lyrics to new song "Pleasure and Pain"

[icystorm]

Hi all...

I finished writing the music for a new song, "Pleasure and Pain", last week, as well as recording the backing track for a demo. I completed the lyrics today and I've posted them below for comments.

The song contains a darker glimpse of love. We all know how bad things can get when love goes wrong. In this case, things not only go wrong, but they go really wrong.

I'll record the vocals this week and publish a demo here to collect feedback if anyone is interested... or maybe I should wait for Halloween. Heh.

Pleasure and Pain

Words and music by: Joseph Spain
Created with Jamstudio.com, Acoustica Mixcraft 4.1, and Audacity 1.3

verse 1

She's faster than the human eye can see
The end comes quick for her defenseless prey
She made me learn how much a heart can bleed
I still dream of her at night

Possession's not an easy game to play
Her rules are simple but I make mistakes
Her twist on love can take a life away
She enslaves me with her mind

chorus

She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
With evil her mind conceives

She melts, she pours
She's everything the flesh adores
She hurts me, she hates me
She's pleasure and pain

bridge 1

When you love her
You will learn why

verse 2

She's sweeter than a single kiss can taste
Her poison love can lay a heart to waste
I crawl to her for more than I can take
of the potion she prescribes

I'm mesmerized by the spell she brews
Her magic mixture that I freely choose
My heart is hers I'm in her hands to use
I'm encaptured in her binds

chorus

She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
With evil her mind conceives

She melts, she pours
She's everything the flesh adores
She hurts me, she hates me
She's pleasure and pain

bridge 2

When you taste her
You will learn why
When you please her
You will know

chorus

She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
With evil her mind conceives

She melts, she pours
She's everything the flesh adores
She hurts me, she hates me
She's pleasure and pain

(repeat chorus through fade)

-------

Feedback and comments welcomed.

Cheers,
Joseph (icystorm)

 

[gecko zzed]

I reckon you've done well with this set of lyrics. You've managed to steer away from the more common cliches, and most of the song alludes to her character (a good thing) rather than spelling it out (not such a good thing).

There are, however, two lines that bother me a bit.

"With evil her mind conceives"

There's not much wrong with the line above, but for me it sounds a bit contrived, and I'm wondering whether something more subtle could be cast in its place, e.g. "with her spell of make believe"? (That's not necessarily much better, but it does replace the unambiguity of "evil" with something that leaves you guessing a bit more).

"Pleasure and pain"

It's unfortunate that this is the title, because it is an overused phrase, and indeed is the title of a number of songs, not the least of which is The Divinyl's masterpiece. "Pleasure and pain", and its more melodramatic partner "agony and ecstacy", need to be put away for a while . . . but that means a search through the coals of your brain for an alternative; not an easy task.

 

[_brian_]

""Pleasure and pain"

It's unfortunate that this is the title, because it is an overused phrase, and indeed is the title of a number of songs, not the least of which is The Divinyl's masterpiece. "Pleasure and pain", and its more melodramatic partner "agony and ecstacy", need to be put away for a while . . . but that means a search through the coals of your brain for an alternative; not an easy task."

How about "Naivity & Wisdom", isn't that the same anyway?

 

[icystorm]

Thanks for reading and commenting.

Regarding the one line "With evil her mind conceives" I'd considered alternatives such as...

"With curses her mind conceives"

"With cursed love her mind conceives"

"With cursed sin her mind conceives"

"With dark sin her mind conceives"

"With dark ways her mind conceives"

"With tough love her mind conceives"

...and I may revisit one of those or more. It needs to be impacting because of its position in the chorus.

Regarding the title... I wondered about the commonality of that phrase after I finished writing the song. The song originally started out using "Her Voice" as the working title, but the lyrics with that proposed title weren't coming as easily as they usually do, so I quickly scrapped the idea and started over, rather than forcing it. As it happened, the words "she's pleasure and pain" came very suddenly and fit naturally during the end of the chorus' chords.

I've thought of changing the line and the title to "She's Pleasure, She's Pain", which also works (for me). I'll mull it over.

Cheers,
Joseph (icystorm)

 

[gecko zzed]

In the sense that naivity signifies an innocent ignorance of some of the pitfalls of life, and with wisdom comes the realisation that all is not sweetness and light, then yes, it is the same.

Perversely, naivity is not always pleasant, to which some of my early fumbling memories attest, and with wisdom, those things that caused me so much grief may have been much more pleasurable.

So, I would not hurry to agree that they were the same in all cases. I don't think they are that interchangeable.

I hope that Icystorm does not take up the suggestion, because I don't think you were seriously suggesting it as a possibility . . . I think you were reflecting a slightly world-weary cynicism; a more subtle way of saying "been there, done that".

And just as well, because "Naivity and Wisdom" would be a dreadfully pompous title.

I would be casting further afield than looking for similes. I'd see what I could come up with in metaphors, for example "Barbed wire and bower" (not good, I agree . . . but, something along those lines). "Barbed wire and silk"? "Satin-coated razor"? I don't know . . .it's too hard for me!

I kind of like "On her anvil of deceit" instead of "with evil her mind conceives".

 

[_brian_]

"In the sense that naivity signifies an innocent ignorance of some of the pitfalls of life, and with wisdom comes the realisation that all is not sweetness and light, then yes, it is the same."

Yep that's the correct translation, but please note only a light hearted one , it was a joke

 

[_brian_]

I would be casting further afield than looking for similes. I'd see what I could come up with in metaphors, for example "Barbed wire and bower" (not good, I agree . . . but, something along those lines). "Barbed wire and silk"? "Satin-coated razor"? I don't know . . .it's too hard for me!

As soon as I read that I thought "pins & needles" again sounding contrived & hackneyed, we're turning this song into something with bondage overtones Mabye time to have a rethink? I really have to hear the music to add something of use. I kind of like "in a bed of curses her mind concieves", you may hate it & so may I when I realise it. I just like something with many connections to ideas within the song, double, triple meanings - that kind of thing. Looking at the lyrics you've written they remind me somewhat of "mystery girl" by orbison.

 

[icystorm]

Brian wrote:

> I really have to hear the music to add something of use.

Thanks for reading and commenting.

Here is an early, rough demo of the backing track (no vocals yet).

http://www.box.net/shared/9hb1w3ny80

I will be re-doing the drum loop, but the chord progression is basically set.

I really like "In sin's throes her mind conceives" but the word "throes" is too complicated for many. I may opt for something more basic like, "With sins that her mind conceives".

Also, on the second bridge, the transition from A to Am between the 2nd and 3rd bars doesn't seem exactly like I want it. I'll work on that too. Any thoughts?

Cheers,
Joseph (icystorm)

 

[rayc]

I'll 3rd Gecko on both.
The 1st is a clunker & the title is along the lines Fire & Ice, Hot & Cold, Big & Little.
She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
Cuts me, watches me bleed.

She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
She pollutes my seed.

She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
She's averice, she's greed.

There're a whole pile of alternatives you could use that would reinforce the real rhyme and advance the story. The line doesn't sit well with the rest of your writing either.
The rest of the song is several notches above this one line.

 

[Xeries]

I'll 3rd Gecko on both.
The 1st is a clunker & the title is along the lines Fire & Ice, Hot & Cold, Big & Little.
She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
Cuts me, watches me bleed.

She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
She pollutes my seed.

She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
She's averice, she's greed.

There're a whole pile of alternatives you could use that would reinforce the real rhyme and advance the story. The line doesn't sit well with the rest of your writing either.
The rest of the song is several notches above this one line.

Have a care, Ray. Yes some paired words are trite and I just released aCD called Fire and Life. We all remember Taylor's Fire and Rain.

As far as the above lyrics go, I'm with Gecko. I think you're missing the obvious here. Instead of hunting for a simile, I'd sooner go with a strong metaphor. Weaves, comes to mind implying that she spins a web of lies, which is by of course evil.

But evil is a tough word to sell. I wrote a song called "Walk With Me" where I used it and got slammed on another forum. BTW it's a very good song.

But the "evil her mind conceives is a bow wow. Sorry, have to speak my mind where lyrics are concerned. I usually only do it in a PM, but here Gecko paved the way.

Another troubling word is encaptured. I'm not sure it's really a word, but that's not important. I make up words all the time. But it's awkward.

How about "and captures in her mind?" or something like that.

Captured means the same thing, I think, and isn't as clumsy. HTH

 

[icystorm]

Thank you, RayC, Xeries, Brian, and Gecko for your candid feedback and suggestions. I took some of your feedback and made some changes. For starters, I changed the title to "Her Pleasures". Some of the other changes that I made were brought about, in part, by the feedback posted here. I highlighted the main changes in red. Thanks again for commenting, all!

And here is a pre-demo partial sample of the song with vocals, before I made the latest lyics changes. Yeah, the vocals suck and I'll re-record them for some improvement, but I'm not a singer.

http://www.box.net/shared/jegtane688

Her Pleasures

Words and music by: Joseph Spain
Created with Jamstudio.com, Acoustica Mixcraft 4.1, and Audacity 1.3

verse 1

She's faster than the human eye can see
The end comes quick for her defenseless prey
She made me learn how much a heart can bleed
I still dream of her at night

Obsession's not an easy game to play
Her rules are simple but I make mistakes
Her twist on love can take a life away
She enslaves me with her mind

chorus

She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
With sins that her mind conceives

She melts, she pours
She's everything the flesh adores
She hurts me, she hates me
Her pleasures feed pain

bridge 1

When you love her
You will learn why

verse 2

She's sweeter than a stolen kiss can taste
Her poison love can lay a heart to waste
I crawl to her for more than I can take
of the potion she prescribes

I'm mesmerized by the spell she brews
Her sinful mixture that I freely choose
My heart is hers I'm in her hands to use
I'm a slave within her binds

chorus

She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
With sins that her mind conceives

She melts, she pours
She's everything the flesh adores
She hurts me, she hates me
Her pleasures feed pain

bridge 2

When you taste her
You will learn why
When you please her
You will know

chorus

She's soft, she's sweet
She's everything I'll ever need
She loves me, she breaks me
With sins that her mind conceives

She melts, she pours
She's everything the flesh adores
She hurts me, she hates me
Her pleasures feed pain

(repeat chorus through fade)

 

[rayc]

Xeries,
I like Fire and Life!!!
Fire & Rain isn't quite fire & ice, hot n cold etc.
& there's always the uber credit for coining the phrase, and lesser though still significant credit for being the 1st to use it in popular music.

Back to the lyric though - Some of the tweaking works well, most of the lyric reads really well. I can't get my head around "...with her mnd conceives" though.
It'll probably work with a melody & not too much stress or emphasis. I look forward to hearing it sung - it's amazing how that can make sense of things - emotion, diction & passion can make things work.
Oh, there's a link - I'll give it a listen.
Oh, the title change works a treat.
Listened - You have to scurry to get the next line in after concieves - 2 takes would make that easier.
It works a lot better with a melody.

 

[Xeries]

I took a listen and it sounds good. Real Barry Gibb vibe, to me. The song drives along pretty seamlessly and the lyrics are good. The word "conceives" sounds like "can see" because that's what my mind fills in when you sing it so fast.

ENOUGH ABOUT THE WORD CONCEIVES! You obviously aren't going to let it go, so I'll drop it.

I have to mention that there are some real jewels in these lyrics:

"I crawl to her for more than I can take"

"Her sinful mixture that I freely choose" (I like "A sinful mixture" better)

"She made me learn how much a heart can bleed"

"Her poison love can lay a heart to waste"

"The end comes quick for her defenseless prey" (tough to sing)

"Her rules are simple but I make mistakes."

All of these lines have a cadence with that sweet staccato delivery that you give them.

You have a real knack for writing lyrics.

I pride myself on my lyrics, and I would be proud to have written any of these lines. You're definitely on the right track.

Finish this so we can enjoy it.

 

[icystorm]

Thanks again Xeries and RayC for the kind words, laughs, and general encourement.

RayC -- Your mock line "She pollutes my seed" was a killer!

Xeries, I consider your comments high praise coming from you. Your stuff is consistently excellent, guy. I'm sincere.

BTW, Barry Gibb has been my idol and greatest source of musical inspiration since I was 7, so if I can sing and write songs even one-tenth as good as the master can, I'll be pleased.

"...conceives..."

Yeah, I just couldn't bring myself to abandon my favorite line in the song, man. It's about the sin that this nice girl is using by conceiving unnatural thoughts in her mind's forlorn state.

Well, I just took my prescription sleep medicine, AmbienCR, so perhaps I should finish as the effects come quickly before I become inhoherent.

Seriously, guys, the song isn't literally about BDSM themes. It's about being enslaved to a woman's heart; perhaps emotional torment is involved.

The song is loosely about my high school sweetheart from nearly 25 years ago. Sure, I made great connections with many women since then, and married one of them, but my connection with this one woman and her love is the benchmark in my mind that no one else comes close to measuring up to.

Cheers and thank you for reading and offering me the benefit of your feedback.

--
Joseph (icystorm)

 

[gecko zzed]

Just as the snippet of song fades away, I heard a brief hint of a very Gibb-ish falsetto, reinforcing, as Xeries notes, the strong Barry Gibb influence in the vocals during the chorus, and characteristic breathiness throughout.

So . . . the vocals are smooth, and the lyrics flow pretty well with the melody line. The song progresses nicely (well, the bit that I heard), and the chords and structure, if not highly original, are interesting and make this song very accessible without placing it in the bigger basket of total ho-hum. Having said that, perhaps I do the song a disservice, because I think there is a keychange towards the end of the snippet, and maybe I should wait for a full version.

But . . . you possibly have a bigger problem than choice of lyrics, and that is the similarity to Barry Gibb. You mentioned him as your idol (and he is one of mine too), but too close an emulation and you'll just get, whenever you play your material to someone, "gosh, that sounds so much like Barry Gibb!". Personally, I'd be flattered for someone to say that, but I would really like them to say something like "gosh, that's an original sound you've got there!"

Now . . . you may be happy to live in a Gibb shadow, which is fine. I have no idea what your aspirations are. It would be interesting to explore how you could use the best of your influences to develop something that is uniquely you.


Back to the song . . . It's all sitting nicely so far, and I appreciate that it's a demo, but (as I've mentioned elsewhere in this forum), I crave variety in a song: I look for dynamic contrasts in vocals (which I reckon we'll get okay in this track) and instrumentation (which we are not getting yet). Partly that's because of the unrelenting drum pattern, which tends to moderate any other variation, instead of accentuating it. I also look for sonic variety, so I would be excited if you were to vary not just the dynamics, but also the instrumentation throughout the song.

I like the song, and I think it will scrub up well, and I look forward to hearing the final result!