<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>sonusman wrote:
You know, that is the reason that I like the idea of pirated software. Often, these programs are so badly written out of the box. I don't want to go spending $300+ dollars on software that doesn't work. But how would I know unless I tried a "illegal" copy of it. Often, this is how I know what to buy.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
That's where demos come in. Why do you need pirated software when you can download demos for most of the useful applications around.
I recently wanted to buy notation software. I downloaded demos of around 15 different notation programs, spent a couple of days seriously trying them all out, then bought one, and I'm still very happy with my choice.
This doesn't justify piracy.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Definately, the registered version is the better way to go just for tech support.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
For me it's much more than the tech support - it's the morality of the situation. I don't consider myself a thief, and I doubt you do either. But if you use pirated software, that's what you are, plain and simple. You are ripping off someone who has worked hard to produce that software.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>One of the nifty features the software developers can do to "protect" their software is to default obscure settings that more or less force you to call tech support to even know that it is making a difference in how the software performs.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Possible, but unlikely I would think. I work in the software development industry, and this is not a ploy we use nor any other companies I know of (and I have friends in many major Seattle-based software companies).
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Anyway, a lot of discussion has gone into this whole "protection" thing. Steirberg applies some pretty heavy duty protection. A shame since they make such nice stuff.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
The shame is that they feel the need to do this. If people in the music industry didn't so readily use pirated software, Steinberg probably wouldn't see the need to do this.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>But on the other hand, I have heard so many bad things about Cubase that I am afraid to even go their because I can't "legally" try out the program to see just how bad of a mess it is out of the box.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
So do what I did and try the demo - you can download it from their website.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Cakewalk on the other hand only has a silly s/n protection.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yeah, they must just be more trusting.
That's all we use, too, though we don't consider it a form of copy protection. Anything is crackable, so why spend a lot of time and money in copy protection schemes that someone will just break anyway.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Easy enough. I can then try it out and see if the features are adequate for what I want to do...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Or just download the demo from their website.
Again, none of this justifies software piracy. When you take away all the euphemisms, software pirates are simply common ciminals, as are those that use software without paying the owners.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Believe it or not, a lot of software companies have gained "free" help improving their software from the "bandits" that use unregistered versions.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
If so, good on 'em. But it doesn't justify the piracy.
I'm sure if you asked those same software companies whether they'd prefer to have the software pirates so they could use them for free R&D, or not have them at all, they'd choose the latter option.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>So, maybe go a little easy on some of those hackers. A lot of them become very helpful to the developers, and certainly they provide a way of protecting consumers from developers that put products on the market before they are ready. It happens far too often.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Oh, please, give us a break. I'm sorry, but the end doesn't justify the means. It all sounds very nice and altruistic, but the fact is they're not protecting anyone from anything. All they're doing is pushing up software prices for those of us who DO do the honest thing and purchase the software we use.
If you want to try before you buy, get legal demos of the software from the manufacturer. If the manufacturer doesn't have a demo available online, contact them. If they don't have a demo available at all, screw them by not buying their product, not by promoting software piracy as a legitimate alternative.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Anyway, some guy trying to make a few bucks off of the cracked version is out of the "spirit" of hackers. Mostly, these code breakers will just share the stuff for free with those they trust. They didn't crack it to make money, they cracked to see if they could, and possibly to see if it is worth a darn.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
This is true. That doesn't make it any more OK. Once they crack it, and share it with their friends, then it's out there and available and ready for the unscrupulous to put it on a CD and sell for money. Who is at fault here? That's easy...
1. The person who cracked it in the first place. If they just kept it to themselves, I've got no problems (as long as they paid for it, if they actually use it). Once they start giving it to people, I've got problems.
2. The person who picked it up and put it on a CD to make money. This is definitely the biggest schmuck of the bunch, but they wouldn't have the stuff to put on the CD if the hackers weren't making it readily available.
3. The person who uses the cracked software. If they get it for free from somewhere and use it, they're just petty thieves. If they pay for a CD of the stuff, they're also losers ;-)
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Anyway, just my thoughts.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
And, don't get me wrong, you're entirely welcome to your thoughts. But I think our culture is drifting (or has already drifted) dangerously close to the point where software piracy starts getting recognized as something that's OK, rather than what it is - theft, pure and simple.
--Dingo
You know, that is the reason that I like the idea of pirated software. Often, these programs are so badly written out of the box. I don't want to go spending $300+ dollars on software that doesn't work. But how would I know unless I tried a "illegal" copy of it. Often, this is how I know what to buy.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
That's where demos come in. Why do you need pirated software when you can download demos for most of the useful applications around.
I recently wanted to buy notation software. I downloaded demos of around 15 different notation programs, spent a couple of days seriously trying them all out, then bought one, and I'm still very happy with my choice.
This doesn't justify piracy.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Definately, the registered version is the better way to go just for tech support.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
For me it's much more than the tech support - it's the morality of the situation. I don't consider myself a thief, and I doubt you do either. But if you use pirated software, that's what you are, plain and simple. You are ripping off someone who has worked hard to produce that software.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>One of the nifty features the software developers can do to "protect" their software is to default obscure settings that more or less force you to call tech support to even know that it is making a difference in how the software performs.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Possible, but unlikely I would think. I work in the software development industry, and this is not a ploy we use nor any other companies I know of (and I have friends in many major Seattle-based software companies).
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Anyway, a lot of discussion has gone into this whole "protection" thing. Steirberg applies some pretty heavy duty protection. A shame since they make such nice stuff.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
The shame is that they feel the need to do this. If people in the music industry didn't so readily use pirated software, Steinberg probably wouldn't see the need to do this.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>But on the other hand, I have heard so many bad things about Cubase that I am afraid to even go their because I can't "legally" try out the program to see just how bad of a mess it is out of the box.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
So do what I did and try the demo - you can download it from their website.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Cakewalk on the other hand only has a silly s/n protection.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yeah, they must just be more trusting.
That's all we use, too, though we don't consider it a form of copy protection. Anything is crackable, so why spend a lot of time and money in copy protection schemes that someone will just break anyway.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Easy enough. I can then try it out and see if the features are adequate for what I want to do...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Or just download the demo from their website.
Again, none of this justifies software piracy. When you take away all the euphemisms, software pirates are simply common ciminals, as are those that use software without paying the owners.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Believe it or not, a lot of software companies have gained "free" help improving their software from the "bandits" that use unregistered versions.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
If so, good on 'em. But it doesn't justify the piracy.
I'm sure if you asked those same software companies whether they'd prefer to have the software pirates so they could use them for free R&D, or not have them at all, they'd choose the latter option.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>So, maybe go a little easy on some of those hackers. A lot of them become very helpful to the developers, and certainly they provide a way of protecting consumers from developers that put products on the market before they are ready. It happens far too often.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Oh, please, give us a break. I'm sorry, but the end doesn't justify the means. It all sounds very nice and altruistic, but the fact is they're not protecting anyone from anything. All they're doing is pushing up software prices for those of us who DO do the honest thing and purchase the software we use.
If you want to try before you buy, get legal demos of the software from the manufacturer. If the manufacturer doesn't have a demo available online, contact them. If they don't have a demo available at all, screw them by not buying their product, not by promoting software piracy as a legitimate alternative.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Anyway, some guy trying to make a few bucks off of the cracked version is out of the "spirit" of hackers. Mostly, these code breakers will just share the stuff for free with those they trust. They didn't crack it to make money, they cracked to see if they could, and possibly to see if it is worth a darn.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
This is true. That doesn't make it any more OK. Once they crack it, and share it with their friends, then it's out there and available and ready for the unscrupulous to put it on a CD and sell for money. Who is at fault here? That's easy...
1. The person who cracked it in the first place. If they just kept it to themselves, I've got no problems (as long as they paid for it, if they actually use it). Once they start giving it to people, I've got problems.
2. The person who picked it up and put it on a CD to make money. This is definitely the biggest schmuck of the bunch, but they wouldn't have the stuff to put on the CD if the hackers weren't making it readily available.
3. The person who uses the cracked software. If they get it for free from somewhere and use it, they're just petty thieves. If they pay for a CD of the stuff, they're also losers ;-)
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Anyway, just my thoughts.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
And, don't get me wrong, you're entirely welcome to your thoughts. But I think our culture is drifting (or has already drifted) dangerously close to the point where software piracy starts getting recognized as something that's OK, rather than what it is - theft, pure and simple.
--Dingo