vocal compression????

M

macthedoulos

New member
anyone have any good tips on basic compression settings for hip hop vocals? what should the threshold, ratio, attack, and relase be set to?
 
Threshold at the fifth line, ratio at the seventh line, attack and release both at the first line.

Your question does not have an answer. It has thousands of answers. What compressor? What mic? What vocal? Hows the arrangement? All of these are things that would factor into just which compressor to use. You really need to mess with the compressor a little. Start with all the knobs straight up. Listen to what it does. Now start varying the ratio up and down and listen some more. Now start varying the other knobs. See what it does to your tracks. Then you will know what settings to start with:)
 
Mess Around With IT

You never know what you're going to need - - -

It varies from vocal to vocal. Buckle down, do a search and read about it by searching Google or here at the forum.

I have friends who don't need compression on their voice. I personally like the fat sounding 3:1 -12dB type of thing.
 
Mac, you want your vocals hitting anywhere from -12db to -6 or even -3 .. Though I keep it lower just to be safe from clipping, around the -9 area.
 
Oh and Xstatic that was a great post you left. Nobody wants to take the time anymore to actually mess around with settings. :-/ It's unfortunate.
 
true....but i've messed around...i just need to know some industry standards if there are some. ya know? like....i'm sure every engineer major studios fool around until they get the right sound for the vocalist/rapper....but i would think that they also have certain standards or places they start as well. a mental template if you will that they adjust according to how it's sounding. like....."ok...today i'm doing hip hop so i'll start with the threshold here and the ratio here and build from there. tomorrow i'm doing metal so i'll start the threshold here and the ratio there and the atack here..."

do i make sense? hopefully....
 
It even depends on the style of the song greatly. Compression on vocals can kill the performance or when used in the right situation place a vocal just perfect in the mix.

I always have a tendancy to smash the vocals. I don't know why but that is where I like them.
 
macthedoulos said:
true....but i've messed around...i just need to know some industry standards if there are some. ya know? like....i'm sure every engineer major studios fool around until they get the right sound for the vocalist/rapper....but i would think that they also have certain standards or places they start as well. a mental template if you will that they adjust according to how it's sounding. like....."ok...today i'm doing hip hop so i'll start with the threshold here and the ratio here and build from there. tomorrow i'm doing metal so i'll start the threshold here and the ratio there and the atack here..."

do i make sense? hopefully....
Click to expand...

Nope, there are no standards. It will depend heavily on the vocalist and the song. In general, I would set the ratio between 1.5:1 and 4:1. Turn the threshhold until you get about 4-6dB reduction during the loudest sections (there should be little or no gain reduction during the quieter sections). Attack and release should be pretty fast for rap. Adjust the output gain, if needed to compensate for the gain reduction.

Read this article about compression: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/1996_articles/apr96/compression.html
 
I Compress the crap out of rap vocals.. like at least a ratio of 5:1, maybe more depending on the vocals and how aggresive they are. I always use a hard knee and a fast attack and fast release.
 
I thought you were asking a good question. Too bad all you got back for an answer initially was basically :

"Just do it. Just try it. Just get it done. Play with the knobs.".

There is a really excellent book called The Mixing Engineer's Handbook
by Bobby Owsinski. You can get it from Amazon and some local shops carry it. It gives you a great starting point for compressing all sorts of signals.

Yes there are infinite situations requiring infinite knobs set at infinte positons for infinite song arrangments.

But, why not start out with some compression settings for vocals that seems to work for alot of people.

This book really helped me alot, and as well, I paid a studio owner/sound engineer some good cash to come record and mix with me at my house.
This helped alot.

One sort of universal starting point for vocal compression is 2:1 ratio. The threshold you do have to adjust, as it's relevant to your input signal. If your really lucky, you'll have an attack/release preset or auto set feature.

Setting Attack and Release: These settings can be tricky as they can "delay" the effect of compression on the attack and make is hold on a bit too long on release if set improperly. I suggest till you get these tricky settings figured out (which takes quite a bit of experimentation) you simple use the fastest attack and enough of a release so the vocal is not boosted as the word trails off. Otherwise a word may pump on you unnaturally.

Setting the output: This is the final adjustment as the signal leaves the compressor. It's sometimes called the "make-up gain". They call it that because compression often lowers the overall signal and you may need to boost it back up. Basically you want to optimize this so it does not ever go over 0db in the recorder. With luck you should see a consistent healthy level on the recorder's input meters regardless of how loud the vocalist is singing.

(I stole those top 2 paragraphs from a website).

http://www.tweakheadz.com/how_to_record_vocals.htm


Some compressors (UA LA-2A) only have about 2 knobs, and the rest is done for you.


Hope this helps. Sorry that all you initially got from your post was
"I don't know - why don't you go find out".
 
mattkw80 said:
Setting Attack and Release: These settings can be tricky as they can "delay" the effect of compression on the attack and make is hold on a bit too long on release if set improperly. I suggest till you get these tricky settings figured out (which takes quite a bit of experimentation) you simple use the fastest attack and enough of a release so the vocal is not boosted as the word trails off. Otherwise a word may pump on you unnaturally.

Setting the output: This is the final adjustment as the signal leaves the compressor. It's sometimes called the "make-up gain". They call it that because compression often lowers the overall signal and you may need to boost it back up. Basically you want to optimize this so it does not ever go over 0db in the recorder. With luck you should see a consistent healthy level on the recorder's input meters regardless of how loud the vocalist is singing.

(I stole those top 2 paragraphs from a website).
Click to expand...
And those are two terrible paragraphs to quote. The fastest attack will absolutely kill all the highs at the start of a note. If you must have starting points for vocals, around 20 to 30ms for attack and about 1/2 sec (500ms) for release would be far better, at least it would do less damage to the vocals.

Compression doesn't "often lowers the overall signal"; it absolutely lowers the signal, everytime. It compresses the loudest parts of the signal. When you bring up the makeup gain, it brings up the whole signal, along with the noise.
 
mattkw80 said:
I thought you were asking a good question. Too bad all you got back for an answer initially was basically :

"Just do it. Just try it. Just get it done. Play with the knobs."
Click to expand...

Those were the best answers anyone could have given him. Throwing out any numbers at all under the guise of being helpful is doing the exact opposite. He needs to educate himself and learn through trial and error and experience. Or is that too "old school"? :rolleyes:
 
It's good to have a starting place, and some advice to start off with.

Some specific settings to try.


RAMI said:
Those were the best answers anyone could have given him. Throwing out any numbers at all under the guise of being helpful is doing the exact opposite. He needs to educate himself and learn through trial and error and experience. Or is that too "old school"? :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
 
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Part of the problem was his question was pretty specific. "What should the threshold, ratio, attack, and relase be set to?" There's no answer to that. Sure, some guidelines can be given, but that's dangerous cause then it's way too easy for him to just use those settings as a preset on every vocal he ever does, and never learns a thing about compression on the way. With everybody's answer combined in this thread as a whole, he should get a starting place as well as a strong impression that compression is not a "set it and forget it" tool.
 
corban said:
Part of the problem was his question was pretty specific. "What should the threshold, ratio, attack, and relase be set to?" There's no answer to that. Sure, some guidelines can be given, but that's dangerous cause then it's way too easy for him to just use those settings as a preset on every vocal he ever does, and never learns a thing about compression on the way. With everybody's answer combined in this thread as a whole, he should get a starting place as well as a strong impression that compression is not a "set it and forget it" tool.
Click to expand...

And yet it's still tempting to give more exacting information. Even manufacturers are guilty of this. Take Empirical Labs, for example. The online manual for their highly regarded compressor (The Distressor) gives the following settings information for vocals:

"Set ratio to 6:1 or less, attack 5, release 4. Adjust input to produce anywhere from 3 to 17 dB of compression."
 
Of all the topics in the world of recording/mixing compression still seems to be the one people struggle with the most.

I am no pro, but I do have my "sweet spot" settings I start out with when I turn a compressor on over a track channel.

After I have established my starting point, I usually begin to squeeze the ratio up.

Anybody got any other good suggestions on how to set Attack and Release ?
 
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