The New Tone Thread

Just tried to mic the Orange with my condenser mic. My preamp on my focusrite is down to Zero and it's still clipping really badly. I turned the amp itself down to 2 which seems pretty lame and it still clips. Any suggestions? It sounds promising sort of but i need to keep the levels so low i think i am losing the edge of the amp

Should i just stick with the 57?
 
Greg: Lol...yeah, I know you don't like the 1w amps Greg, & I know why...You're right about 'em being overpriced as hell, no doubt...I can say confirm that myself...lol...But for dicking around (just like you said, a practice amp), I really do like my DSL-1 though...

Shan: That's just how a condenser mic is dude, I've got 3 of 'em, & they all do the same thing...Unless you wanna record at lower volumes, or use it for a room mic, that's just how it goes with 'em man....Not saying you can't get a good recorded tone with 'em, but none of the condensers I have can handle the SPL's of my amps...I have a Sennheiser e609 that I bought for a second mic to go along with my '57, pretty good mic, it can get a little sizzly/fizzy though...Greg has an Audix i5 & he seems to like it a lot, I've heard some pretty damn good tones from him with it...And, both of these mics are priced about the same as the '57...Just sayin'...
 
ShanPeyton said:
Just tried to mic the Orange with my condenser mic. My preamp on my focusrite is down to Zero and it's still clipping really badly. I turned the amp itself down to 2 which seems pretty lame and it still clips. Any suggestions? It sounds promising sort of but i need to keep the levels so low i think i am losing the edge of the amp

Should i just stick with the 57?
Click to expand...

Yes. Condensers don't go with loud amps unless they're 100 feet away. There's a reason the 57 is the de facto mic for cabs.
 
minerman said:
Greg: Lol...yeah, I know you don't like the 1w amps Greg, & I know why...You're right about 'em being overpriced as hell, no doubt...I can say confirm that myself...lol...But for dicking around (just like you said, a practice amp), I really do like my DSL-1 though...
Click to expand...

Okay, that's fine. But now that you have the big DSL, and you know what it can do, can you name one advantage of your one watter over the big watter?
 
Greg_L said:
Okay, that's fine. But now that you have the big DSL, and you know what it can do, can you name one advantage of your one watter over the big watter?
Click to expand...
The only advantage is lower volume man, that's it...Nothing else, nadda, zip...In fact, the 1w DSL can't hold a light compared to the 100w version's recorded tones...

I should've just bought the DSL100H to begin with, saved a lot of time & $$$....I realize that now, but at the time I bought the 1w, noise was a big issue for me...Now, not so much...:D.
 
minerman said:
The only advantage is lower volume man, that's it...Nothing else, nadda, zip...In fact, the 1w DSL can't hold a light compared to the 100w version's recorded tones...

I should've just bought the DSL100H to begin with, saved a lot of time & $$$....I realize that now, but at the time I bought the 1w, noise was a big issue for me...Now, not so much...:D.
Click to expand...

Okay cool. Now let me ask you this...is the lower volume of the one watt DSL better than just turning the big DSL down some? Say you wanna just dick around at home without blowing the walls down. Does the one watt's low volume sound significantly better than the 100w turned down?

I ask because I've always wondered what people are actually looking for in a "practice amp". Does anyone really need the greatest tone ever just for quiet dicking around? Where does one just settle for "okay tone" for goofing off? And obviously no one needs a halfstack for dicking around, but you at least have the option of playing out live with a big watt halfstack. For me, I can have all the fun in the world with my JVM turned down to TV volumes. It sounds great to me. Plenty good enough for fucking around. I wonder about this with the DSLs specifically because a one watt DSL is about as much as a used 100w. It's different with the other one watters because you're not going to find a JCM 800 or JMP-era Super Lead for one watt prices, and they don't sound good turned way down anyway.
 
Spent the afternoon screwing around and it was pretty eventful and fun as hell. I think i tried about 20 different mic set up's and i think the room i have this thing set up in has a lot to do with the end result. Originally i was going to go with the Top Right hand speaker and i started on the far outer edge of the speaker. I had a hunch before proceeding to do the same set up on for the top left hand speaker before doing any more, just because. I had a hunch. The difference in the outside edge of those two speakers was night and day. The one on the right being less desirable. Actually totally undesirable. Top left it is.

I think i found an o.k. sweet spot for this amp. It is mid way between dead middle of the cone and the edge of the dust cap. There wasn't a real huge difference between there and dead middle of the cone save for a bit of bite and clarity.

Todays Sweet Spot
Top Left Dead Centre For Reference

All the settings remain the same as i did last, SM57 on Axis, on the cloth
Master 4
Treb 5
Mid 5
Bass 5
Gain 4

No BS effects or processing. Sorry for the really cruddy / sloppy playing. There isn't an app for that i am aware of.
 
Yeah that sounds about right to me. You hear how there's comparatively like a hole in the sound on the dead center clip, while the "sweet spot" clip has more punch and body? That's because the very center of the speaker doesn't actually do anything. Up close to the grill, the mic is basically in a pressure hole. Move it out some, and the mic gets slammed by the cone, which does actually make sound. I like your sweet spot clip. It's got that signature Orange sound to me. Nice and crunchy and punchy.
 
Greg_L said:
Okay cool. Now let me ask you this...is the lower volume of the one watt DSL better than just turning the big DSL down some? Say you wanna just dick around at home without blowing the walls down. Does the one watt's low volume sound significantly better than the 100w turned down?

I ask because I've always wondered what people are actually looking for in a "practice amp". Does anyone really need the greatest tone ever just for quiet dicking around? Where does one just settle for "okay tone" for goofing off? And obviously no one needs a halfstack for dicking around, but you at least have the option of playing out live with a big watt halfstack. For me, I can have all the fun in the world with my JVM turned down to TV volumes. It sounds great to me. Plenty good enough for fucking around. I wonder about this with the DSLs specifically because a one watt DSL is about as much as a used 100w. It's different with the other one watters because you're not going to find a JCM 800 or JMP-era Super Lead for one watt prices, and they don't sound good turned way down anyway.
Click to expand...
To me, very little, if any Greg...Of course, the 100w version is gonna sound better, it's got more features (crunch/OD1/OD2, presence knob)...I can get a pretty close approximation of some of the tones the 100w does using the 1w, but it lacks in features....And with the resonance/presence knobs, the 1w can't keep up...It's pretty close, but still no cigar...

Just for the record, I bought the 1w to be my main recording amp (which you know this anyway), a year before I got the 100w, so the practice amp thing really doesn't apply to me (I don't think....), but really, bottom line, the 100w can basically do what the 1w does dude, with more bells & whistles to boot...

If I had it to do over, I'd just bit the bullet & bought the DSL100H to start with, but, lots of things have changed for me since that time too....
 
Schwarzenyaeger said:
For dicking around I'd honestly just stick to a free amp sim and headphones if noise is really a problem.
Click to expand...
Well, I used to have to jump through fuckin' hoops before my divorce, but now, if I wanna play through my amps, I play through my amps, regardless....Of course, I'd have the cops on me after about 9 pm, but I've got more sense than to even try that...


Shan: Clip sounds good man, it's got that vintage-y Orange texture to it man...
 
minerman said:
To me, very little, if any Greg...Of course, the 100w version is gonna sound better, it's got more features (crunch/OD1/OD2, presence knob)...I can get a pretty close approximation of some of the tones the 100w does using the 1w, but it lacks in features....And with the resonance/presence knobs, the 1w can't keep up...It's pretty close, but still no cigar...

Just for the record, I bought the 1w to be my main recording amp (which you know this anyway), a year before I got the 100w, so the practice amp thing really doesn't apply to me (I don't think....), but really, bottom line, the 100w can basically do what the 1w does dude, with more bells & whistles to boot...

If I had it to do over, I'd just bit the bullet & bought the DSL100H to start with, but, lots of things have changed for me since that time too....
Click to expand...

That's kind of what I was thinking. My opinion has always been that the one watt Marshalls are a really neat idea that are grossly overpriced for what they are. In the case of the DSL, it's kind of a wash because one watt DSLs and the bigger versions are roughly the same price. But clearly the bigger DSL sounds better. The price-to-noise advantage somewhat swings towards the one watters with the other models because you're not going to find JCM 800s, Plexis, JMPs, or JVMs as cheap as their one watt versions, and those big amps would blow a 1x10 or 1x12 cab to smithereens. And with the exception of the JVM, those other big amps won't turn down in volume as good as a one watter either. But on the flip side, the one watters will never sound like those big boys pushing some air. So in my mind they're really not much more than cute, really expensive practice amps with a few of the models having some slight advantages over their larger counterparts if you never plan on leaving the house with it.
 
Greg_L said:
I ask because I've always wondered what people are actually looking for in a "practice amp". Does anyone really need the greatest tone ever just for quiet dicking around? Where does one just settle for "okay tone" for goofing off?
Click to expand...

For me....while I don't need that " live performance level" good tone for dicking around in thye studio when practicing, I still would like good tone...'cuz it just ain't fun to play an amp that simply makes sound come out of the speaker. It has to be good....both at a low level and high, but if it can't sound good at low levels, then fuck it, I'm turning it up loud, and if I have to I'll use my headphones and dial it so it sounds good, without blowing out my ears....but I do get a little nuts sometimes and just go without the headphones. I just get out of the way of the direct line from the speakers, and stand off to the side. :D

The couple of low wattage (5W) amps that I had at one time were pretty good for giving me a decent low-level practice tone...but I sold them off, as I found they didn't give me what I wanted for recording...which is an amp that could be cranked a bit and move some air.

I got my Savage Macht 12x that has a Studio/Stage switch to let me cut the power output in half...and it sounded OK when I first got the amp, but it just sounds so much better at the Stage setting, that I just never use the Studio setting even when just dicking around. :)
With the Studio setting....it's like sex with a condom....just not the same feel. :p

Of course...like you, I am able to play LOUD, and no one is going to complain...so I really have no need for the small wattage practice amps.
 
miroslav said:
For me....while I don't need that " live performance level" good tone for dicking around in thye studio when practicing, I still would like good tone...'cuz it just ain't fun to play an amp that simply makes sound come out of the speaker. It has to be good....
Click to expand...

Right, I agree. I don't want to play something that sounds like shit. I'm just wondering where the compromise is for some people. Do you want to spend a thousand bucks on a killer tiny watt amp that does nothing else, or would you settle for the slightly compromised tone of a big watt master volume amp turned down to low levels? For me, I'm okay with just turning my big JVM way down. It still sounds very good to me at little volumes. Certainly good enough to putz around with. My other amps though, not so much. I don't even flip them on unless I know I'm about to get stupid with loudness.
 
Honestly, the 1w/100w DSL's I've got do sound a lot a alike, but again, the 1w is limited compared to the 100w (crunch/OD1, resonance/presence)... It does sound good, especially through my 4x12, surprisingly good sounding, but as mentioned, it just doesn't move enough air to get that cranked tone...

If the DSL-1 didn't sound good, I would've been one pissed off Marshall customer, plain & simple...I've had lots of shitty amps, & while the DSL-1 ain't no 50/100w at all, it does sound good...The Blackstar HT-5 comes to mind when I think about shitty sounding amps...It wasn't terrible, but it was just bland sounding to me....


You make some good points comparing these 1w amps Greg, even as expensive as they are, I'd still love to have the JMP-1 & JCM-1 models...I've never played through 'em, but just going by the DSL, I bet they're pretty good too...

I can finally make as much noise as I wanna as long as it's not late (obviously), but again, if I'd known how things were gonna turn out for me, I'd bought a 50/100w amp to start with...

Something I meant to mention is the Chupacabra, it actually gets down to the 1w DSL's level & still sounds pretty damn good in modern mode...Of course, it's all pre-amp gain, but still...

And I'm with you guys too about playing through something that just doesn't sound good, it's hard to do, because for me, if it doesn't sound good I don't wanna fuck with it....

I will say this about my 1-watter, I'd have no problems at all using it on keeper tracks running it through my 4x12 though...;).
 
I think the JCM-1 is the best one. Not surprising since I'm a JCM 800 fanboy, but it's pretty accurate in it's voicing. I was really disappointed with the JMP model. It sounded like a muddy Class 5.
 
Greg_L said:
I think the JCM-1 is the best one. Not surprising since I'm a JCM 800 fanboy, but it's pretty accurate in it's voicing. I was really disappointed with the JMP model. It sounded like a muddy Class 5.
Click to expand...
The JCM-1 was my first choice man, but they were already pretty much gone before I could get one, so I went with the DSL-1...

Have you actually tried the JMP-1 dude??? I've heard both ways on it, some good, some bad...

BTW, Marshall is supposed to release a couple new amps in a couple/few weeks, I have no idea what they are though...Probably a re-hash of the same shit they've been doing for years...lol...If they'd make a 50w head, with fx loop, extra gain stage, & some sort of power scaling, they'd sell 'em faster than they could make them, why the fuck don't they see this??? Or don't they care???
 
For all my opinion may be worth i got a Fender Practice Amp sort of against my will when i bought my Sparrow. I used it once. I could get better 'practice' tones out of my Pod.

thanks for the encouragement on the clips guys. Now i'll try it out in some songs. Might be a little late right now in the evening but sometime this weekend for sure.
 
minerman said:
The JCM-1 was my first choice man, but they were already pretty much gone before I could get one, so I went with the DSL-1...

Have you actually tried the JMP-1 dude??? I've heard both ways on it, some good, some bad...
Click to expand...
Yup, many times. They had one sitting at a GC here for a long time. They actually had all of the one watts. The JTM1 and JMP1 were very disappointing to me. I seriously liked the Class 5 better. But that's just me.

BTW, Marshall is supposed to release a couple new amps in a couple/few weeks, I have no idea what they are though...Probably a re-hash of the same shit they've been doing for years...lol...If they'd make a 50w head, with fx loop, extra gain stage, & some sort of power scaling, they'd sell 'em faster than they could make them, why the fuck don't they see this??? Or don't they care???
Click to expand...
Be careful what you wish for. They'll make it and it will cost $3,000. The perfect Marshalls have already been made. Get em used or get a clone.
 
I'm glad I got the DSL-1 when I did, because it got my feet wet with the Marshall thing, but like I've already said, I wish I'd just bought a DSL100H, 4x12 to begin with, but that's like the Randall ISO cab, live & learn....


Nah man, I'm really not in any shape to buy any gear right now, but later on, if something came along that has all that, I might be interested...Just to be honest though, I'm pretty happy with what I've got dude, I personally think I've got a killer setup...

The guys at the Marshall forum are all whining about it, I just thought I'd bring it up here to see what you guys think about it...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top