vocal micing

  • Thread starter Thread starter darryl costello
  • Start date Start date
D

darryl costello

New member
I just finised my first production. I was pleased with the instrumental aspect of the song but the vocals seemed to be seperated from the mix. I used a 58 with slight compression but it had a cheap muddy sound and did not have the more crisp sounds that I was hoping for. any help would be greatly appreciated
 
Try using a real vocal recording mic next time, like the Audio Technica 4033, you will be impressed with the difference. If you still are not getting a proper sound, try a different mic preamp. If you still are not getting a good sound, try better interconnection and mic cable. If you still are not getting a good sound, try a little top end boost and rolling out a little below 100Hz. If you still do not get the sound you want, it is not possible... :)

Ed
 
Don't sugar coat it Ed, tell him like it is.
Seriously, the Audio Technica 4033 is an awesome mic. How do you feel about ribbon mic's?
 
Damn Lambo, I was just trying to be polite... :D

I have a story about ribbon mics.

Long ago (about 2 years, a long time in computer time... :)) I tracking a CD for the Heavy Brothers (some of you have heard the mp3's I have posted). Anyway, we started out tracking at another studio that had a pair of old Sony ribbon mic's. We ran these puppies through a pair of Telefunken straight gain mic pre's (straight gain mic pre's offer no input or output control, they are a fix gain mic pre at the input). The Telefunken/Sony combo was used on many recordings done in the 60's (even the Beatles used them). Anyway, we ran a Behringer Computer on the output of the mic pre so we could have some kind of output control going to tape, we didn't use it to compress or limit at all.

Anyway. We used this setup to mic 3 Conga's in a X-Y mic pattern.

This combination was absolutely the best, most real, alive sounding thing I have ever heard on tape of anything I worked on. The imaging was perfect (of course I had something to do with that with mic placement). The transient responce was absolutely stunning. You could close your eyes, turn up the monitors, and actually believe you where sitting a few feet back from the Conga's in the room. I have never heard a better setup since.... :(

Anyway. Ribbon mics tend to handle transients much better than other types of mics. But, for the killer sound they produce, they also are very limited in modern production environments in that they are super sensitive to work with. Feed too high of a SPL to them and the ribbon breaks. That means you can only use them at far away distances on loud instruments, which is not always the kind of sound you want. Also, they will be damaged if pluged into a mic pre that has phantom power engaged, so using them requires special attention to this fact.

Anyway, ribbon mics are usually killer sounding, at least the more popular ones are. I have only used a few and have been impressed with their sound. But like all kinds of mic's, there are some that don't sound so hot in many applications.

Selecting a great all around mic is no easy task. In fact, it is impossible to suggest any one mic for recording because generally speaking, every mic potentially can sound just right for something.

I have been very impressed with the AT 4033 and 4050. They have sounded very good on many different sources. I have available a matched pair of Nuemann U-87's if I want to borrow them. I don't bother. They just don't deliver as detailed of a sound as the 4033 or 4050 to my ears. I do like the AKG 414 on many things. I call it the morphing mic because when compared to other mics, it some how winds up sounding very similar, but usually better. I don't know why that is, just an observation. I have used a 414 on snare drums, trumpets, trombones, vocals, acoustic guitars, guitar speaker cabinets, percussion, and found that it sound very good on them all, although, on a snare drum, it is fantastic! You can hear detail on a snare, and a very smooth sound using one when placed right that even a 57 will not deliver. But, it is hard to justify a $1200 mic for snare drum in my case as I don't have that lying around... :)

There is a pretty damn good reason why the AT 4033 is the all time best selling large diaphram condensor mic on the market, it is a solid performer. While others may prefer other mics over it, I have never heard another mic that impressed me enough to go out and buy it. Sure, having a bunch of different mics would be nice, and certainly I know the value of having several mics available for recording, but unlike what some people on here think about me, I am not all that well off in a financial sense. Money is limited for me too. So, I try to stick with products that offer a good sound, but don't break the bank. I am usually though willing to spend a few bucks more than others to get a superior product. With mics, I don't buy until I have used one in a few applications, unless the price is too good to be true, then I may just get it based upon recommendation.

I have found no value comparing mics at the music store. It is not a real life environment, and I have found that they often don't have a signal path that is as good as I have at the studio. Also, I can only hear what it sounds like on voice, my own, which is not the worlds best voice by any means, and usually, I cannot hear it back on a good recording system at the store. Also, I like mics that work well in live environments, and until you have used a mic live, you cannot asses how it will work out. Even then, it has to be on a system that I have set the house eq curve on, and with a performer that I am familiar witht their sound. Then I can get a good feel for how it sounds.

Basically, if you are looking for the best "all around" mic for recording, I don't think there is one. Certainly there are mics that seem to work out a little better then others on more instruments, but, that is not any real indication that it is the best overall mic at all.

In recording, there is no other part of your signal chain that will make as big of a difference in sound then a microphone. Big studios have a lot of different mics available because they want to provide at all times the best mic solution for the performance. So the moral of this all is to collect mics. If you care about getting the best possible sound on tape as you can, you will need many different mics available to you. This is a fact that is reiterated by many engineers.

Ed
 
Ed, good post. Hey, I was at the Royer site two weeks ago, pretending I might be able to afford the R-121, and they claim that their mics can handle high SPLs (it's the *old* ribbons that are wusses in that dep't, they claim). They also say that phantom power won't blow a Royer, as long as the right cable is used (whatever that means). I want a Royer. No, no. I want two. Tell Santa.

Lambo - go into Search and type in 'jnorman', and read what comes up about ribbon mics. You'll want two for Christmas, too, if not for your birthday.
 
Ed,

Have you ever tried any of the Audix higher end mics? I've got a pair of them (on loan from a friend) and have been very impressed with how they compare to the 4033 that I normally use.

VE
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>if you are looking for the best "all around" mic for recording, I don't think there is one.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's why it's a good idea to start a collection of different mics to fit the various applications you come across

my two cents. :)



[This message has been edited by Ric (edited 04-20-2000).]
 
What about an Oktava MC012 for vocals? Is that a really sweet mic to go after?
 
Sonusman,excellant commentary.

The only thing I would add to the vocal question would be to try cutting a few db at about 600hz, that seem to be a magic freq.
for getting rid of some of that woofy low-mid crap,not only on vocals but alot of other things as well. Then try a couple db or so boost at 16k.
Thats my 2cents worth.

Bleach.
 
Ed -As usual, the commentary was superb!

dobro -You were right about wanting the
ribbon mic's. Heck with the birthday,
I'm shooting for Easter!

One things for sure, with the multitude of brands, types of micrphones out there that it always makes for interesting conversation.
 
Sweet for vocals if you eventually spend the money to buy M1/M3 cap when you want to use it for a nice cardioid large-diaphragm vocal mic.
 
Mr esteemed moderator, might you have a few words on how the 4033 sounds relative to the 4050? I have a 4050 and think it's great, but seeing as everyone and their mom is raving about the 4033, some opinions on its sound would be most welcome.
 
Back
Top