TerraMortim
New member
fishkarma said:
but have you learned to milk a good guitar? I tell you guitar milk is so rich and creamy, and helps your bones grow big and strong.
but have you learned to milk a good guitar? I tell you guitar milk is so rich and creamy, and helps your bones grow big and strong.
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fishkarma
New member
TerraMortim said:I don't have a hard time attracting amazing musicians, and I run my studio out of my house, based entirely on a computer running Logic pro 7. Big studios are kind of neat for a while, but I don't hear all that creative or original music coming from them most times. There just simply isn't so much of a point of going into one of these insane studios unless someone gives you an unreal budget to work with. Sure, an amazing drum room can make a difference, but there are some small studios I've been in with really cool drum rooms. Just keep looking and working with folks, and you might just be lucky enough to find perfect players for what you want to do. The ones who will only play in a big studio are a bit snobby for that attitude, don't you think?
A lot don't realise that the bigger studio wont make a big difference unless the engineer is better!
I know a guy that keeps an old analog desk thats massive down one end as it looks good to clients (as they are paying for the flashing lights since they don't understand half of it) then he just works on his protools rig.
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fishkarma
New member
TerraMortim said:
Yup. Got me a lovely us Strat and a Marshall 2203
Just gotta get a reverb pedal to make it sound Sweet (cant get enough reverb its a disease)
ez_willis
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Yeah, I already offered my time. Which one of you are going to book the room and the asshats I'll be teaching how to write songs and play their instruments, then butcher their efforts with a mix that has that "vintage" feel, i.e. ounds like shit.sweetnubs said:
RawDepth
New member
One good way to learn about something, (as complex as recording,) is to surround yourself with people who have experience and skill and then listen very carefully when they speak. In a way, that's what I try to do a lot of here. I quietly absorb as much as possible of what you expert guys have to offer. (And, by the way, I genuinely appreciate it.)
Anyway, what I am gathering here is that it certainly takes quality musicians but also that it's not just about the equipment as much as it is the know-how, knack, and practice. I realize that none of the above are things that come easy. I am, however, slowly advancing toward them all.
The next obvious question from an HR might be..."So, how do I get only quality musicians to come to my studio?" But don't bother, I think I already know the answer to that. You've got to have something to offer that they need. Maybe like...the ability to make them sound great!
Hmm, well, I could mope and complain that I have a catch-22 situation here. I could proclaim all day that I could do better if only I had better musicians to record. But that wouldn't get me any closer than pounding my chest. Instead, I have been trying to make a bad situation better by taking the bull by the horns. I figure if I can't find better musicians, then I'll just have to improve upon the ones I have.
That's why I spend a lot of time helping and educating my "local musician" clients about tuning their instruments and keeping them in good repair. Some of them have never been in a studio before. Prior to sessions, I suggest things like new drum heads, new strings, intonation tweaks, and the importance of preparation rehearsals. I clarify how the project should advance and what to expect. I carefully explain the need to focus on acoustics while tracking. I try to keep the mood up and the atmosphere inviting. I offer tips about technique and encourage experimentation. Sometimes I prudently, (with their permissions,) play the roll of producer by suggesting arrangement ideas and pointing out weaknesses in the project. I often do everything I can to improve the outcome of the project.
Very few of them are ever offended by it. Most are grateful that someone has taken the time to step up and care about them. I haven't done any award winning mixes yet, but at least I am out there trying, and making friends, and having fun with it as I learn.
Thanks, everyone, for helping to get me closer.
RawDepth
Anyway, what I am gathering here is that it certainly takes quality musicians but also that it's not just about the equipment as much as it is the know-how, knack, and practice. I realize that none of the above are things that come easy. I am, however, slowly advancing toward them all.
The next obvious question from an HR might be..."So, how do I get only quality musicians to come to my studio?" But don't bother, I think I already know the answer to that. You've got to have something to offer that they need. Maybe like...the ability to make them sound great!
Hmm, well, I could mope and complain that I have a catch-22 situation here. I could proclaim all day that I could do better if only I had better musicians to record. But that wouldn't get me any closer than pounding my chest. Instead, I have been trying to make a bad situation better by taking the bull by the horns. I figure if I can't find better musicians, then I'll just have to improve upon the ones I have.
That's why I spend a lot of time helping and educating my "local musician" clients about tuning their instruments and keeping them in good repair. Some of them have never been in a studio before. Prior to sessions, I suggest things like new drum heads, new strings, intonation tweaks, and the importance of preparation rehearsals. I clarify how the project should advance and what to expect. I carefully explain the need to focus on acoustics while tracking. I try to keep the mood up and the atmosphere inviting. I offer tips about technique and encourage experimentation. Sometimes I prudently, (with their permissions,) play the roll of producer by suggesting arrangement ideas and pointing out weaknesses in the project. I often do everything I can to improve the outcome of the project.
Very few of them are ever offended by it. Most are grateful that someone has taken the time to step up and care about them. I haven't done any award winning mixes yet, but at least I am out there trying, and making friends, and having fun with it as I learn.
Thanks, everyone, for helping to get me closer.
RawDepth
SouthSIDE Glen
independentrecording.net
That certainly is an indesposable part of it. IME, there are a couple of things that preceed that though, and things that one can start working on at any time:RawDepth said:
In my area, anyway, it's impossible to overestimate the importance of good old-fashoned networking. Who you know is as important as what you know. This is as true of the musicians as it is of the independant fader jockies. The degrees of separation amongst local quality musicians tend to be very small; they all at least know of each other, and most actually know each other or have woked together at some point. Most of the best musicins I know - most of which work for several bands at once - get all their gigs via the good ol' boy (and girl) telephone or face-to-face network.
Unless one is lucky enough to have grown up inside such a network, getting "in" is something that takes time to develop. Befriend these people by becoming a regular at their gigs (without coming across as a stalker
) over time, build their trust, start small helping them with small tasks pro bono that demonstrate your work ethic and responsibility, and buy them a beer or three along the way . It also can help to make good regular contacts hanging with the local gear shops. Not the GCs or Sam Ashes, but the ma and pa shops that have been around for a while; they tend to be key nodes in the local musician networks and are a great way to tap into the pulse of what's happening.Of course all that is for naught if one sucks at engineering, or at social skills, or both. But get started on the networking early - without bragging or advertising one's hand quite yet - gives one time to hone their talents (and build their gear) as they develop their network. So by the time one is ready to put the word out, they have a way to do it.
G.
TerraMortim
New member
fishkarma said:
good point. SIlly musicians lol.
TerraMortim
New member
fishkarma said:
cool man...not a huge strat man myself (nothing wrong with them, just too many of them around everywhere) MORE REVERB! lol I can tend to get that way with some things. There are some reverb impulse responses that are god like.
ever tried the verb plugins artsacoustic or reverence? YUM! Both, very contrasting sounds, both very yummy, and in my opinion the best sounding algorithmic verbs (love those impulse response ones the most ususally lol)
ez_willis
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My solution to that problem actually came easier than any of the other learning curves and battles. I don't allow anyone other than myself in my studio.RawDepth said:
ez_willis
.
Well that explains why the Steve Albini's of the world don't visit us.SouthSIDE Glen said:
TerraMortim
New member
ez_willis said:Well that explains why the Steve Albini's of the world don't visit us.
A buddy of mine is friends with Steve
Maybe some day he'll visit me, doubt he'd produce me tho! lol
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pathdoc
New member
I think the one point that no one really gets is that this forum is called HomeRecording.com. This forum should be a place for people who wish to record in their homes to come together and learn. There are pros here who we respect and I'm glad they are here. I just don't like the repeated suggestion that somehow we're idiots for even wanting to record in our home studios. The snobbery(sp?) gets old.
SouthSIDE Glen
independentrecording.net
And quite honestly, so is the reverse-snobbery of hiding behind the "home" part of the label.
No offense intended, but when the average home studio has a mic locker with a double-digit inventory of mics, is cabable of live mixing anywhere from 12 to 48 analog tracks into several tracks of direct 24-bit digital recording, and mixing it all on a digital editing platform capable of handling 48 or more tracks of audio replete with a batallion of plugs that can do things to audio that pros only dreamed of back in the days of the Beatles and Pink Floyd, the cover story of "it's only home recording" is a meaningless dodge. Just because the stuff is in a basement or a garage instead of a leased space doesn't make it any less powerful or capable.
And when on top of that the number one question asked on this board on a basis so regular you could set your watch by it is, "how do I get my mixes to sound like commercial CDs?", one is no longer talking about goofing around at home with a tape recorder, they are asking how to do a pro-quality production. Yet when you tell them "it's only home recording, what do you expect?", they get all pissed off and call you a snob for saying you have to go to a pro studio witha pro engineer to get those results.
So we are snobs no matter what we say. If we say that to get the sound you want you have to go to a pro, we're snobs. if, OTOH we say that you got everything you need, you just need to learn how to use it, we're still snobs, becuase it's "only home recording". THAT gets old even quicker.
G.
No offense intended, but when the average home studio has a mic locker with a double-digit inventory of mics, is cabable of live mixing anywhere from 12 to 48 analog tracks into several tracks of direct 24-bit digital recording, and mixing it all on a digital editing platform capable of handling 48 or more tracks of audio replete with a batallion of plugs that can do things to audio that pros only dreamed of back in the days of the Beatles and Pink Floyd, the cover story of "it's only home recording" is a meaningless dodge. Just because the stuff is in a basement or a garage instead of a leased space doesn't make it any less powerful or capable.
And when on top of that the number one question asked on this board on a basis so regular you could set your watch by it is, "how do I get my mixes to sound like commercial CDs?", one is no longer talking about goofing around at home with a tape recorder, they are asking how to do a pro-quality production. Yet when you tell them "it's only home recording, what do you expect?", they get all pissed off and call you a snob for saying you have to go to a pro studio witha pro engineer to get those results.
So we are snobs no matter what we say. If we say that to get the sound you want you have to go to a pro, we're snobs. if, OTOH we say that you got everything you need, you just need to learn how to use it, we're still snobs, becuase it's "only home recording". THAT gets old even quicker.
G.
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pathdoc
New member
Hey Glen,
Your points are well made. I'm glad you take the time to post here. Most of us here can only dream about being in the industy and are at least somewhat jeolous.
I do believe the ability to produce a good recording is in the mind and not in the equipment.
Maybe yourself or another pro could offer a chance for home recording folks like myself, a chance to spend a few days in a real studio. I know I learn alot faster with hands on experience. You could get a few days of free labor and who knows, you could probably charge people just to be there.
Your points are well made. I'm glad you take the time to post here. Most of us here can only dream about being in the industy and are at least somewhat jeolous.
I do believe the ability to produce a good recording is in the mind and not in the equipment. Maybe yourself or another pro could offer a chance for home recording folks like myself, a chance to spend a few days in a real studio. I know I learn alot faster with hands on experience. You could get a few days of free labor and who knows, you could probably charge people just to be there.
H
Harvey Gerst
New member
Well, Glen is in Chicago, but I'm about 40 miles from you. You're welcome to come here and hang out.pathdoc said:
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pathdoc
New member
You are incredibly kind. I will take you up on this offer. I'll PM you for details.
Thanks again.
Thanks again.
junplugged
Taking the slow road
Time is the difference, time and attention, details, care, focus, determination.
I always do a much better job on my car than the pros b/c i can spend more time draining more oil out, actually following the procedures in the manual, no shortcuts. yes it will take me 5 hours instead of 30 minutes, change plugs cold, no high speed wrenches, apply the anti-seize on the brake caliper support bracket bolts.... but i can't do all of it, for the big stuff it would take me too long and i would need specialized tools i would never use again, maybe not be able to afford either. i don't always need the pro, sometimes i do. because i have another job, and not the time or money or mentor....
if i turned pro, then that means i'm getting access to the specialized stuff, have a mentor/boss/manager directing me, and i have the TIME as well as space, tools, experience, and support b/c now it's my job and my food, shelter, health care, transportation - basic needs now mean that i better give it my all or i'll be homeless...again. talent being equal in each case or even unequal. but depending on the intended results, you can have as good a job if the requirments for the job don't depend on the specialized areas.
I always do a much better job on my car than the pros b/c i can spend more time draining more oil out, actually following the procedures in the manual, no shortcuts. yes it will take me 5 hours instead of 30 minutes, change plugs cold, no high speed wrenches, apply the anti-seize on the brake caliper support bracket bolts.... but i can't do all of it, for the big stuff it would take me too long and i would need specialized tools i would never use again, maybe not be able to afford either. i don't always need the pro, sometimes i do. because i have another job, and not the time or money or mentor....
if i turned pro, then that means i'm getting access to the specialized stuff, have a mentor/boss/manager directing me, and i have the TIME as well as space, tools, experience, and support b/c now it's my job and my food, shelter, health care, transportation - basic needs now mean that i better give it my all or i'll be homeless...again. talent being equal in each case or even unequal. but depending on the intended results, you can have as good a job if the requirments for the job don't depend on the specialized areas.
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boingoman
New member
SouthSIDE Glen said:
It seems to me that what a lot of pros "dream of" is the convenience, not the actual gear most people have these days. I wonder, if given the choice of recording in a garage in 2007 with an Alesis HD24, a Ghost, and $20,000 of mics, or Abbey Road in 1975, with a full staff of highly qualified people and absolutely killer gear, if Pink Floyd would have chosen to record "Wish You Were Here" in the garage because it was easier to edit.
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MCI2424
New member
fishkarma said:
20 years ago I was a pro and nobody paid "thousands" for a 24 track 2" and a Neve board.
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MCI2424
New member
Harvey Gerst said:
I'd come and hang out, but the last studio guy to offer got sick of me around the third year.
Kept nagging me about "Rent" and "Living" expenses. What a jerk.