what are your gigs paying

[Track Rat]

I haven't been in a working band in two years but I'm putting a couple of different things together right now. One with a band doing original material but it's not country , and also an acoustic duet thing which from time to time will be all over the dial.
The Yellow Rose was about 3 miles from my house. I installed the sound and video system in Russo's in the same strip mall in 93. Now if you want to see that level of country type band, there's Incahoots out in Earth City. There was a place out on Kingshighway & 44 called Jersey Lill's but it's a Salsa club now. I bet I've played in every bucket of blood in the three state region.

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

Hey Track Rat, where did I get the idea you were an Aussie? Better read from now on.
Ha! Say, did you ever play country? Seein how your in corntry country? I played in a Hot country band here for a long time. Untill the no smoking laws hit. 5 major country bars(all of em here for 50 years or more)closed in a year. Country died here then. Too bad. I'd rather listen to a good steel player anyday!
fitz

 

[bongolation]

Yeah, Sacramento is one of the most quietly strange cities on the planet. Why people move there, I can't imagine. I inheirited a house free and clear here, otherwise I wouldn't spend the night in this place. It absolutely sucks the very life out of you.

Pushing 1,500,000 people in the area, mostly young - no scene, absolutely none. Lots of "trendy" but no "hip." Zero.

Every musician with anything on the ball leaves to go ninety miles to San Francisco, and a shocking amount of San Francisco musicians and artists move to Sacramento to retire or woodshed or just die. It's called the "elephant's graveyard of San Francisco artists."

The Guitar Center here is one of the largest-selling stores in the entire chain, and did almost double the projected gross in its first year. A couple hundred thousand musicians, all buying gear like mad, but practically no bands and no gigs.

It's like a black hole. It's getting to be a joke.

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

Hello bongolation, cool, very fucking cool Suckramento is an understatement but I loved it once. But now, it can kiss my ass. So can Citrus Heights City Hall. I guess I'm not the only one, and I've lived here thirty years. Never thought about leaving untill this year. I feel like I'm in....well lets say, not the USA. Sucks bigtime, everything, including the gestapo. Have you seen BADCOP.com. Suckramento's at the top of the list. Take a look. It confirmed my thoughts. Thats why I have an offer in on a house in OREGON. It beauuuuuuuuuuatiful there. Clean water, clean air, no noise, no traffic, green mountains, REAL nice people, realistic prices, no DUST, and NO fucking gestapo goons and most of all, NO CALIFORNIA!!!!! Hey, where you live? So your one of the Guitar Center customers. I went in there ONE time, and I guess they figure your not supposed to be a musician unless your under 20yrs old. I didn't spend my money there. Assholes. I've played in this town for 30 yrs, and NEVER got that kind of treatment anywhere. Punk kids, think they know everything, I got news for them. They don't know shit. They just eat it. I feel for them. They'll be stuck here. Not me.
fitz

 

[crawdad]

In the last six years, the club and bar circuit has dwindled here. There used to be so many working bands. Now, if they ARE working, they are making crap money. I played in a blues band here for a number of years, but all the clubs folded. I was forced to do a one man band thing and play restaurants and parties. The money is a lot better but the satisfaction is much less. I grew up playing in bands and did it all my life. Playing to sequences is not so satisfying.

If I'm in a restaurant, I make $175-$200 a night. Private parties can get me $400-$600 a night, when they happen.

Yeah, it seems like the live band is quickly becoming a museum piece. It does suck, because there are some really incredible musicians here and elsewhere who should be getting great money for their talents.

I think that somehow the American public has lost all appreciation for good music. They don't "get it" anymore. I hear that the audiences in Europe still really get into live music. In America, with everybody seemingly trying to live their lives like a Coors beer commercial and those attached values, they are too busy looking either in the mirror or down some girls blouse to stop and take in any musical communication. The dumbing down of America is complete.

 

[stonepiano]

hey fitz,

I lived in Sacto last year. What bars did you play? Ironsides is a cool ass place. i've got some pics of me doing my only Sac show there.
They had this cool soundman that seemed to get the best of every band. Old black guy but I can't remember his name. Anyway, said he was working at a there studio too. thought maybe you've heard of him.

I also just did an interview with Vince DiFiore of Cake and he raved about playing there. Said the crowds didn't know what to expect so whatever you gave them was interesting. I far prefer a place like that to NY or LA for developing as a musician....just my opinion.

Miles

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

Hello Crawdad, the dumbing down is indeed happening. I talked to 2 european musicians 15 yrs ago, who told me something I've never forgot. They said "there is no culture in America. Its like a cultural slum. Devoid of real art, appreciation of art, just vulgar commercialisim. The average person in europe is raised in culture, and the appreciation of it. Music, painting, sculpture, dance, architecture. In america, its psuedo, in europe its real." I'm afraid its true. We have only been here 200+ years. They have been around for thousands of years. Were raised on McDonalds. They are raised on fine wine. Musicians here are treated like second class citizens. Ever tried to get a credit card with "Musician" as your occupation. Ha! Might as well put down BUM. But I know why. So do you. I won't go there.
In 1962, I played my first so called club gig. At the end of the evening, as I was about to be paid my big $25, a man stepped up to me and asked for my union card. I said what are you talking about. He introduced himself as the local Musicians Union rep, and this was a Union club, so I have to be union to play. I said I wasn't a UNION musician. He went to the club owner, and took my pay, as membership fees. I started to punch him. But I was grabbed by 2 muscle men, taken out back, and roughed up real bad. I joined. From that point on for 2 years, at the end of the week, I gave my weekly dues to this motherfucker. About $14 a week. And for what. Nothing. Absolutely nothing. Thats where "paying your dues" came from I've paid mine in full . But everytime I paid him, I spit on the money first. He took it. In 1964, the first club to resist the union opened. I was in the first band to play there.(the second band was called The Skalleewags or something, but they were CREEDENCE CLEARWATER). I never gave another cent to that fucking gestapo union. Eventually the Union died a natural death. In a way, I regret that now. Had the musicians stuck together in a Union that was not Mafiaized, we might have had an impact on our wages over time. But that was then, and this is now. And those club owners that I worked for, made a LOT of money then. The clubs were packed. They drove mercedes, and bought property here that is now worth millions. There were 5 of them. The had a small circuit. They knew each other, and they worked together to control the bands pay in ALL the clubs in those days. They now each own a fine restuarant and bar in OLD SACRAMENTO. Thats the big tourist place here along the river. They STILL control their little circuit. And pay is still $50 fucking dollars a night. I haven't heard a musician say the word UNION in 30 years. Too bad.
fitz

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

Hello stonepiano, boy the posts happen here faster than shit. You snuk that one in before I could get the last one typed. Ha! Say guys, don't take my rants to seriously. I had some TREMENDOUS times playing here. In fact, I played so many big concerts at the time I can't remember them all. That was at the height of the British invasion. We were the promoters house band. I was all of 17 yrs old. But we were an AMERICAN KICK ASS BAND and didn't take NO shit from some limy band. Let me tell you a short story.
Ever heard of the Cow Palace? Its a HUGE ASS concert hall in Frisco. We were the house band that had to play for all the pathetic singers in those days who didn't have a band. They all toured together from a TV show called Shindig. I was the only player who knew a little theory, so I got to sit with each singer for 5 min. and learn their "hit" song. Never any fucking charts. Only them singing it to me. Had to learn 8 to 10 new songs in an hour. And then, call out the chords to the other players LIVE . In those days the show would start with the Shindig "stars", then we got to play a couple of our tunes. Then, the headliners would play, with the top biller playing last. On this particular show, the BEACH BOYS were top biller. The KINKS were second billed. We had played a show the week before in RENO where the KINKS
were top billed. After that show, we got into an ass kicking fight with the KINKS. What a bunch of fucking morons. Anyway, at the beginning of this show, we heard a rumor that the KINKS wouldn't play because they wanted to be top billed and play last. Ha, guess who won. When it came time for us to play our shit, we brought the house down(50some thousand screaming girls)cause we kicked rock and roll in the ass. After our last song, the host announcer screamed "Ladies and Gentleman, THE KINKS. Were still onstage behind the equipment. We wait. And wait. And wait. No Kinks. So I looked at the other guys, and they immedietly knew what I was thinking. Before anyone could do anything, I kicked off "You really got me", we jumped out on stage , and played the shit out of that fucking song for 15 minutes. We brought the house down. And the Kinks. Cause basically, we BURNED that tune, live. I don't think I've ever seen anyone as pissed as the KINKS. But what was even greater, after that, the BEACH BOYS came out, and after us, they sounded like a mealy mouthed garage band, in diapers. HA! Now that was FUN!!!

But you know I'm an old fart now. I still play with friends, and I have a small home studio for fun. Nothing serious. And BTW, during my time, I played ALL the clubs here, through the beatle era, the acid era, the funk era, the frisco jazz era, the country era.
You mentioned Cake. I had already quit playing in rock clubs, and was playing at every
dive and afterhours country bar in northern calif. And you know what. We still kicked ass. 2 fiddles, steel, electric mandolin, piano, drums and I played guitar. Met some motherf....ing musicians playing country. Afterhour jam sessions. I played Loyyd Hickeys 40 Grand for 2 years. 4 nights a week and from 9 till when ever on Fri and Sat nights. Sometimes we didn't quit. We played the whole fucking weekend. Got drunker than a skunk by sunday though. But DAAAAAAAAMN did I meet some hot pickers. We wern't too bad ourself, but some of these mothas WHEEEEEEEW!!!SCARY. Tempos from hell. And not just country. A lot of jazz. Don't tell me country pickers are goofs. Ha, get up there at afterhours with some of these guys, but you better be prepared to smoke!!!! Well gents, hope you enjoyed the story. Don't laugh at me to hard. I'm still human and get my feelings hurt just like you. So no flames, or I'll kick your ass.
fitz

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

PS, this is hometown for Cake(I think, cause I wasn't into rock then, but I worked at SKIPS during that time)so naturally hometowns SCREAM for winners! Never heard them myself.
fitz

 

[crawdad]

Rick--I couldn't agree with you more. Americans as a whole (there are exceptions) don't know anything about culture. We are an eat, drink, fuck and conquer culture. Pretty barbaric, really. Why do you think football is the biggest sport here?! Its a representation of how this country thinks.

As for the Mafia, I mean Union, yeah--they pulled all those tricks on me. Took my money and left me to fend for myself. Bastards.

I did have one run for a year or two where I actually got some help from the Union--both for rehearsal space and legal representation on a broken contract. That was cool. But they were out of touch with the times as the times changed.

Makes little difference now. Live music will be a thing of the past soon enough, except as a hobby. Ever wonder why so much music sucks today? None of these bands have had any experience honing their craft night after night in front of real people. Now that clubs are few and far between and pay for shit, you aren't going to see any more real bands with roots, depth, and the seasoning that comes from applying the craft night after night. I'm not sure one can become very successful artistically by living in a vaccuum. If Hendrix hadn't played with all those chitlin circuit bands and had a chance to grow, he would not have emerged.

There IS incredible music here but its not mainstream. If Time WarnerAOL whatever keeps pushing all this crap, they'll kill all the roots that America has as far as music goes. Ah, but at least we'll have football and internet porno as well as beer. You know--the really important cultural things.

 

[crawdad]

The best musicians I ever worked with were country players. They could do that--PLUS everything else. Scary cats!

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA Thats funnier than shit! Your too good! My kind of cat!! How ya doin tonight crawdad, kind of late there isn't it? Hmmmmmm, maybe not for a "crawdad"!
fitz

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

PS, I agree with every last word!
fitz

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

None of these bands have had any experience honing their craft night after night in front of real people.

Holy shit, you mean to tell me theres "real" bands still in existance? Crap, call the smithsonian quick! We might save a few!

 

[Krakit]

If you're in it for the money, become a musical prostitute.

In other words form or join a tribute band.

When I was in the Soft Parade we charged a minimum of $4000 per show. I went home with $1000 in my pocket at the end of each performance and we had as many as three in a week.

The catch? It crushes your creativity and individuality. To command the beucoop green you have to become the character. A complete imposter if you will.

I spent $300 for imported italian eyeglass frames (with my prescription in it of course) to get that exact Ray Manzerek look. Not to mention dying my hair growing mutton chops (that itched like hell) and losing my trademark 'stache that I had since I could grow fur on my upper lip. And the clothes I had some of the funkiest clown suits you ever did see.

For years I convinced myself that it was all worth it because the money was fantastic and I was making music for a living. After a few years, such justification dosen't cut it anymore.

Still, if you can put up with the lifestyle (haveyou seen the movie "Rock Star"? it's very close to how it is) pick a popular band (ain't no money in a Frank Zappa or ELP tribute band, sorry) and "become".


Carl

 

[scottboyher]

Wow

I see it isn't just here that things went to shit. If it wasn't for the blues bands around here there would be pretty much nothing. Yeah there are a few bands playing Linkin Park and the like every other song but man that shit gets old and loud.

All those instruments turned up loud all mixed up together you can't hear anything. You would never know if the guitarist or drummer is any good anyway.

I have lived in the St Louis area all my life and for the first time I wouldn't even know where to go to see a good band.

 

[stonepiano]

holy christ Fitz,

That story is fucking unbelievable! Fuck the Kinks. They always seemed like a bunch of self-absorbed fairies to me anyway...

(note to self: throw away Village Green Preservation Society LP)

I obviously have no cool stories like that but I did meet Bob Dylan at the Golden Globes in 2000. Told him I play one of his songs. Think he's ever heard that one before?

stone

 

[VOXVENDOR]

Everyones sitting at home Downloading live bootlegs from their favorite band.... Clubs are not cool anymore....

In the 80's Hamilton had a great rock scene... It's still here but somewhat lesser than then.

Most decent bands Clear $400 a night..... Or $250 and free Booze.....

Toronto is a good scene....

Joe

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

Hey VOXVENDER, one of my bass players was from Canada. He kept trying to get me up there. Kind of sorry I never went. Are you in a band? I read a lot of you guys posts, and for the most part they are very informative. Funny too! I've kinda been hesitant about posting in this forum cause its supposed to be about guitars and bass's and I'm not up on that stuff anymore. I play a strat, guild acoustic and a funky ole precision, and thats it. They do what I need. I still have funner than shit playing with friends. Goofy old fart stuff, but keeps the music part of me alive. Mostly I post in the building and analog forums cause I AM a builder and I have a couple of MSR-16 tape machines in my studio. I love analog. Always heard Toronto had a good music base, and fantastic musicians. Any of you guys have home studios(I guess thats a dumb question, huh?) Well, keep posting guys, cause this place is pretty much my only contact with the music world anymore. Like the song says, "don't get out much anymore"! So your my link to it.
fitz

 

[Lopp]

"you don't want to play for 40 bucks?....well, let me call....ummm...whats his name....the millionare that owns the software company,...the one that has the great band...he will always play for 40 bucks"

how can you compete with shit like that?

I haven't read the whole thread, but I've gotta comment on this (sorry) .

I used to play in a rock band. We pulled in $500/night in rural areas. I've gotta agree that there is less talent in the rural areas, so you get paid better.

However, now I have a day job and I play most my gigs for cheap. Hell, I love to play. I find it funny when people complain about not getting paid for something most people love doing. It's almost like complaining about not getting paid for playing video games.