What's the best way to synch choruses so their completely onbeat?

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half-fiction

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Over the years I've always just put things where I thought they sounded close. Obviously there has to be an exact science on how you could do this perfectly. Can anyone help me on how I could do this? I use Adobe Audition. Thanks a ton....
 
Well most any DAW app will let you line up stuff on-beat pretty easily...using your eyes and ears.

However, I wouldn't assume that having all things be on-beat is going to sound always the best.
Everything has a certain phrasing that gives it a human feel. If you line up stuff too perfectly...it will actually sound unnatural.

But...your ears should help you decide where it sounds best...and for that, you have to nudge, listen, nudge listen, nudge, listen...etc.
Yes its time consuming, which is why I think you're looking for an easy "scientific" way to just have things line up...but that's the only way to get it where it needs to be.

Or...when the choruses are sung/recorded...just leave them as they fall. They may not be PERFECTLY in sync...but they may not need to be.
 
Wait, are you talking about chorus the section of a song or chorus the effect?
 
Good point...I assumed he was talking about a vocal chorus....?
 
noisewreck said:
Wait, are you talking about chorus the section of a song or chorus the effect?
Click to expand...

Yeah, I was gonna answer with basically what Miroslav said, but then I thought the same thing you did...
 
I mean a full chorus........ For instance in a song you're going to have your chorus 4 times.... How can you place the chorus 4 times exactly the same... Meaning choruses 2-4 sound on beat exactly the same as the first one..... How can I do that?
 
half-fiction said:
I mean a full chorus........ For instance in a song you're going to have your chorus 4 times.... How can you place the chorus 4 times exactly the same... Meaning choruses 2-4 sound on beat exactly the same as the first one..... How can I do that?
Click to expand...
Sorry man, maybe I'm being thick but I am having hard time understanding your issue. Are you saying that you are having hard time recording a section of a song and having it in time with the rest? Or, have you already recorded your chorus and just doing copy/paste for all the other sections? Either way, I am having trouble understanding why you'd have difficulty either playing on beat, or being able to copy/paste something and line it up in your DAW.

And why would you want to do something 4 times exactly the same in a tune, unless it's some cliche dance track made to shake booty, but can't listen to more than 2 minutes if it was just on the radio? :D
 
I think he means, instead of singing the chorus every time it happens in the song, he wants to copy and paste it. So, I guess the question is "how do you figure out exactly where to drop them in so that they're seemless with the rest of the song?"

If you record your music to a click track, it should be pretty easy. Just copy the chorus from the first beat of it's first bar, and drop it in on the first beat of the bar you want to paste it to.

If you're working with pre-recorded "beats", I'm not sure because I have no experience with that, but I'm pretty sure most soft-ware can "detect" a tempo and show you where the beats and bars fall. I'm sure someone who knows more about this can help more than me.
 
Yeah I'm talking about pre-recorded beats.... Where the beat is already mixed down.. So there isn't a trackout.... Generally I can figure it out.... But sometimes no matter what I do it doesn't fit perfectly... I wanted to know if there was a way I could count the bars to perfectly line stuff up....
 
Flying the hook in...

I think he's talking about "flying the chorus". Where you record the hook / chorus & overdubs once, and fly (or copy) it over to the rest of the choruses. I use two methods, depending upon if my session is on a grid or not.

If the session is not on a grid, often I will listen to the entire song, and lay markers where the chorus's drop in. Then once I lay my markers, I trim the leading edge off of the regions or tracks I am copying over, so that there is no dead space in front of initial attack of the first waveform. I'll then copy the track(s) over to the first marker, and so on. A lot of times when I use this method, I will take the instrumental track, and put it right above the recorded chorus track(s) and sometimes there's a good indication in the waveform of the beat, where the chorus drops in, and you can visually line up the waveforms to help you save some time from nudging the tracks back and forth into place.

The second method I use, when my session is on a grid, I will trim the regions as tight as possible to the beginning and end of the waveform. Then I will look at the grid, and see what bar & beat the choruses come in at, and I will use spot mode to drop them right into place, on the grid. No huss or fuss.

Just make sure, as always, that you perform all of your editing tasks and overdubs/stack time alignments before you copy all of the hooks over. That way everything is nice and consistent, and "fly's" right over! :)

As a side note, sometimes I do not encourage "flying the hook" on certain songs, as the songs sometime lose momentum, and become "stale". Sometimes I will fly a hook over, and stack on a few overdubs, adlibs, or a "hype track" over the top of each flown in hook to help keep the music moving, and energy flowing.

Hope this is the answer you were looking for!

Nick
 
What Nick said...

But that assumes you know the exact tempo of the beat.

Lets say the beat was made with a different program than the one you're mixing in...

Example: Logic's 100bpm may not (and most likely wont) line up PERFECTLY with your 100bpm grid in, lets say, Cubase. In this case, your best bet is to use your ears -- get them all as close as you think, take a 15 minute break, come back and listen WITHOUT LOOKING at the screen, and see if you nailed it.

If you used the same program for both, just set it to grid mode (or the equivalent) and copy the chorus region then paste wherever you need it.

Note: When copying, make sure your region starts and ends on a zero point of the waveform, otherwise you'll hear an audible click (clip) when the copied region plays/ends. You can also rid this by crossfading.
 
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