadlines, and they warn you well enough ahead of time, then all is fair.

I just hope that they make that very clear to their customers in their phone communications and in written correspondence.

To expect someone to sift through all that mess of a web site to find that explanation is asking a little much. Wes, maybe you find the web site perfectly logical, but keep in mind that a lot of us find it downright baffling. It's just the way some of us work.

 

[Rev E]

Originally posted by chessrock Wes, maybe you find the web site perfectly logical, but keep in mind that a lot of us find it downright baffling.

Couldn't have said it better... but then I'm supposed to be keeping quiet right?

 

[Gidge]

they werent loose in their Ebay ad.....specifically:

"Once all design details are finalized, fabrication will begin with completion and shipping approximately eight to ten weeks from project initiation. The entire project is to be completed well within the ninety day eBay feedback period. "

 

[CyanJaguar]

Somebody at Davisound clearly needs to learn the importance of Time Based Competition.

I dont understand how anyone would order anything from a company that does not give a sure delivery date. It makes no sense and I know that I personally would NEVER do it.

 

[tdukex]

I'm not here to defend Davisound. But no company has perfect customer service or 100% customer satisfaction. Could Davisound use some improvement in that area? Probably.

But this guy Outlaws, honest? Maybe, maybe not. One thing is obvious though, he lacks basic comprehansion skills and from early on has displayed a total lack of social evolvement. Need evidence? Go test YOUR comprehension skills on his previous Davisound thread. John Mayes, one of the nicest, most level headed among us tried to offer some sincere insight into small companies who handbuild products, and our esteemed Outlaws attacked him in a vulgar and petty way. All ass, no class.

Outlaws couldn't even muster the manhood to apologize after it was made apparent John was only trying to offer help. Instead, our behavioral role model of a BBS member, Outlaws--who nobody here knows anything about--starts this jackass thread, and before long all of the jackals have amassed. You must have all smelled the Davisound carrion at the same time.

WTF is this, the Wild Nature channel?

 

[Recording Engineer]

Wes, maybe you find the web site perfectly logical, but keep in mind that a lot of us find it downright baffling. It's just the way some of us work.

That's cool. I'm with you guys if I just were to just browse and skim the site. But when I spend time actually reading, the way it was designed to be, it is logical to me. And I would hope, anyone giving any serious thought would do just that for the entire website.

 

[Recording Engineer]

No, they weren't loose on their eBay listing... eBay's rules, not their's. And if you want to do the eBay thing, you gotta play by their rules!

 

[Recording Engineer]

Somebody at Davisound clearly needs to learn the importance of Time Based Competition.

I dont understand how anyone would order anything from a company that does not give a sure delivery date. It makes no sense and I know that I personally would NEVER do it.

It's a VERY simple concept really... And if you can't accept it, I say I'm GLAD you would NEVER do it, as it's NOT for you anyway because that's the way it goes for hand-built and/or custom gear... Name of the game... Besides your money, you've gotta invest time and patience if you want to play...

 

[CyanJaguar]

It's a VERY simple concept really... And if you can't accept it, I say I'm GLAD you would NEVER do it, as it's NOT for you anyway because that's the way it goes for hand-built and/or custom gear... Name of the game... Besides your money, you've gotta invest time and patience if you want to play...

OK. If that's the case, I'll go on record and say that I'll NEVER, ever buy a davisound product. Not even if I had more money than I could spend.

The non-handbuilt guys can have ALL my money.

If you cant spot the fool...

 

[Dot]

I've been interested to find out more about Davisound products. But that interest has been fading. The company is only a few hours away from where I live, but they don't accept visitors. They also don't do in-house demos. They also don't have any units available for review. No reviews on their site...

Being in SC, I've run into a few engineers who've used a Davisound mic pre, and no one had anything especially good to say about them, and in fact comments like "noisy" and "interesting" comes up, and that they're decent enough, but nothing earthshattering. And no one here who's actually tried one decided to buy it and use it in their studio.

I've been in contact with someone who has a Davisound mic pre, and we're going to include it in some sessions in the near future.

Funny thing is, for all the hot air they blow on their website, if you look up Davisound on Google, you only find their products on the equipment lists of a few rinky dink studios.

From their website:

We direct market our products to elite clientele all across our continent and abroad.

Where? Who? I don't see any of them. They must be highly secretive, esoteric clients - perhaps existing in another dimension?

And also...

For many years it was a long standing DaviSound policy NOT to publish client endorsements or reveal our client list in any fashion.

I wonder why?

And...

Our website is designed much like our equipment...few frills...no glitter...just REAL SOLID INTEGRITY "behind the panel"!

Sounds like a damn car dealer. Actually, all I read on the site sounds like a bunch of bullshit wth very little to back it up. The overuse of the words like "elite" and "esoteric" is...well...whatever. I'm sure this guy can crank out a few boxes, but it also looks like he sells them on Ebay. So where's the demand? Where are a few reviews? Where are the elite users?

These guys seem to be like the Keebler elves - except I don't really see that anybody who's anybody is actually eating their cookies.

A search for Davisound TB-1 on Google yields some rather meager results to say the least. As a comparison, try looking up the John Hardy M-1 on Google. And - in 2003 - John Hardy doesn't even need to have a website!

I know what waiting for a custom-built product is like, and I understand unforseeable delays. And dealing with a Stephen Paul or a Jim Olsen is one thing. These guys are monsters in the industry and their work preceeds them and they have serious major people and studios who use their products. But to even compare a guy like Hayne Davis - who's produced some rinky dink radio commericals - to people in high demand who work on custom-order, hand-made products and modifications is a big stretch.

With so many great proven preamps and great designers who make them already on the market, the burden of proof of the quality of Davisound products and the customer service of the company is soley on the shoulders of Davisound. So far it ain't lookin' too good.

 

[chessrock]

These guys seem to be like the Keebler elves - except I don't really see that anybody who's anybody is actually eating their cookies.

Well, you know Dot. If this is the way you feel, then THIS COOKIE is NOT for YOU. And you should STAY FAR FAR AWAY if you have reservations like that.

It's funny how people who've NEVER EVEN TRIED Keebler cookies or even met any of these elves seem to have SO MANY Goddamn OPINIONS about them, and are so quick to judge their recluse lifestyle, communal living in hollowed trees, pointy ears, etc. etc. etc. etc.

 

[Dot]

chessrock, I don't care if some designer lives in a tree, prays to a goat and practices the fine art of feltching. If they make great gear, then more power to them. You might think that if a company that's been in business as long as Davisound has actually made anything outstanding, that some of those elusive "elite" users might pop up on a web search.

I mean, there's a lot of people out there who are pretty psyched about the Keebler Elves.

 

[Gidge]

No, they weren't loose on their eBay listing... eBay's rules, not their's. And if you want to do the eBay thing, you gotta play by their rules!

so if you order off e-bay you get a solid time frame, otherwise, you dont......hmmmm.......

I thought ebay rules was 30 days on a pre-sell........

 

[CyanJaguar]

Well, you know Dot. If this is the way you feel, then THIS COOKIE is NOT for YOU. And you should STAY FAR FAR AWAY if you have reservations like that.

It's funny how people who've NEVER EVEN TRIED Keebler cookies or even met any of these elves seem to have SO MANY Goddamn OPINIONS about them, and are so quick to judge their recluse lifestyle, communal living in hollowed trees, pointy ears, etc. etc. etc. etc.

ROFL. CHessrock, you are too funny.

posted by dot
I know what waiting for a custom-built product is like, and I understand unforseeable delays. And dealing with a Stephen Paul or a Jim Olsen is one thing. These guys are monsters in the industry and their work preceeds them and they have serious major people and studios who use their products.

Dot, I agree with all of your post except this. I dont really care who the seller is. In my world, the customer is king. The world revolves around the buyer, not the seller. Its preposterous to me to think that I am handing this guy my money(large sums of it) and feeling like he is doing me a favor. Man, TBC is an extremely important concept and even more so in this day and age. I cancelled an order for a gateway computer because it would have taken 2 weeks to deliver. Why should I wait for 2 weeks when I can get a computer with the exact same specs from another company in 2 days.

I wonder how long stephen paul would make a customer wait if they were Barbara Streisand or Michael Jackson.

 

[Recording Engineer]

Dot,

While it seems you are may be one of the only one out of all these people who've actually read their website, and out of what was at least what seems previously out of pure interest and NOT for negative fuel, somehow you missed DaviSound's visitation policy... You can come visit, you simply need to make an appointment.

Since you're they're only a few hours away and you were, at least at one point, genuinely interested, I don't see why you haven't gone for a visit. You have an opportunity to talk person-to-person with Mr. Hayne Davis himself! You, then, would get a MUCH better feel for the company as a whole, than you have from talking to those few engineers on what THEY think!

DaviSound doesn't do the "review" thing for good reason in my opinion... They have quite a "review" story that helped sealed that policy for them! And they don't have any for use onsite not by choice, that being the way it is...

Tell you what though... They currently have my TB-1 there for a tiny repair (my fault)... Maybe when it's ready, you can do a visit and "sample" it! Or maybe even take it home with ya for for a week! I'm willing to do this as I have experienced the quality that is DaviSound! But don't take MY word for it!

No, they don't do the name-dropping thing... But recently, let people express their support on their website at specific request! You seemed to have missed Joe Renzetti's comments... Get in contact with him... He'll tell ya!