should I buy this Tascam 38?

H

Hi_Flyer

New member
...so I have wanted to grab a nice reel-to-reel deck for awhile now, but I have been hesitant to pull the trigger... I finally hooked up with a local tascam 38 via craigslist (so I won't have to worry about ebay shipping). The only contact I have had is via e-mail, here is a verbatim description from our correspondence:

"I do have (co-own) a Tascam 38 with 8 channels of DBX - plus lots of RCA cables
-
It's not been used in several years & at last check needed some of it's neoprene
rubber
parts replaced - particularly one that helps in holding the tape to the head -

In it's day, it was both well maintained and had fairly low mileage -
We were the 2nd owners & bought it from a friend who was (still is) very
meticulous
in taking care of it - Once we purchased it from him around 1988, it got very
little use
thru 1992 - then went to the other owner's house where it was stored until about
2002 -

As we sold off our other gear, I brought it to my place as a better storage
environment.
It has all manuals & the original box (kinda beat)"

so the guy says he wants in the neighborhood of $300 for the lot (dbx + deck), is this a fair price? what do you think the replacement parts will cost? what questions should I ask? how can I tell how much use the heads have on them?

I guess I am just looking for some general advice and guidance about negotiating a purchase, any help would be appreciated. thanks.
 
Capstan belts and pinch rollers should be obtainable from TASCAM's parts department and many third party sellers and as a worst case scenario, the pinch roller can be resurfaced. Capstan belt, if needed are around $15.00 bucks and pinch rollers around $60.

Other then that, the other possibilities for service might include cleaning a few oxidized connections and a fresh calibration to ensure that all the levels are good going in and coming back out.

As for checking the heads, look for flat spots on them and on the tape guide posts and tape lifters. Posts and lifter can be rotated to fresh, round sections of the parts and heads can be re-lapped if necessary but odds are, if the seller is truthful, you won't have to worry about that.

As for the price, it sounds like a very fair deal considering these decks, with the dbx units and cables would have originally retailed for over $4000 dollars.

I bought my low mileage 38 with dbx units second hand back in the mid 90's and paid $1500.00, though I didn't have to do any work on mine as it was only a few years old when I got it.

Buy a fresh NEW roll of tape and check it out to make sure it works. Record test tones or plug in a CD player into it and record something on all 8 tracks to make sure everything works or at least has the appearance of working with a bit of TLC.

Cheers! :)
 
Actually, when I bought my pinch roller through Tascam it was no more than 30 bucks. I think about $25. Last I looked the dbx units usually went for about 75 to 100 each. If the belt and the pinch roller are no good it may be hard to test it out. But for that price, if that's all there is, or even with a new head relap it's a great deal.
 
thanks for the replies, I didn't mean to neglect the thread...

The guy isn't sure which part it is, and I'm not exactly up to speed on my reel-to-reel parts so I was hoping that maybe you guys could speculate on which part the seller is describing:

"As stated, the rubber/neoprene part that helps to bring the tape guides up
to hold the tape to the head is deteriorated - I don't know exactly what you
call the part, but perhaps I can pull out the manual and look it up"

so does that sound like he is describing a pinch roller then? If so, other than the pinch roller, I'm probably looking at a new capstan belt? Those are the only rubber parts that would deteriorate over time?

I need to find out what kind of tape its set up for, right? These were set up for Quantegy 456 from the factory, right? is that +6 bias or something like that? (sorry, I'm still learning some of the jargon and technical details!). I'm gonna try to get him to throw in some used tape if possible, what are the years to look out for sticky-shed and how do I tell if the tape is sticky WITHOUT loading it on the machine?

Ghost of FM- Are you suggesting that I should try top record on it when I go out to look at the machine? Or wait until I buy it and then test record to get an idea how well its operating?

What is a ballpark estimate I could expect to pay for a calibration?

If the machine is as described, I'm pretty sure I'm gonna pull the trigger on this one (and I'm psyched!). I passed on one of these for $250 about a year and a half ago and I regretted it. This one might be a better deal though, the other one had some issues...

all the help from the experts around here is VERY much appreciated. thanks.
 
Here is the way I see it.
If the unit comes with two dx-4d dbx units those you could get 100.00 bucks on ebay if you have to try and get some of your money back if the 38 is junk.
If I remember right you will have to have to spend about 16.00 for a belt and 35.00 for a pinch roller and another 10.00 or so for shipping from tascam.
to even try the unit.
If the 38 turns out to be junk you will be able to get back all if not more of your money by piecing out the unit on ebay.
If the capstan motor and board is still good they bring atleast 35.00 and more. The feet even are worth 10 to 15 bucks and the faceplate can bring 35 to 50 bucks. If it still has the head flap thats 30.00 right there.
So if you want to put the work into it you really cant loose to much.
If the pinch roller is bad on the unit dont run any tape through it.
If you can rub your finger across the pinch roller its like sticky tar dont turn the machine on. Also If you do turn the machine on I would try to turn the shaft with your fingers that the pinch roller rides on, its the round metal knob that sticks out. If the capstan belt is bad they can turn to glue also and keep the capstan motor from turning and burn it up cause it cant move.
Sorry about not being able to explain this better. But its about the best I can do.
Good luck with the 38 when its all set up right its a killer machine ;)

Oh and dont be afraid to offer him 250.00 for it. All he can say is no
 
right, I think I get what you are saying about the capstan belt, thanks for the tip...

that's interesting that you suggested selling the dbx units, I may just sell them anyway if I can get decent recordings without them. I plan on doing mainly loud aggressive stuff, and I want to go HARD to tape, get some saturation and maybe a little distortion happening... I thought I read that you shouldn't use dbx if you are hitting tape really hard, is this true?? Or maybe I was thinking of using only 4 tracks of dbx, (like on drum overheads, but not on the kick track, something like that). Is this possible or is it just a dumb idea?

You think I should offer 250 eh? I was thinking of trying to get him to throw some used tape in for the 300. I'm pretty sure he has it, hopefully it won't be sticky shed tape...

how difficult is it to replace parts like the capstan belt and pinch roller? I don't have a ton of experience doing repairs like this, but I can do basic repairs on guitar amps and things like that...
 
What I really ment was if the machine is junk and you want to move on to something else you could sell the dbx units.
Drums would be best recorded without the dbx if you want to hit the tape hard.
The dbx works best with soft things so that tape hiss is not an issue.
 
Hi_Flyer said:
You think I should offer 250 eh? I was thinking of trying to get him to throw some used tape in for the 300. I'm pretty sure he has it, hopefully it won't be sticky shed tape...
Click to expand...

I would strongly advise AGAINST using used tape, particularly if they haven't used the machine in so many years.

-MD
 
really? why? I thought it would be a good idea to at least learn/practice running the deck with used tape since I'm sort of new to the world of reel to reel decks. I'm worried about having an accident or screwing up a reel of $60 brand new tape. I have alot to learn about operating and maintaining this piece of gear...
 
OK, and another question...

I was hoping to use my Mackie Onyx 1220 as a console with the 38. It has DB25 connectors for recording outs, what are the inputs on the Tascam 38? Are they RCA or XLR?

its my understanding that the 1220s are more of a live sound mixer than a recording console (not sure what the difference is?) although it has worked well for my digital recording needs. i also plan to use the 1220 to x-fer the tape tracks to mix in a PC, so are the tape outs on the Tascam 38 XLR or RCA?
 
Hi_Flyer said:
really? why? I thought it would be a good idea to at least learn/practice running the deck with used tape since I'm sort of new to the world of reel to reel decks. I'm worried about having an accident or screwing up a reel of $60 brand new tape. I have alot to learn about operating and maintaining this piece of gear...
Click to expand...


It's hard to screw up a reel of tape.Plus you can get all the help you need here with how to feed it correctly and all that. I would just look over Becks "Sticky Shed" post to see what the bad dates are, any ampex tape and Quantegy before 96 could cause a big mess on the deck. Get the tapes anyway and then check out the sticky shed posts. You can still use the Metal hubs they come on.

Changing the roller and belt is not hard to do. For the belt it's just a matter of removing the face plate and a few screws on the head stack.
 
so you advise against the old tapes because of the sticky shed? OK, that makes sense...

how does the RCA connectors work? Is it one cable per channel? Or are the connections balanced somehow (I'm guessing that will be a 'no')? I'm wondering if I should use another routing option for the tape deck, like maybe the send off on an insert point...
 
yeah, they're all rca, 8 in and 8 out. Not sure how the mixer you have will work with it. If you don't have a buss section you can use direct outs but you'll need 8 inputs too. Best to get a recording board. If it's a live mixer it may not be the quietest or most effective mixer to use.
 
finally got a look at the 38 yesterday. it needs a new capstan belt, so we are unable to test with rolling tape until we get a new one on there, which hopefully I can get in a week or so...

Other than that, the solenoid that controls the tape lifters doesn't seem like it is working. Could it just be because there is no tape threaded? It looks like the rubber seal on the solenoid is all deteriorated, but I'm not sure how that affects operation, the other solenoid at the top (can't remember what it controls) seems to be in the same shape visually, but it does work. Do the tape lifters work only if tape is threaded and running? should this be a concern?

One of the reel motors seems a little slow too. I guess maybe they start to slow down before they die... I've heard that this can also be due to worn out brushes and the brushes are easily obtainable at a hardware store. so how do I know what kind brushes to buy? do I need to remove the motor and take it to the hardware store or what?

Other than that, the heads look good (or at least no excessively worn, there was some oxide that needs to be cleaned), the machine is in good cosmetic cond. it looks like it was well cared for during its working life, then stored away for the last ten years, which was exactly how it was described....

oh yeah, it comes with the original manual, BIG BONUS.
 
Noooooooooo!!!!!

The belt is shot. The washers in the solenoids are shot. Those are the the two prime items to fix, and the rest doesn't sound too bad! Actually, I didn't read about the pinch roller, but it's probably shot too, right? You probably mentioned it already, but I missed it. (Actually the rubber in the solenoids can be cleaned out and done completely without replacement rubber, and it will work just fine).

The bottom solenoid moves the lifters and pinch roller up to the heads and capstan. The top solenoid actuates the hub-brakes. DO NOT try to spin this machine up without fixing that first! The hubs will not spin properly until you've fixed the brake solenoid, and you risk burning out the reel motors!! (or drive transistors)...

!!!!!!!! :eek: :eek: ;)

Let's just say, it's a "project" that requires a fair amount of teardown, but it doesn't sound all that bad! Any machine of the same age might suffer the same problem, even pampered, low-use machines. :eek: ;)
 
the pinch roller is OK. It was replaced shortly before the machine was stored away.

just to clarify, when you say not to spin it up without fixing "this first", you are referring to the fixing the brake solenoid, right? Because the brakes seemed to be working... What is in the solenoid that could possibly not be functioning? its just simply a wire around a piece of metal, right? I was thinking that rubber is just some kind of seal, and has no effect on the function of the solenoid? How would I go about cleaning it, and what should I replace the rubber washer with? (and by rubber 'washer' you are referring to the seal right?)

another question... how long does a reel of tape last 15ips?
 
A Reel Person said:
(Actually the rubber in the solenoids can be cleaned out and done completely without replacement rubber, and it will work just fine).
Click to expand...

I've done this and it works but spraying some contact cleaner with silicone (for lubrication) onto the solenoid shaft, completely restored function. I don't know if this is / was advised but it works. Any thoughts Dave? :confused:
 
OK, OK, weirdly enough a google search led me right back to an old thread on this board that went into more detail on the subject...

https://homerecording.com/bbs/archive/index.php/t-222169.html

Anyway, I think I have a better understanding of the situation now. I'm gonna order one brand new solenoid for the capstan, and try to clean up the brake solenoid and try to save it since it seemed to be at least partly functional.

I appreciate your patience with me, I don't have a thorough understanding of the tape transport mechanism (yet) which is complicated by the fact that I don't have the manual nor the machine in my possession (yet), so I can't easily refer to it...
 
Minor comment, and not exactly related to your questions, but I've found when tracking on my 38 that it's usually not a good idea to record through any sort of patchbay or mixer but rather just directly from your mic preamp or whatever to the tape deck. Remember that everything matters in terms of noise and sound quality- cables, preamps, etc. So if you go direct in from a mic preamp, your signal chain consists of:

Microphone-->mic cable--->mic pre-->cable-->tape deck input

whereas just using one patchbay/mixer will bump it up to:

Microphone-->mic cable-->mic pre-->cable-->patchbay/mixer-->cable--->tape deck input.

This is a good way to double the noise added to your signal, and also unless you manage to get an incredibly transparent patchbay/mixer its output can sound significantly worse than the direct out from your preamp.

Cheers,
theo
 
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