Recording tracks..What first?

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As a number of people have said, it's all about personal taste and discovery. Sometimes, your chosen method may bring unforseen problems later on. Personally, 95% of my stuff will be initially tracked in one of four ways, guitar/drums, guitar/percussion, bass/drums, bass/percussion. More often than not, those will be keepers although I may do a little sculpting and overdubbing here and there. But it's essential that the rhythmic foundation is tight together. That is, if there are slow downs or speed ups, they happen together. If you do start off with only a keyboard or guitar, it makes sense to use a click or metronome and record it !
I guess if you do complex rhythms and time changes, you may be stuffed somewhat, that's why I'm glad I've always befriended drummers instead of making dumb jokes about them !!:D
 
Chibi Nappa said:
That's...an odd thing to say. Bass and drums are usually hold the groove down way more than anything else, but I've never heard anybody say the bass is a percussion instrument.
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Yeah I probably said that wrong. It's better the way you put it. I was trying to get the same point across.

In any case, it's drums then bass, then r.guitar, then everything else.
 
I don't know if anyone has said this yet... but it is very hard to find a drummer (even great drummers) who can play along with music that was set to a click track and have it be perfect. It is much easier for the other musicians to play along with the drummer. Even the best drummers don't have perfect tempo and even when they track to a click track there will be points of emphasis like fills and such where they might get slightly ahead or behind the click track. As a musician you learn to play with the feel of the music. However, if you have click tracked all of the instruments in, it is very hard for a drummer to play along with such a scaled back (lifeless) recording. I love click tracks but they should be used as a reference and not used to dominate the tempo of the song. Slight variations in tempo are natural and sound natural, and that is why drums are almost always recorded first. I'm sure there are other opinions on this and I'm not saying this is the only way, but in all my trips to various different studios, we always did the drums first. Well, we might do a scratch track first and then do the drums to the scratch track, but the drums were the first real tracks recorded.
 
chewbacaface said:
I don't know if anyone has said this yet... but it is very hard to find a drummer (even great drummers) who can play along with music that was set to a click track and have it be perfect. It is much easier for the other musicians to play along with the drummer. Even the best drummers don't have perfect tempo and even when they track to a click track there will be points of emphasis like fills and such where they might get slightly ahead or behind the click track. As a musician you learn to play with the feel of the music. However, if you have click tracked all of the instruments in, it is very hard for a drummer to play along with such a scaled back (lifeless) recording. I love click tracks but they should be used as a reference and not used to dominate the tempo of the song. Slight variations in tempo are natural and sound natural, and that is why drums are almost always recorded first. I'm sure there are other opinions on this and I'm not saying this is the only way, but in all my trips to various different studios, we always did the drums first. Well, we might do a scratch track first and then do the drums to the scratch track, but the drums were the first real tracks recorded.
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Well, like you said. There are different opinions on this. You are right that most of the time, drums are recorded first.

But, in my case, I have no problem playing to the other tracks as a drummer. (Don't forget, the click can still be there while playing to all the other tracks). I much prefer it. I also get paid often to do tracks for people over the net and many of those tunes are cover version of tunes that someone wants drums on. So, I've played along to the original version of tunes and then sent them the drums. Like anything, if you practice it enough, it becomes second nature.

I think much of the reason some people falsely think a click "takes a way the groove" or whatever, is because they're usually dealing with a drummer that never practices with a click or metronome. So, the rare time they go into a studio, they're in un-familiar territory. Of course they're going to say playing to a click is not natural, because isn't natural.....for them.
 
Well, thats totally up to you. There are no ruels.

Me myself if i like recording drums first if possible. But ive been experincing drummers who cant play to a click track, where i had to record a guitar track that the drummer could follow, and then record things over that afterwards. Well theres loads of ways...
 
RAMI said:
Well, like you said. There are different opinions on this. You are right that most of the time, drums are recorded first.

But, in my case, I have no problem playing to the other tracks as a drummer. (Don't forget, the click can still be there while playing to all the other tracks). I much prefer it. I also get paid often to do tracks for people over the net and many of those tunes are cover version of tunes that someone wants drums on. So, I've played along to the original version of tunes and then sent them the drums. Like anything, if you practice it enough, it becomes second nature.

I think much of the reason some people falsely think a click "takes a way the groove" or whatever, is because they're usually dealing with a drummer that never practices with a click or metronome. So, the rare time they go into a studio, they're in un-familiar territory. Of course they're going to say playing to a click is not natural, because isn't natural.....for them.
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I think you nailed it. There aren't too many bands that go to the studio to record who have session quality drummers who have been trained by playing with a metronome or went to school for drumming. It doesn't mean they aren't good drummers but just that they will probably not give theri best performance over a click track or confined to music played to a click track. That is why I like the scratch track method. You get everyone into a live session, create a scratch track and then have everyone retrack over that. I usually have a click track in my ear as the guitar player and I do my best to keep the tempo steady for everyone else on the scratch track and that way the real track will have some basic tempo structure to it.
 
WavePro said:
Me myself if i like recording drums first if possible. But ive been experincing drummers who cant play to a click track, where i had to record a guitar track that the drummer could follow, and then record things over that afterwards. Well theres loads of ways...
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A church that I was part of had had no drums or percussion for years so I always carried the rhythm in my guitar playing. It may not have been particularly good but it left me with a very defined sense of timing. But no matter how super steady I may have felt I was, when we got a ZOOM rhythm track and set various beats and played to it, I realized for the first time just how difficult it was to keep metronomic time consistently. In our beings we have a kind of way of playing music that kind of breathes and sneezes. It has a regularity but it's not metronomic. Even disco songs back in the late 70s/early 80s with it's 120 BPM had slight fluctuations.
However, learning to play to that metronomic time did me immense good and the more I did it, the more comfortable I got and in a very short period, I could play to it with all my laid back 'movements', yet never wavering timewise. I can understand why people don't like them and I've never personally used a click for recording {mainly because I've nearly always played with the drummer/percussionist and changes in time signatures are rife !} but I wouldn't rule it out if I was putting down the initial track on my own and I think perhaps one does themself a disservice if they don't at least learn to play with one. It doesn't turn you into a crappy rigid robot that has no feel. No matter how metronomic the click, it's our humanity that gives the music it's life and creativity and if you're inventive, you can play in such a way that once that click has gone, no one but a metronome, God and the original tracking team would ever know !:D
 
Drums 1st....yeah...ok

RAMI said:
That's the ticket. :cool:

I do everything myself. But, being primarily a drummer, I record the drums last. I do all the other tracks to a simple drum machine beat, and then play drums to the whole song. That's just my preference. But, I'd say most common is recording drums first.
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I play primarily keyboards and had dabbled a bit on drums. Years ago, we were using a 4trk cassette (Fostex) and I guess we weren't clever enough to do a scratch track so that my drumming would have a bit more umphhh for the track...NOOO...stupid me would sit there and do the count-off and proceed to play the entire song (in my head) while playing drums...friggin' hard not to mention retarded..LOL
 
soundchaser59 said:
I always record first the instrument on which the song was written, with a click.

But since I do 99% of it myself, this method explains why none of my songs sound like the 1972 Chicago albums I love. There is a lot to be said for writing as a band, jamming as a band, they get a ton of signature sounds and unique parts that one person alone will never be able to conjure.
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I agree..however, I'm about to start a new project..actually just a few tracks as a demo to give to a guy and we'll be recording it in his studio maybe in a couple of months or so..just wanted to give him a pretty good sketch of the song even though it's a rough demo..I haven't recorded in a pretty long time, so I'm gearing up for that and trying to eliminate all the BS that might come from being out of the game this long..this song, however..i originally was going to do the click track and lay down the piano part and go from there...but this song's nuances and slowing down of the tempo, crescendo and all...not sure if the click track will be the right way to go..may have to just settle for piano and hope for the best as far as my own meter.....maybe...sigh...
 
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