Unique Female Vocals - Engineered to death.... Nits?

[PoeticIntensity]

A singer / songwriter came in to the studio with a guitar and vocals. We ended up producing it up quite a bit. As usual, I'm on the drums (had no time to practice, had never heard the song before, and spent about 15 minutes coming up with the track)

.....aaaand, this is my debut on the bass! We spent about an hour rigging up a synth bass track, and then, after she left, I tried to do it on my bass guitar and ended up doing it in 10 minutes, and both of us thought it sounded much better, so... This is my first attempt at recording me playing bass.

Her voice sounded quite shrill through my MXL V77, so her vocals are EQed quite a bit. I'm interested in the following:

• Vocal sound / tonal balance
• Drum balance in whole mix
• Bass performance
• Overall balance of the mix. For some reason, this one was a toughy to balance out.

Thanks for the listen!

Back To Love

 

[FadeToMuffins]

I don't really have a huge problem with the production of the vocals. But I think she could benefit some improved performance in spots. The choruses sound kind of lacking in terms of energy and delivery. Combined with her youthful voice, and the totally cliche lyrics, and the vocal performance just comes off a little immature. Not immature in a derogatory way, just in the sense that it needs more polishing.

But as for your production job, I think you did fine given what you had to work with. I could hear this song being played on the Disney Channel or Nickelodeon or something

And the Drums sound quite good PI, they do a great job keeping time and the production on them is superb.

 

[Fishmed]

My thoughts:

Some of the chord changes at the begining sounded a bit odd.
Her tone was good, but a bit pitchy and she sounded nervous on the mic at times. With a little more practice, I am sure she could fix both of those issues.

The feel of the song and overall production sounds nice.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[Fishmed]

Listening to the song a second time, it reminds me of the band Hum.

 

[PoeticIntensity]

I don't really have a huge problem with the production of the vocals. But I think she could benefit some improved performance in spots. The choruses sound kind of lacking in terms of energy and delivery. Combined with her youthful voice, and the totally cliche lyrics, and the vocal performance just comes off a little immature. Not immature in a derogatory way, just in the sense that it needs more polishing.

But as for your production job, I think you did fine given what you had to work with. I could hear this song being played on the Disney Channel or Nickelodeon or something

And the Drums sound quite good PI, they do a great job keeping time and the production on them is superb.

Thanks for the comment, Fade... Rep given. And you're spot on. She's 17, has had no vocal training at all, and very little performance experience. Thanks for the kudos on the production.

My thoughts:

Some of the chord changes at the begining sounded a bit odd.
Her tone was good, but a bit pitchy and she sounded nervous on the mic at times. With a little more practice, I am sure she could fix both of those issues.

The feel of the song and overall production sounds nice.

Thanks for sharing.

Thanks for the comments, Fishmed. As far as pitchiness, I had to run her vocals through an auto-tuner to get it where it is. She wasn't horrible, but the tuning definitely helped.

 

[Fishmed]

Thanks for the comments, Fishmed. As far as pitchiness, I had to run her vocals through an auto-tuner to get it where it is. She wasn't horrible, but the tuning definitely helped.

By any chance, did the auto-tuner make her voice sound shakier than before it was processed, or was that just nerves?

 

[ido1957]

The vocals on the chorus seem quite a bit lower in volume than during the verses. The doubling of vocals on the chorus worked out really well - really like that. That other part with two different vocal parts is really good but in spots, it's too crowded/confusing/busy. For example the long/held notes behind the main vocals really works well.
Drums are perfect...!
Was the guitar recorded after your drums - could use a bit more sync there rhythm wise - noticed that on the beginning mostly.
Her voice eminds me of that Heart singer - very upper mid. It sounds a little pitchy but not bad; the auto tune isn't noticeable, like tupac (or whoever that guy is .
I think if I were to do any remix it would be to try and push the vocals back on the verses. The rest is okay for me... Good job overall and pass along my kudos to the singer for her performance....

 

[joeym]

Jason, this sounds like a demo or a pilot track for the real song to me. It's a good tune and the girl's got a promising voice, but you being a self-respecting musician (and a great drummer...) should take your time and arrange it properly. The voice needs working on, no doubt. The arrangement with the one guitar is very plain and it makes the tune lack dynamics and the guitar sounds a bit dull to me. There are some timing issues overall too. Bass seems to lack a bit of low end.
I believe that the song has radio potential, but I'm sure you could produce it better. Sorry if I come over as negative.....I've loved your stuff up to now.

Joey

 

[PoeticIntensity]

By any chance, did the auto-tuner make her voice sound shakier than before it was processed, or was that just nerves?

Nope... Those were definitely nerves. Good ear.

 

[PoeticIntensity]

The vocals on the chorus seem quite a bit lower in volume than during the verses. The doubling of vocals on the chorus worked out really well - really like that. That other part with two different vocal parts is really good but in spots, it's too crowded/confusing/busy. For example the long/held notes behind the main vocals really works well.
Drums are perfect...!
Was the guitar recorded after your drums - could use a bit more sync there rhythm wise - noticed that on the beginning mostly.
Her voice eminds me of that Heart singer - very upper mid. It sounds a little pitchy but not bad; the auto tune isn't noticeable, like tupac (or whoever that guy is .
I think if I were to do any remix it would be to try and push the vocals back on the verses. The rest is okay for me... Good job overall and pass along my kudos to the singer for her performance....

Thanks for your comments and kind words, Gerry. It's been a bit since you've posted any of your tunes! I hope all is well with you and yours.

Jason, this sounds like a demo or a pilot track for the real song to me. It's a good tune and the girl's got a promising voice, but you being a self-respecting musician (and a great drummer...) should take your time and arrange it properly. The voice needs working on, no doubt. The arrangement with the one guitar is very plain and it makes the tune lack dynamics and the guitar sounds a bit dull to me. There are some timing issues overall too. Bass seems to lack a bit of low end.
I believe that the song has radio potential, but I'm sure you could produce it better. Sorry if I come over as negative.....I've loved your stuff up to now.

Joey

Joey. Nothin' but love for ya, man. Thanks for calling me out on that. *sigh*... I make no excuses for the song in its present state, and in all honesty, I agree with your comment. This song, in its raw form was fairly hideous. We went from nothing but an idea of vocals and a guitar track, to what it is now in 6 hours.

The real reason I haven't taken the time to do this song justice is almost completely because I've got other paying clients coming in more and more now, and am limited on the amount of free work I can put into a project. As soon as the client sees the mix as being "good enough", that's usually the time I have to quit, because they don't want to pay for me to put 2 or 3 hours in on the drums alone. (I had 15 minutes on this one)

This was definitely a "quick 'n' dirty" track / mix / master session, and in all honesty, it's very refreshing to have you call me on that, Joey - because I know you're right. I guess I posted this because the improvement from raw mix to processed mix had such a marked improvement, I momentarily forgot about its glaring flaws.

Hats off to ya, Joey. I'll wait until I've got a real gem to post next time, because this definitely wasn't one of em'.

I would give you guys rep for this, but the site ain't lettin' me.

 

[ido1957]

I can't say Joey ain't right but I can see a time/money limitation being somewhat affecting the final project. You say 6 hours tracking but I won't ask you how much the rest of the process edit/mix/master took..I'm sure it was a few more .... Glad to hear you're getting some steady work in your studio...

OT - Dad fell out of his bed this morning and broke his hip so he's in the hospital now. My stepmom is trying to figure out how she's gonna care for him when he gets home. He's gonna need some kind of care....

 

[PoeticIntensity]

OT - Dad fell out of his bed this morning and broke his hip so he's in the hospital now. My stepmom is trying to figure out how she's gonna care for him when he gets home. He's gonna need some kind of care....

Oh goodness... That's a tough spot to be in, Gerry. I hope all works out, and you'll be in my prayers.

 

[kcearl]

I read through the comments dont really have much to add...


I like her voice and it sounds a good song...the instruments all sound good just the levels of the acoustic are a bit high and its a little untidy and the bass is slightly missing...great drums...


I kinda like the frailty of her voice..

I think your the victim of your own success as if some of us put this up everyone would go great job but because its you you have to work on it...nae luck


sorry to hear your news Ido...

 

[PoeticIntensity]

I kinda like the frailty of her voice..

I think your the victim of your own success as if some of us put this up everyone would go great job but because its you you have to work on it...nae luck

Thanks for the comment, kcearl (how do you pronounce that, anyway?).

The more I listen to her voice, the more I find it attractive - and consequently, the more I want to work on it. Interesting that you found it "frail".. Not a bad attribute to pin on it, for sure.

*hoping*.... If only I could be such a victim... What I wouldn't give to do this full-time, and make enough to support myself and my family...

Here's to trying to live your dreams!

 

[Fishmed]

Ido I hope your dad makes a speedy recovery.

The real reason I haven't taken the time to do this song justice is almost completely because I've got other paying clients coming in more and more now, and am limited on the amount of free work I can put into a project. As soon as the client sees the mix as being "good enough", that's usually the time I have to quit, because they don't want to pay for me to put 2 or 3 hours in on the drums alone. (I had 15 minutes on this one)

This was definitely a "quick 'n' dirty" track / mix / master session, and in all honesty, it's very refreshing to have you call me on that, Joey - because I know you're right. I guess I posted this because the improvement from raw mix to processed mix had such a marked improvement, I momentarily forgot about its glaring flaws.

I really feel your pain. As much as I like getting paid for my hard work, I love music and what it takes to make it sound the best. It can be tough to find that happy medium. Most of my clients could not afford ALL the time I spend on their music if I charged them my full rate. I know how people are; they will try to cut corners to save a buck or two, and unfortunately at the expense of their own music.

I have structured my hourly rate to include (editing & the initial mix) with tracking. Basically they pay by the hour for tracking and when they are done, they leave and I start my editing process and do an initial mix alone. I am able to get the music sounding the best I think it can be with out worrying about the clock and the pressure of someone sitting over my shoulder. When I am done, I call the client back in for a listen. If they want a simple fader adjustment, it is no problem. If they want to do a remix, I restart the clock at half rate and we mix it together; of course all major editing has been done at this point. For the most part this plan works well for everyone, and naturally there are exceptions.

My philosophy is that if you are not willing to invest in your own music, nobody else will.

 

[VomitHatSteve]

See, I'd always assumed Jack and Jill were siblings. That made a few of those lyrics a little creepy!

As other people have mentioned, the shakey nervousness in her voice is a factor.
I think a better arrangement would really help. As it stands now, the instruments aren't really doing anything interesting. They're just a backing band.
Some of the things you did to the vocals with pans and repeats were really cool though.

 

[kcearl]

Thanks for the comment, kcearl (how do you pronounce that, anyway?).

The more I listen to her voice, the more I find it attractive - and consequently, the more I want to work on it. Interesting that you found it "frail".. Not a bad attribute to pin on it, for sure.

*hoping*.... If only I could be such a victim... What I wouldn't give to do this full-time, and make enough to support myself and my family...

Here's to trying to live your dreams!

its pronounced Keith...I'm just a terrible speller


I didnt think her voice was frail throughout, i just found the nervousness in it at times endearing and not necessary a bad quality...id have to think hard about losing that if I were you...but im not and i just have to worry about how hard i make my next kick drum....slightly less work lol


wouldnt we all like to earn money out of this, i swear my next job is going to be vocational...i dont care if a make a buck a day!

 

[PoeticIntensity]

I really feel your pain. As much as I like getting paid for my hard work, I love music and what it takes to make it sound the best. It can be tough to find that happy medium. Most of my clients could not afford ALL the time I spend on their music if I charged them my full rate. I know how people are; they will try to cut corners to save a buck or two, and unfortunately at the expense of their own music.

I have structured my hourly rate to include (editing & the initial mix) with tracking. Basically they pay by the hour for tracking and when they are done, they leave and I start my editing process and do an initial mix alone. I am able to get the music sounding the best I think it can be with out worrying about the clock and the pressure of someone sitting over my shoulder. When I am done, I call the client back in for a listen. If they want a simple fader adjustment, it is no problem. If they want to do a remix, I restart the clock at half rate and we mix it together; of course all major editing has been done at this point. For the most part this plan works well for everyone, and naturally there are exceptions.

My philosophy is that if you are not willing to invest in your own music, nobody else will.

Fishmed, thank you for this. That is a *great* idea. I've taken note.

See, I'd always assumed Jack and Jill were siblings. That made a few of those lyrics a little creepy!

As other people have mentioned, the shakey nervousness in her voice is a factor.
I think a better arrangement would really help. As it stands now, the instruments aren't really doing anything interesting. They're just a backing band.
Some of the things you did to the vocals with pans and repeats were really cool though.

Yeah.. The arrangement lacks a lot... Hopefully she'll come back in and allow a bit more time to work on tightening it up, making it more interesting, etc...

Thanks for listening!

its pronounced Keith...I'm just a terrible speller


I didnt think her voice was frail throughout, i just found the nervousness in it at times endearing and not necessary a bad quality...id have to think hard about losing that if I were you...but im not and i just have to worry about how hard i make my next kick drum....slightly less work lol


wouldnt we all like to earn money out of this, i swear my next job is going to be vocational...i dont care if a make a buck a day!

Good on ya, Keith! (you really do need to work on your spelling. ) Thanks for your comments, and I'll be dipped if I don't give it my all to make this a full-time pursuit.