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Boogeyman92

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Hi all, I'm new to this forum and relatively new to the idea of Home Recording. I play guitar in a rock band called Boogeyman and we're currently in the process of writing our first few songs.

I studied Music Technology at GCSE level (UK) but honestly I spent about two years messing around playing guitar, getting recorded and riding the coat tails of genuinely talented sound engineers. Obviously in hindsight, I now detect the irony and wish I had paid more attention haha!

Currently we are recording everything on a phone app and uploading to Google Drive for posterity. While this has served it's purpose we are looking to create a basic home studio recording environment so we can more easily record multiple tracks e.g. vocals, guitar & bass. We have also played around with the idea of purchasing some drumkit software, e.g. EZDRUMMER software from Toontrack so we can start playing around with the arrangements of the tracks.

Coming from the perspective of a relative newcomer, is there any advice that anyone can offer me on where to start in terms of reading, pitfalls and basic equipment.

My current understanding is that I will need at least:

Basic Audio Interface and cables (thinking of recording the guitar and bass tracks directly into the computer)
Recording Software (any advice on some good, economically priced software would be appreciated)
Microphone (was thinking Shure M57 for vocal recordings)
EZdrummer 2 software

We aren't looking to get anything more than a decent demo recording out of this at present so I'm not looking for anything like audio perfection!

Any help would be appreciated guys :)

P.S. apologies if there is already some master post somewhere that covers all of the above!
 
Mate,

You've got the right idea for what you need already which is good.

Basic Audio Interface - Look at the Focusrite stuff, they have a number of cheap options, they're known to be reliable and you never hear a bad word said about them. In fact, I've just bought a Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 to replace my Aging Line6 Toneport

Software - no question here from me. Get Reaper. Its free to test and very cheap to buy - you'll never feel like you should have to upgrade from Reaper.

Mic - Andertons.co.uk ship a version of the 2i2 with a cheap condenser and some headphones (which is a reasonable deal - I've just done it myself :) ) as you'll want a pair of hardshell headphones for tracking anyway. I've heard some decent demos using that cheap condenser for recording vocals. I've had some success using an SM57 for vocals but its pretty much an essential for miking up a guitar amp.

EZ Drummer - Easy to use and cheap for putting together half convincing drums. I'm pretty new to it but I've heard people use it to far better effect than me.

So:

Scarlett 2i2+headphones and mic £180
Reaper free to try and then only about £50.
Mic - SM57 £70
EZ Drummer £70.

You could skimp on the interface and get the basic Focusrite for less than £100.
 
Boogeyman92 said:
Fantastic response, thanks mate!
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No worries.

Don't expect instant results though - it takes practice. You'll need to really work on dialing in a tone you like on your amp and then perfecting your mic placement to capture that tone in Reaper.
 
As you are talking about DIing the guitar and bass, you will need to look at an amp sim software, too, like Guitar Rig or Amplitube.

And besides headphones (for tracking), you're going to want some way to listen to the mixes (monitor speakers, or a stereo amp and speakers).
 
Thanks mjbphotos, I hadn't considered that at all! I was kind of expecting most DAW to come with some form of electric/acoustic guitar tone to use as stock, but on second thought it might be better to buy some good software and dial in a good tone rather than a mediocre tone!
 
Boogeyman92 said:
Thanks mjbphotos, I hadn't considered that at all! I was kind of expecting most DAW to come with some form of electric/acoustic guitar tone to use as stock, but on second thought it might be better to buy some good software and dial in a good tone rather than a mediocre tone!
Click to expand...

Amplitube seems to be the go to choice for cheap software at the moment - they do a basic version for free. You'll probably have more fun miking up an amp though.

What I tend to do is practice/write/reherse using an amp sim then switch to a miked amp when I am sure of what I want to do and give it a proper take.
 
JDOD said:
Amplitube seems to be the go to choice for cheap software at the moment - they do a basic version for free. You'll probably have more fun miking up an amp though.

What I tend to do is practice/write/reherse using an amp sim then switch to a miked amp when I am sure of what I want to do and give it a proper take.
Click to expand...

That was pretty much my plan. Depending on funds, i.e. whether I go for the SHURE SM57 straight away or get a cheapish Amp sim, I may record structures and stuff with the DI and then as you say, record the tone of the amp when going for a more complete cut of the demo.

Personally I think the biggest challenge, barring just generally getting to grips with the software and terminology, is going to be using EZdrummer. From what I remember of my Music Technology classes, creating rhythms in FL was always my weak point haha.

Anybody got an good tips for getting used to drum machines?
 
Boogeyman92 said:
That was pretty much my plan. Depending on funds, i.e. whether I go for the SHURE SM57 straight away or get a cheapish Amp sim, I may record structures and stuff with the DI and then as you say, record the tone of the amp when going for a more complete cut of the demo.

Personally I think the biggest challenge, barring just generally getting to grips with the software and terminology, is going to be using EZdrummer. From what I remember of my Music Technology classes, creating rhythms in FL was always my weak point haha.

Anybody got an good tips for getting used to drum machines?
Click to expand...

You'll find it really, really easy to create drum tracks using EZ Drummer and Reaper.
Check this out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEJH3WM6Oz8
It really is that easy!
 
Thanks JDOD, I'll check that out when I get back from work!
 
Does the band have any kind of mixer even if just for vocal PA?

If so look at the Native Instruments KA6 interface. I has two mic/line/guitar inputs plus two more line inputs that can take the output from said mixer. Such a setup not only gets you 4 tracks at a time but should make setting up less of a plug/re-plug hassle? #

The KA6 also ships with a light version of Cubase which I am sure has some guitar FX in it and possibly drums. There is also Kontakt Player and about 3G of downloadable samples to be had.

There are other 2 mic + 2line AIs of course but not many with the NI's driver stability and uber low latency,

Dave.
 
Boogeyman92 said:
That was pretty much my plan. Depending on funds, i.e. whether I go for the SHURE SM57 straight away or get a cheapish Amp sim, I may record structures and stuff with the DI and then as you say, record the tone of the amp when going for a more complete cut of the demo.

Personally I think the biggest challenge, barring just generally getting to grips with the software and terminology, is going to be using EZdrummer. From what I remember of my Music Technology classes, creating rhythms in FL was always my weak point haha.

Anybody got an good tips for getting used to drum machines?
Click to expand...

There is a learning curve with EZDrummer2, but it its pretty simple to start with simple 'drag and drop' loops.
 
ecc83 said:
Does the band have any kind of mixer even if just for vocal PA?

If so look at the Native Instruments KA6 interface. I has two mic/line/guitar inputs plus two more line inputs that can take the output from said mixer. Such a setup not only gets you 4 tracks at a time but should make setting up less of a plug/re-plug hassle? #

The KA6 also ships with a light version of Cubase which I am sure has some guitar FX in it and possibly drums. There is also Kontakt Player and about 3G of downloadable samples to be had.

There are other 2 mic + 2line AIs of course but not many with the NI's driver stability and uber low latency,

Dave.
Click to expand...

Hi Dave,

No unfortunately we've got nothing like that. Just instruments, amps and a decent dynamic mic!

We really are starting from scratch haha
 
I ditched amps a while ago, once VSTs/sims got to be as good as they are now. I can't tell the difference, listeners of my music can't tell. So I don't bother with the extra expense and gear. [I'm a guitarist, and have owned plenty of gear over the years] There's members here that claim they can tell. I'm doubtful of those claims, unless they're thinking of the worse sounding use of simulation (ie - issue with the musician, not the tool). Most of the out of the box presets (in Amplitube, Guitar Rig, etc) are as good as any stack/rack setup I've heard. I've been saying this for a while now with regards to moving into the digital era - some people just like knobs! And they will fervently defend their dependence and tactile addiction to the bitter end. The rest of us just move on, and pocket that (wasted) money. So my recommendation is to buy with your ears. If you're unhappy with the sound, buy the more costly thing that sounds the way you want. When it sounds good to you, then it's good enough. ;)
 
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Hi Pinky!

I may invest in some a decent amp package soon enough. At the minute I'm trying to balance my expenses and figure out what to buy first so my early experimentation will probably be via dynamic mic because we already own one!

Its a Shure SM55 and I'm already aware of its limitations. Still I'm gonna have a bit of play around with it and see if it can be used at all for guitar amp recording, I'm guessing that it will suffice but not at a particularly high quality as it's a mic that is geared for vocal recordings.

Do amp packages like Guitar Rig and Amplitube essentially open up within a DAW? I.e. I would open Reaper and then open the software package from within that?
 
Boogeyman92 said:
Do amp packages like Guitar Rig and Amplitube essentially open up within a DAW? I.e. I would open Reaper and then open the software package from within that?
Click to expand...

Yes, but Amplitube also works as a standalone (and if I recall so does Guitar Rig). You can still use it for noodling/jamming, without needing to be in a project.

There's nothing to say you can't/won't get a decent sound mic'ing an amp, the software just adds a lot of flexibility and precision to the sound. Think of it this way - too much fuzz? Just turn it down, no need to retrack. Everything you do when using a mic/live recording the parts has to be retracked if you end up not liking the tone later.
 
It's defo something I'll be aiming for. Looking at prices though it would definitely be cheaper to just have a bit of a play around with mic'ing up the amp, initially anyway! I like the fact that you can use amplitube to make decent recordings on a phone, definitely seems quite mobile. But at the same time, I feel like i'm better investing my time and energy into learning how to make recordings on a full DAW, especially if I'm looking to start using a drum machine at some point!
 
Plus one on that, Pinky--things like the Pod xt are just time and room saving miracles. I don't even fuck around much with tweaking the presets anymore, though it's easy to do if one needs to.
 
Boogeyman92 said:
It's defo something I'll be aiming for. Looking at prices though it would definitely be cheaper to just have a bit of a play around with mic'ing up the amp, initially anyway! I like the fact that you can use amplitube to make decent recordings on a phone, definitely seems quite mobile. But at the same time, I feel like i'm better investing my time and energy into learning how to make recordings on a full DAW, especially if I'm looking to start using a drum machine at some point!
Click to expand...

If you're a guitarist, you will find a ton of value in buying a proper amp sim VST. If it's not your first priority, it should be your second. ;) Amplitube is "only" $149:

IK Multimedia | AmpliTube 4

You get access to literally tens of thousands of dollars worth of amps, pedals, rack effects, mics, etc. And if you decide having more gear than a multi-platinum rock star still isn't enough, there's a lot of add-ons for relatively cheap.
 
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