The New Tone Thread

  • Thread starter Thread starter Telegram Sam
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lol ..... I meant to take that down :D

I had a clip of me playing with my POG2 and it sounded like a cello.
But I couldn't get a wave file to upload/attach and didn't feel like going to the studio ..... recording the wave file to CD and then bringing it to the puter to rip to MP3 so I didn't get it up.

:laughings:
 
Ok fellas, been dicking around a little today. I owe a member here some drum tracks, but it's been raining like a bitch and the dogs can't go outside, so it's guitar day.

So I did a little amp comparison. An original 1979 Marshall JMP 2204 vs my new reissue Marshall JCM 800 2203. Same circuit, the 2204 is 50 watts, the 2203 is 100 watts. The most obvious differences are that the 2204 is an all original "vintage" amp with all of it's most important parts still intact, and the 2203 is a new reissue of a classic. That's doesn't concern me though because even between original 2203 and 2204s, they can sound very different from one production run to the next. These new 2203s are dead-nuts accurate to the originals though. I've checked it myself. Every wire and cap that was on the original 2203s is on these reissues. Same exact everything. Even the wire colors are correct. The only difference being that the reissues obviously have new transformers and choke. Anyway, I wanted to dial in the same settings on each amp, record it through a period correct speaker, and see if the 2204's reputation in comparison to a 100w version is really what everyone says it is.

Les Paul Traditional - Burstbucker 3 bridge pickup
1979 Marshall JMP 2204 50w Master Volume
2007 Marshall JCM 800 2203 100w Master Volume
Both amp settings-
Presence - 5
Bass - 7
Mid - 5
Treb - 6
Gain - 6
Master vol - 5
Marshall 1960A 4x12
Celestion G12-65 (1981) - SM57 center - Audix i5 edge - both equal blend 100%
No EQ, processing, or effects in DAW

Transsexual 2204

Transsexual 2203

The differences are obvious, I have my opinions, give it a listen and tell me what you think. Pay no mind to my shit playing. :D
 
BIG difference.

The 2204 is much fatter and the 2203 is, dare I say it, thin sounding to me with a little extra fizz on top.
I would have suggested that may be due to driving the 50 watter closer to power-tube distortion land but since you're using the same exact settings that shouldn't be it. New tubes versus old maybe?
new tranny versus old tranny?

Whatever the reason, in this specific clip I way prefer the 2204 by a large margin.
However I'm sure you could tweak the 2203 and get it to sound the same but in this clip it's not at all the same.
 
Lt. Bob said:
BIG difference.

The 2204 is much fatter and the 2203 is, dare I say it, thin sounding to me with a little extra fizz on top.
I would have suggested that may be due to driving the 50 watter closer to power-tube distortion land but since you're using the same exact settings that shouldn't be it. New tubes versus old maybe?
new tranny versus old tranny?

Whatever the reason, in this specific clip I way prefer the 2204 by a large margin.
However I'm sure you could tweak the 2203 and get it to sound the same but in this clip it's not at all the same.
Click to expand...

Cool thanks for checking it out.

Lemme see if/what others say and I'll post my own ideas on it.
 
2203 seems cleaner. More note articulation. Less dark.

*I deliberately scrolled past Boob's remarks 'cause I didn't wanna see. Now that I have I think we're on the same page. I did not, however, list a preference. ;)
 
One ends in 4 and the other in 3.
I strtaed listening then started thinking Misfits then got back on track and thought Cramps but no Misfits yeah.
So oost it.
Personally I'be be stoked to have created either.
On third listen of just the intro 10 seconds I'd say gimme the 2203 if I had to select one but it did seem to sizzzle more on the high stuff so I DON'T KNOW!
 
Hey guys....having the hardest time in fuckin' history trying to get high-speed internet where I live now....I've already cut 3 trees, & will probably have to cut at least 3 more....For fuck's sake, what a fucking pain....I'll have dial-up to get my by for a little while, until I can become the lumberjack I always wanted to be....LOL....Still alive & kickin', just can't listen to any clips or anything for a little while longer.....The good thing is, I'll be able to buy & crank a big amp where I live now, so the little amps & ISO cab will be history before too much longer....I'll check back in when I get time in a couple of days...
 
Sky Blue Lou said:
2203 seems cleaner. More note articulation. Less dark.

*I deliberately scrolled past Boob's remarks 'cause I didn't wanna see. Now that I have I think we're on the same page. I did not, however, list a preference. ;)
Click to expand...

rayc said:
One ends in 4 and the other in 3.
I strtaed listening then started thinking Misfits then got back on track and thought Cramps but no Misfits yeah.
So oost it.
Personally I'be be stoked to have created either.
On third listen of just the intro 10 seconds I'd say gimme the 2203 if I had to select one but it did seem to sizzzle more on the high stuff so I DON'T KNOW!
Click to expand...
Thanks fellas.

Right, they're not even close with everything being equal. Which is good to me. I'd hate to have two of the exact same too-expensive amp. Lol.

Both amps have new JJ tubes. Although I have not confirmed the bias setting on the 2203 yet. The 2204 is biased right at 65% dissipation. I did that myself and it's dead on. So I'm not sure the tubes have much to do with the big difference in tone, but it certainly could be significant if the 2203's bias is way off.....which is possible since Marshall sets everything very cold. It's not running factory tubes, so I'm just assuming it's been set. I will verify though for sure. The 2204 has it's original 1979 transformers and choke. The 2203 has whatever new transformers/choke Marshall put in it. So that probably accounts for something too.

These simple clips live up to the rep of both amps though. The 2204 has a reputation of being warmer, fatter, and breaks up much sooner than the 2203. That certainly seems to be the case here. My particular 2204 starts getting power tubey and fat at around 4 on the master volume. So with this test at 5, the 2204 is already into the power section pretty well. The 2203 on the other hand really isn't even breathing hard at 5 on the master. It still has a waaaaays to go.....and it's really loud. I think a big part of the difference is the significant headroom advantage of the 100w 2203. And part of the mystique of the name and cosmetic change to "JCM" is that they got brighter for whatever reasons. Components, transformers, whatever. The circuits didn't change, but JCM 800 2203 and 2204s are generally brighter amps than their JMP counterparts.

So, to sum up, I'll take both, thanks. :D

minerman said:
Hey guys....having the hardest time in fuckin' history trying to get high-speed internet where I live now....I've already cut 3 trees, & will probably have to cut at least 3 more....For fuck's sake, what a fucking pain....I'll have dial-up to get my by for a little while, until I can become the lumberjack I always wanted to be....LOL....Still alive & kickin', just can't listen to any clips or anything for a little while longer.....The good thing is, I'll be able to buy & crank a big amp where I live now, so the little amps & ISO cab will be history before too much longer....I'll check back in when I get time in a couple of days...
Click to expand...
Wow, hang in there man. This thread aint going nowhere, and it will all be worth it when you have the ability to go big and loud. :D
 
The first thing I thought when I started hearing you play this clip is that it sounds a lot like the Rev. Horton Heat! Then I was enjoying it so much I almost forgot why I was listening. I definitely liked the first clip better. As Lt. Bob said the second one sounds thinner. I'd love to have a 50 watt Marshall around the house!
 
Mr. C said:
The first thing I thought when I started hearing you play this clip is that it sounds a lot like the Rev. Horton Heat! Then I was enjoying it so much I almost forgot why I was listening. I definitely liked the first clip better. As Lt. Bob said the second one sounds thinner. I'd love to have a 50 watt Marshall around the house!
Click to expand...

Thanks dude. I opened up for the Rev one time a looooong time ago. Like 1992-ish. He was a dick.

That's a little excerpt from one of my originals - Transsexual Mutant Monster Beach Party on Mars. It's a smash hit that's sold dozens of copies!

The 50w JMP 2204 is indeed a nice amp now that I've fixed it all up. It sounds really angry all the time. Lots of crunch and balls. I'm still loving the shit out of the new 800 though. I can't stop fucking with it.
 
The 2203 is very 80's ish. Fat, clear, nice tone. The 2204 is still a nice tone, just thinner with more bright & bite.. Both are great sounding amps. Lucky you! :D
 
Yeah, that 2204 has a really nice beefy lo-mid sound to it. It really shines when you're playing single-note stuff in the low register.

The 2203 sounds thinner and more chimey. It seems to shine in the upper register stuff. Those two would compliment each other nicely as a double-tracked and panned guitar sound, I'd think. One covers the chunky lows, one covers the chimey highs...it's like chocolate and peanut butter.
 
Thanks fellas. I don't think I gave the 2203 a fair representation though. This thing is a monster. I really like it. I've got a few recordings in the works that will feature the 800 in a better capacity than that test clip I made.
 
But, you see, it's still not comparative. Some of us like the 2203, and others prefer the 2204. It's a very subjective (as any art is) thing.
 
Well I'm not trying to convince anyone to like one or the other. They're not the same amp. At the exact same settings they're clearly very different.
 
Greg - How do you have your house set up so you can play these Marshalls? Do you have a super-insulated room or separate garage/shed? How about the wife and kids - neighbors?

When I crank my 50w Plexi it is a major disturbance. I live alone but the cats don't like it at all and even on a 1 acre lot the neighbors can hear me - they've said so. The curse of the Marshall, yeah?
 
I live in a brick McMansion in the burbs of Houston. I only get stupid loud during daylight hours. Nothing early, nothing after around dinner time. There's a school across the street from my house and my kids have told me they can hear me sometimes from inside the school! Still no complaints from anyone though. If it's daytime and people are cutting grass and shit, I can't be much more of a disturbance from inside of my house than lawnmowers and leaf blowers. The wife hates it. I have to use the master vol amps way down low if she's home. No Plexi play or recording when she's home.

Do you use an attenuator for your Plexi?
 
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