What mixer? mics? Many questions!

[Masterofnone]

Alright, so I've been into audio for my entire life, and I'm more knowledgeable about most aspects of this stuff than any of my friends, including the musicans. Sadly that's not saying much. So, a few friends bugged me about helping their band out and after a while, DIY recording was going to be my new hobby, and I went out and bought a UB1202. Mistake!

So, taking the advice of a buddy of mine, I've decided to sell the Behringer and get something worth messing with. I won't be making ANY money at this, so I'm on a strict budget, as to leave some $$ for other things, and I'm pretty broke now

I'd love to have a multrack computer-ran system, Shure mics, and all that jazz, but now, I'd just like to put together something serviceable. If there's one thing in this world I hate, it's trying to make a masterpiece with equpitment that barely works on a good day.

So, I've found a good deal on a 16-channel Yamaha mixer, and I was wondering if that would do the trick? I don't need a powered one either...whew, dodged that bullet!

I'd like to find some mics that are decent and siginficantly cheaper than your average SM58 as well.

Also, I've noticed a lot of people hate mixers with built in mic preamps. I noticed the Behringer's were abysmal after borrowing a Shure unit, so should I get some preamps, or will the ones in a decent mixer do it? I'll probably need some anyway, because the drummers I'll end up working with all like about 10 mics on their kits. The good news there is I won't be dealing with a lot of other insturments, so I can use a fairly small mixer.

I'll probably build my own monitors when the time comes that I need some.

Suggestions and ideas greatly apprecaited.

 

[Massive Master]

I'll probably build my own monitors when the time comes that I need some.

This will probably end up being your first and biggest mistake - Monitors should be at the absolute top of your priority list. You can not tweak what you can not hear - End of story, period. Get the best you can as soon as you can. There are huge amounts of gear out that that has "inadequacies" that, while they might not be able to be completely overcome, can at least be "worked around" a bit. Lemonade from lemons to a point - But ONLY if you can accurately assess what you're hearing. The greatest gear in the world isn't going to help if the monitoring isn't up to par.

If everyone started with decent monitoring from the first step, I'd bet that half of the questions that come up on the forums would never be posted.

A chain is only as strong as its weakest link - Your monitoring will decide whether the entire chain has the potential to lift a set of keys - or the entire house.

 

[Masterofnone]

You're right...I guess I forgot that! (Who says you don't forget lessons you learned the hard way!) I know how expensive a primo set of monitors can be, and I can't afford that expense, and I don't think I could bring myself to spend the money unless I proved that it wouldn't be a waste and that I'm doing it enough & well enough to warrant the expense. I don't know that yet, so I'm not about to throw money away.

Come to think of it, I've got a pair of satelite speakers that we built about 5 years ago for a graduation present for my cousin, and these are the best small speakers I've ever heard. Could I use these as monitors? I asume I'd need some form of amp...what could I get that's portable and cheap?
Thanks
--Kyle

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Kyle,

What kind of budget are you thinking about for all this stuff? It's kinda hard to make recommendations without knowing how much you have to spend in what amounts of time. It would be just as easy to make recommendations for $500, $5000 and $50,000, and there will be a difference in the quality of your "masterpiece" with every one of them.

I assume you're not talking the $50G setup, but even the difference between $200 and $500 will make a huge difference in recommedation.

G.

 

[Masterofnone]

The less the better...I'm hoping to get started for under a grand. As far under a grand as possible. I found a few lightly used 16-channel Yamaha mixers for ~$120, and found out that the mic's we used last time are less than $20 each. Sure, it's no SM58, but I was pretty surprised at the bang-for-the-buck. I figure those mics, mixer, and a few mic stands, and a decent sound card should get me going for pretty cheap. I also found some screaming deals on monitors, but anymore, I'm suspicous of any cheap premade speaker.

My goal is portability....fit the mics and mixers in a laptop case, and get an amp smaller than the average home stereo reciver for the monitors. That is, after goal #1: cheap!

To use a line from my car-restoring hobby "Speed costs money, so how fast can you afford to go", and I know this is similarly expensive, so I know that everything won't be really cheap, but so help me, until I need it, I won't buy the top-line high $$ stuff, or buy something that has a disporportionate $$ vs. perfromance factor. I wouldn't hesitate to upgrade to say, all Shure mics and a Mackie later, but first I need to start.
Thanks
kyle

 

[pandamonk]

Ok, if you're wanting multitrack then by the price of the yamaha i don't think you'll get multitrack. One multitrack solution could be the Alesis MultiMix 12 Firewire which is $374.37 here. It comes with Cubase LE. Ask around the microphone forum for good mics, preferably large diaphram condensers. Then, i suggest you buy good monitors. Or you could get the Presonus Firepod, giving you 8 XLR(mic)/jack inputs and MIDI I/O, which many people here recommend, here for $529.00 with Cubase LE, or here for $899.99(around $1130 if bought separately)with Cubase LE, a pair of monitors, headphones, mic stands, XLR cables, jack cables, a large diaphram conderser mic, and a small diaphram condenser. I suggest the latter. Then if you don't like using the mouse and want a hands on feel you could get the Behringer BCF-2000 control surface for $176.75 here, which also gives another MIDI input if you were to ever need it.

 

[Masterofnone]

Ok, if you're wanting multitrack then by the price of the yamaha i don't think you'll get multitrack. One multitrack solution could be the Alesis MultiMix 12 Firewire which is $374.37 here. It comes with Cubase LE. Ask around the microphone forum for good mics, preferably large diaphram condensers. Then, i suggest you buy good monitors. Or you could get the Presonus Firepod, giving you 8 XLR(mic)/jack inputs and MIDI I/O, which many people here recommend, here for $529.00 with Cubase LE, or here for $899.99(around $1130 if bought separately)with Cubase LE, a pair of monitors, headphones, mic stands, XLR cables, jack cables, a large diaphram conderser mic, and a small diaphram condenser. I suggest the latter. Then if you don't like using the mouse and want a hands on feel you could get the Behringer BCF-2000 control surface for $176.75 here, which also gives another MIDI input if you were to ever need it.

I'm glad I was sitting down when I read that. I build my own speakers, unless I can score a deal, and I'm not very lucky. I didn't expect digital OR multitrack in my budget, and I haven't found any compelling deals yet, but thanks for the ideas. After my most recent experiences with a set of Berhinger monitors, I wouldn't walk across the street if they were giving away all the Behringer stuff. To quote one of my friends "Behringer is cow s**T!" It must just be some people are luckier than me, because all the Behringer stuff I've used so far is unbeliveably poor.

 

[pandamonk]

The Behringer control surface does absolutely nothing except give you hands on control of what you have on the screen. Have a read. I only suggested it as a possible upgrade, and you certainly don't need it. You could get by with the Firepod bundle. Here is a review of the speakers.

 

[pandamonk]

Another option is to get that yamaha mixer you were saying about, and one of these. If the mixer is small it will probably have 2 main outs and 2 aux sends. Connect this to the delta by having main out left and right going to 1 and 2, and aux 1 and 2 going to 3 and 4. This will allow you multitrack of 4 channels, and any more you will be able to group. Say you want to record 4 at once, have channel 1 panned hard left, 2 hard right, 3 the fader down with aux 1 send up(if prefade), and 4 fader down with aux 2 send up. For any more channels do this same thing.