Thoughts on a decent pre for the KSM44?

[Otis B]

Hi all,

I've been recording tracks to my 001 through a presonus digmax, which has been fine as far as an 8-in/a/d convertor goes. The vocals, though, feel a little thin, and I'm wondering if anyone has had experience using the shure KSM 44 mic with a mid-level pre that they've really liked. I can't afford much, but I've been researching the Groove Tubes brick, the UA Solo 610 and M610, and even wondering if I can get an assembled seventh circle audio N72 somwhere. Any other pre's or combos that folks have liked?

Thanks!

 

[David Artis]

I've used this a lot when recording. Great one at $65 new and does a very decent job.

ART Tube MP Project Series Microphone Preamp.

 

[Seeker of Rock]

Nice mic you got there. I use a Joemeek VC1Qcs and have always been happy with the results. Of course, for "thin" I would suggest two additional venues...a little chorus and moderate reverb, and doubling the vocal tracks with the second take set low in the mix. It works for me, anyway.

 

[Soundmind??]

Don't have one (yet) but I've read a lot of good reports on the FMR RNP, two channels for less than $500. You could insert it into the signal path to the Digimax for A/D conversion. Good clean pre with the low noise KSM44 should be quite useful. If you want something with a tube in it, the UA Solo 610 is often given praise. For about $700, it is a true tube pre, not the phony starved plate designs offered by ART, Presonus, Behri, etc. If you aren't willing to spend a few hundred bucks (new), you will not likely get a real, truly functional tube amp.

 

[Otis B]

Don't have one (yet) but I've read a lot of good reports on the FMR RNP, two channels for less than $500. You could insert it into the signal path to the Digimax for A/D conversion. Good clean pre with the low noise KSM44 should be quite useful. If you want something with a tube in it, the UA Solo 610 is often given praise. For about $700, it is a true tube pre, not the phony starved plate designs offered by ART, Presonus, Behri, etc. If you aren't willing to spend a few hundred bucks (new), you will not likely get a real, truly functional tube amp.

Thanks for the replies, everyone - yeah, I think the GT brick and the 610's are "un-starved" as you describe, which is what I think I might go for for contrast. I also like the idea of bypassing the digimax's preamps with different things - i've even been messing around with send/returning the signal to my tascam cassette 4-track, although god knows why. Maybe I'll start routing it to various appliances next, just to see what happens. I've also heard from an engineer friend about the "darker doubling" of the vocal line - I'll give that a whirl as well.

Thanks again!

 

[cavedog101]

If you can attach yourself to any seventh circle mic pres and the power supply, you are basically stepping a few paces beyond the 'other' aformentioned pres and your life will forever be changed.

Do yourself a favor and stick to this bent. Get the 'lunchbox' and power supply and one pre to start. The next pres will be a low cost and considerale upgrade when you look at the different transformer, opamp sets, and EQ options available in the different pres.

Doing this moves you towards the Neve, API, John Hardy book of recording.

You'll find nirvana there. As well as a SIZE to your noises that you can only imagine.

 

[Soundmind??]

If you can attach yourself to any seventh circle mic pres and the power supply, you are basically stepping a few paces beyond the 'other' aformentioned pres and your life will forever be changed.

Do yourself a favor and stick to this bent. Get the 'lunchbox' and power supply and one pre to start. The next pres will be a low cost and considerale upgrade when you look at the different transformer, opamp sets, and EQ options available in the different pres.

Doing this moves you towards the Neve, API, John Hardy book of recording.

You'll find nirvana there. As well as a SIZE to your noises that you can only imagine.

Another possibility if you are serious about your work! The lunchbox offers portability and mobility to your rig as well. But now you are at least 1200 bucks into it before the first pre is doing it's audio wonders. Still a good option for the serious recordist.

 

[Otis B]

If you can attach yourself to any seventh circle mic pres and the power supply, you are basically stepping a few paces beyond the 'other' aformentioned pres and your life will forever be changed.

Do yourself a favor and stick to this bent. Get the 'lunchbox' and power supply and one pre to start. The next pres will be a low cost and considerale upgrade when you look at the different transformer, opamp sets, and EQ options available in the different pres.

Doing this moves you towards the Neve, API, John Hardy book of recording.

You'll find nirvana there. As well as a SIZE to your noises that you can only imagine.

Sorry to be such a novice about this stuff, but - the SCA N72 can't stand alone - is that what you're saying? I think (sometimes ) that I get the lunchbox concept, that is, your pre-amp is in the form of a card but is un-housed with no power supply, chassis, outs, etc. - is that right? Would the SCA be that type of card, i.e. needing a lunchbox for housing/power? and you can put different brands of pre-amps into an API lunchbox, no?

Thanks again!!

 

[Soundmind??]

The API lunchbox is both a rack and power supply for the modules. Check out mercenary.com for pricing and photos. Not saying they are the only supplier, but they do have photos of the lunchbox and several types and makes of modules. You have to be careful when buying modules as some makes have to be modified electrically to work properly. As previously stated, for the serious recordist, they would be a good choice. BTW they also make a rack mountable housing/power supply that accomodates these modules too.

 

[Otis B]

The API lunchbox is both a rack and power supply for the modules. Check out mercenary.com for pricing and photos. Not saying they are the only supplier, but they do have photos of the lunchbox and several types and makes of modules. You have to be careful when buying modules as some makes have to be modified electrically to work properly. As previously stated, for the serious recordist, they would be a good choice. BTW they also make a rack mountable housing/power supply that accomodates these modules too.

I'll check that out - thanks again!

 

[rsolinski]

I use my ksm44 with Hardy's, Yamaha PM1000's, API 312's and a Forssell...Sounds great thru all of them..Hardly thin, I usually need to roll off a little low end to fit stuff into the mix..One thing that can instantly "fatten" tracks (I hate adjectives like fatten and warm) is a good hardware compressor (and I mean good, not prosumer)...

Cheers,
Ray

 

[Rick Shepherd]

Save you money and get a good pre. You'll be very glad you did!

 

[Otis B]

I use my ksm44 with Hardy's, Yamaha PM1000's, API 312's and a Forssell...Sounds great thru all of them..Hardly thin, I usually need to roll off a little low end to fit stuff into the mix..One thing that can instantly "fatten" tracks (I hate adjectives like fatten and warm) is a good hardware compressor (and I mean good, not prosumer)...

Cheers,
Ray

I agree, I think the mic could be great for me, just not necessarily through my digimax! Compression has been suggested too, along the same lines of doubling the vocal with a darker line, but I'm still getting my chops down with applying compression, and I'm really in unfamiliar waters when it comes to compressors. Do you have a particular one that you like, or one that you like that won't break the bank? Do you have any thoughts on those combined units, like the UA LA-610?

I think in the end, I'm probably going to try to save up for a good pre, something in the high-mid range, maybe even a DAV BG-1. I really like the lunchbox option, but I think my fiance will kill me if go over $1000!

Thanks for all the help - great board!

 

[cavedog101]

This is the thing.....A lunchbox will get you a power supply and a rack-mount for several more pres, EQs ,comps, de-essers, basically any type of card that is compatible to your selection. Many will 'mix' together allowing for a huge pallette to choose from in a very small footprint. The initial cost of the power supply/ lunchbox will be higher, but the outlay over time is considerably lower. The preamp cards , and all the other types of devices in this format, are half ( or less) the outlay of a standalone unit which requires its own power supply, a box to house the circuits, inputs/outputs and the like.

For those that operate small footprint studios and are constantly running out of room or having to reconfigure their rack as new gear is added, the lunchbox is a great investment in not only the space required, but the quality of tools one can stock it with.

Imagine buying an API mic pre for the same amount of coin as a Eureka or other midpriced mic pre. While the API isnt a strip, the sounds you can coax from such a piece far outweigh the available sounds from many of the mid and lower level gear no matter what features they may possess.

 

[Otis B]

This is the thing.....A lunchbox will get you a power supply and a rack-mount for several more pres, EQs ,comps, de-essers, basically any type of card that is compatible to your selection. Many will 'mix' together allowing for a huge pallette to choose from in a very small footprint. The initial cost of the power supply/ lunchbox will be higher, but the outlay over time is considerably lower. The preamp cards , and all the other types of devices in this format, are half ( or less) the outlay of a standalone unit which requires its own power supply, a box to house the circuits, inputs/outputs and the like.

For those that operate small footprint studios and are constantly running out of room or having to reconfigure their rack as new gear is added, the lunchbox is a great investment in not only the space required, but the quality of tools one can stock it with.

Imagine buying an API mic pre for the same amount of coin as a Eureka or other midpriced mic pre. While the API isnt a strip, the sounds you can coax from such a piece far outweigh the available sounds from many of the mid and lower level gear no matter what features they may possess.

I actually just looked at this thread last night:

https://homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=225103&highlight=modules+lunchbox

which was huge help, as I didn't realize the extent of the types of modules and housing units. I also looked around and saw that Atlas Pro distributes the "revolver", a two unit box/rack for about $400 that can accommodate many of the 500 style modules, which makes things a little more feasible $$-wise and is an option worth thinking about. thanks!

 

[battleminnow]

Don't have one (yet) but I've read a lot of good reports on the FMR RNP, two channels for less than $500. You could insert it into the signal path to the Digimax for A/D conversion. Good clean pre with the low noise KSM44 should be quite useful. If you want something with a tube in it, the UA Solo 610 is often given praise. For about $700, it is a true tube pre, not the phony starved plate designs offered by ART, Presonus, Behri, etc. If you aren't willing to spend a few hundred bucks (new), you will not likely get a real, truly functional tube amp.

The ART MPA Gold is not starved plate, and truly a good all around inexpensive preamp ($300-ish.) Especially if you upgrade the Chinese junk tubes it ships with.

Pete

 

[Soundmind??]

The ART MPA Gold is not starved plate, and truly a good all around inexpensive preamp ($300-ish.) Especially if you upgrade the Chinese junk tubes it ships with.

Pete

I was referring to the $100-150 phony tube pres that don't have the 200+ volt powers supply to drive the tubes. Haven't used the MPA Gold. Glad you are satisfied with it.

 

[pdlstl]

Lunchbox pres/comps/EQs are a way of having several quality tools at your disposal for not a ton of money (relatively speaking).

Here's mine. I also have an Avalon M5, a rack mount Great River and a DAV No.1 BG.

The great thing about the Great River pres is that with input and output gain controls, you can make it very clean or warm it up quite nicely depending on what you're going for.

 

[Otis B]

Lunchbox pres/comps/EQs are a way of having several quality tools at your disposal for not a ton of money (relatively speaking).

Here's mine. I also have an Avalon M5, a rack mount Great River and a DAV No.1 BG.

The great thing about the Great River pres is that with input and output gain controls, you can make it very clean or warm it up quite nicely depending on what you're going for.

I just found what looks like a good deal for the 4 different pre-assembled SCA modules with chassis and power supply on ebay. My issue now is whether to go SCA or API style. The SCA route looks to be cheaper per module, and I've read great things about them, but obviously - yours is a great example - there are more options/brands in the 500 format. Hmmmmm.....

By the way, is that an API box or a different brand?

 

[pdlstl]

It's a Brent Averill.

I went with it because the power supply is capable of powering two boxes.