when to normalize?

[miroslav]

So, if I sing 6" away from a mic, then turn up the preamp gain, my voice will be amplified. Any other noise will also be amplified, but if it's farther away than my voice, the amount of amplification is much smaller than my close voice.

You're making assumptions about the distance of the noise-to-mic.
Just because YOU step back away from the mic it doesn't necessarily mean the noise is also stepping back equally...unless it's a very localized noise, in which case just pick up the mic and yourself...and move away from it altogether.

If you step up to the mic, then you've increased your signal to noise without touching the preamp gain.

 

[mixsit]

I disagree. Remember, sound power is an inverse square.
If you stand beside a jet and measure the sound level (power) say you get 189 db. As you move away from the source, the sound level drops by a factor of two. So, if I sing 6" away from a mic, then turn up the preamp gain, my voice will be amplified. Any other noise will also be amplified, but if it's farther away than my voice, the amount of amplification is much smaller than my close voice.

Inverse square rule only says that as a sound's distance increases its SPL lowers due to it spreading out. A doubling of a close mic-to source distance is a greater ratio of change and thus more impact on its level than the far sound's SPL. I.e. the source-to amb ratio gets worse.

But what you are proposing is that voltage -gain change affects this SPL ratio of the pickup of a sound at a given point..?

How bout the other direction, we pad the voltage down, near equal spl..?

 

[Bobbsy]

I disagree. Remember, sound power is an inverse square.
If you stand beside a jet and measure the sound level (power) say you get 189 db. As you move away from the source, the sound level drops by a factor of two. So, if I sing 6" away from a mic, then turn up the preamp gain, my voice will be amplified. Any other noise will also be amplified, but if it's farther away than my voice, the amount of amplification is much smaller than my close voice.

Wrong on a couple of counts.

If you were standing 12 inches from the mic then move to 6 inches (i.e. half the distance) the actual change means that your voice will be four times as loud (not double). That would be a good thing from a noise reduction point of view.

However, if you stay the same distance and simply apply some gain, that gain is applied equally to all levels so, although your voice gets louder, so does the background noise.

Basically, the inverse square law you mention only applies to sound in air, not to electronic gain. Think of it like light through a small window. Right up against the window, the total amount of light is illuminating whatever you put there. However, each time you double the distance from the window, the light level is quartered because of the way the light spreads out. The same thing applies to sound. Each time you double the distance, the effective level is quartered.

 

[Farview]

I disagree. Remember, sound power is an inverse square.
If you stand beside a jet and measure the sound level (power) say you get 189 db. As you move away from the source, the sound level drops by a factor of two. So, if I sing 6" away from a mic, then turn up the preamp gain, my voice will be amplified. Any other noise will also be amplified, but if it's farther away than my voice, the amount of amplification is much smaller than my close voice.

If you are 6 inches away from the mic and your voice hits -12dbfs and the background noise measures -24dbfs and you turn the gain of the preamp up 6db, you voice will now be -6dbfs and the background noise will be -18dbfs.

You are turning up the signal that the mic generates, the distance only matters before the mic picks up the sound. Once the mic turns the sound into an electrical signal, the entire signal will be amplified in a linear way. Everything will be amplified equally, the voice and the background noise, by the same amount.

 

[DrewPeterson7]

There you go then- you actually got down to your specific action.
I can know exactly want I might want in a function- I just have to keep looking up which they're called
Here's one, doesn't show the graphic for it but you'd be doing upward expansion then.
compressor, gate and expander
Signals above the rotation point on a graphic comp would increase.

Shit, that, then. So from a mastering standpoint, at least, IS that the preferred alternative to normalizing?

 

[mixsit]

IS that the preferred alternative to normalizing?

No. That's just a list of tools, and their functions.



What's the last thing in the chain usually? A limiter. It's output (threshold assuming it's brickwall there to catch strays and/or do however much compacting-) is set -0.5 or so. You raise the gain going into it to where you want it, done.

IDK, seem to me you whould have picked the tools to get your sound done, then they're in place all ready- volume, trims, etc you just use them to dial the track up or down, along with a peak meter.. So why even the extra 'normalize move?

 

[chuckduffy]

i want to normalize this thread.

 

[robgreen]

If I stand closer to the mic, will it improve my words to understanding ratio of the contents of this thread?

I'm using a circa 1982 brain and a fairly limited processing unit. I currently have no budget to speak of for upgrades.

 

[chuckduffy]

If I stand closer to the mic, will it improve my words to understanding ratio of the contents of this thread?

I'm using a circa 1982 brain and a fairly limited processing unit. I currently have no budget to speak of for upgrades.

man i am circa 1967 and feeling it. my rig is dead so i can't normalize anything. i am flat broke. i can't work on anything. don't have any new music to post in the mp3 forum. i've resorted to using this site like it was originally intended. wandering around aimlessly responding to random stuff with things I read on some other site but never actually tried.

 

[mixsit]

man i am circa 1967 and feeling it. ...

Hah! 67' Puppies!

 

[robgreen]

man i am circa 1967 and feeling it. my rig is dead so i can't normalize anything. i am flat broke. i can't work on anything. don't have any new music to post in the mp3 forum. i've resorted to using this site like it was originally intended. wandering around aimlessly responding to random stuff with things I read on some other site but never actually tried.

That sucks man. What's broken in your setup?

Hope you find a way out of the impasse and get back to making some tunes soon - the mental image of chuck the ghost haunting the board with no sense of purpose or means of avenging your deceased rig is a sad one

 

[chuckduffy]

That sucks man. What's broken in your setup?

Hope you find a way out of the impasse and get back to making some tunes soon - the mental image of chuck the ghost haunting the board with no sense of purpose or means of avenging your deceased rig is a sad one

I dunno really - all kinds of goofy dropouts and the like. Too frustrating to use. I just tore it all apart trying to figure it out, then gave up. Coupled with the fact that I have a piano, drums, guitar amp, desk and recording equipment shoehorned into an untreated 10X12 room with 7ft ceilings (home office) - and my mixes take me WEEKS of a/bing on various equipment to get anywhere I want them. It's all just too frustrating.