Yamaha AW16G Mix nightmare! HELP ME!

[Byzantine fires]

I have owned and recorded on my AW16G for nearly a decade now and although its basically a hobby and not a career I have never mastered the art of mixing a song to perfection on it. The core problem is nothing sounds like its got any balls or punch even f it does on my headphones..it looses it all in the mixing to cd.
Particularly with a hard,rocky track. Everything just sounds distorted,tinny and cluttered when I play it back over my stereo. No its not my stereo that sounds crap as the same mix can sound a bit better on an ipod or in the car.
I think Im missing some basic tips somwhere along the line that are preventing me from making a clear,professional sounding song like any other aritst does. The AW16g has basic compression facilitys etc but I dont really understand these well enough to make them work well for each track. If there is any one out therewho can be bothered to answer a total novice in sound recording I would appreciate any advice / tips on improving original sound inputs into the AW16g also as Im really trying to get to the root of my woes.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

You make no direct reference as to what or where you are actually using to listen to your mixes as you make them, which makes all the difference in the world.

You do mention how the mixes sound in headphones, but don't directly say whether that's how you make your mixes or not. If it is, that's probably a big chunk of your problem right there; it can be very difficult to translate a headphone-only mix to the real world without rather good headphones and an ear for translation.

If not headphones, maybe you can describe more about your monitors and mix station location.

Additionally, if you're trying to compare your mixes to most 21st Century commercial releases, you're fighting a mostly losing battle, as most of those releases have compressed virtually all the life out of them in the name of loudness.

G,

 

[Byzantine fires]

You make no direct reference as to what or where you are actually using to listen to your mixes as you make them, which makes all the difference in the world.

You do mention how the mixes sound in headphones, but don't directly say whether that's how you make your mixes or not. If it is, that's probably a big chunk of your problem right there; it can be very difficult to translate a headphone-only mix to the real world without rather good headphones and an ear for translation.

If not headphones, maybe you can describe more about your monitors and mix station location.

Additionally, if you're trying to compare your mixes to most 21st Century commercial releases, you're fighting a mostly losing battle, as most of those releases have compressed virtually all the life out of them in the name of loudness.

G,

Yes sorry I mix everything now via my headphones (DT100's) but even when I had some Samson Resolv monitors the mixes would not sound much better.
I am not so naive that I expect totally pro sound quality but wondered if I should be getting an external mixing board, would this improve sound quality?? Maybe not if as you say Im not listening on good quality monitors and just on headphones.
When im listening on headphones I feel the urge to make things bassy but when it plays on the stereo it sounds tinny and lifeless .
Ive listened to other people record on AW16G's and the sound is good ,even the actual rock demos on the AW16 G have life and power.Dont get me wrong when I record slow or quiet tracks the effect is great its just when Im trying to sound hard and powerful like Depeche Mode for instance.My methods are crude and as basic as it comes I know but any small step in the right direction would be great.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

When im listening on headphones I feel the urge to make things bassy but when it plays on the stereo it sounds tinny and lifeless .

That's not uncommon; many headphones tend to accentuate the perception of bass - that's easy to do when your smashing your loudspeakers right up against your ear - which will make what sounds good in the phones sound anemic in the outside world.

And when mixing through monitors, monitor placement within the room and the dimensions and content of the room itself can all affect what your hearing when mixing.

If, for example, you set up your mixing station in the corner of the room and/or have your speakers too close up against the walls, this can have a similar effect of artificially boosting the bass you hear when mixing, which will magically disappear when you play back on another system.

Similarly, a poorly-conditioned room with less-than-desirable dimensions will be filled with bass "modes" - areas where the bass response in the room itself gets accentuated here and cancelled or "nulled" there. If you're mixing in a positive bass mode, the same thing can happen as described above.

G.

 

[Arjosy]

Aside from the room issues, mic placement, etc., have you considered exporting your files from the AW16G and importing them into a DAW? Though I'm now 99% Pro Tools, I still sometimes use the 16G for capturing live tracks and then pull them into PT for editing and EQing. You can do the same thing with Audacity which is free and Reaper which is practically free. I've had my 16G for years and years too and I love it for what it is. But I wouldn't really want to try to mix or EQ anything other than the most basic stuff. It's just sooo much easier to experiment in the DAW than in the 16G and you don't have to invest a lot of money if you already have a semi-decent PC.

In any event, don't give up. Just keep plugging away. Nobody learns to do this well overnight. Just my two cents.

 

[Byzantine fires]

Aside from the room issues, mic placement, etc., have you considered exporting your files from the AW16G and importing them into a DAW? Though I'm now 99% Pro Tools, I still sometimes use the 16G for capturing live tracks and then pull them into PT for editing and EQing. You can do the same thing with Audacity which is free and Reaper which is practically free. I've had my 16G for years and years too and I love it for what it is. But I wouldn't really want to try to mix or EQ anything other than the most basic stuff. It's just sooo much easier to experiment in the DAW than in the 16G and you don't have to invest a lot of money if you already have a semi-decent PC.

In any event, don't give up. Just keep plugging away. Nobody learns to do this well overnight. Just my two cents.

thank you for your advice

 

[Terra]

Nobody learns to do this well overnight.

i did! i just forgot everything the next morning...

 

[Byzantine fires]

Aside from the room issues, mic placement, etc., have you considered exporting your files from the AW16G and importing them into a DAW? Though I'm now 99% Pro Tools, I still sometimes use the 16G for capturing live tracks and then pull them into PT for editing and EQing. You can do the same thing with Audacity which is free and Reaper which is practically free. I've had my 16G for years and years too and I love it for what it is. But I wouldn't really want to try to mix or EQ anything other than the most basic stuff. It's just sooo much easier to experiment in the DAW than in the 16G and you don't have to invest a lot of money if you already have a semi-decent PC.

In any event, don't give up. Just keep plugging away. Nobody learns to do this well overnight. Just my two cents.

God Im such a novice. Please could you elaborate a bit on how I would transfer the tracks from the 16G to a DAW. Im not even sure what a DAW is. I thought my 16G was a Digital Audio Workstation (DAW) ..I must be wrong.
If I copied all the tracks onto a cd via the internal burner on the 16G how would they be converted then at the other end on a computer or DAW? Is there a clear,easy function that can then seperate and mix each track individually on Audacity for example. I am desperate for everything Ive done over the last decade to sound better than a good demo. Tired of being average coz (sorry to be big-headed) but Im constantly told the songs are very good but I know the mix lets the "tune" down every time in my head.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Im not even sure what a DAW is. I thought my 16G was a Digital Audio Workstation (DAW) ..I must be wrong.

No, you're absolutely right. Some folks these days think DAW means only the non-linear editing (NLE) or mixing software that runs on a personal computer, others think it means the computer. Those are all correct as far as they go, and incorrect in thinking that's only as far as the definition goes. "DAW" simply means "Digital Audio Workstation" and can refer to ANY kind of digital audio recording/editing system, whether they are all-in-one dedicated boxes like your Yamaha or personal computers being used for the same purpose, or hybrid systems that contain some of both.

What I think Arjosy is actually saying is that the effects and processing tools available via plug-ins for computer software as well as the editing workflow and options in computer-based DAW software can often be better, easier to use and more varied than the tools built into the 16G. And that can improve what you cn do with your mixes somewhat. And he's be right about that.

At the same time, though, without a decent enough room, a decent enough set of monitors, a decent enough recording chain, and the ears to use them, even the computer software isn't going to do much for you.

G.