thank you from blackheart

[WhiteStrat]

That's the question, who they legally belong to...Kingdom Sound Studios, The Landlord or Joan Jett, That is why I would like to see the contract between Jett and Kingdom Sound.....I want to do the right thing.

John

I'm not sure what you mean when you say you "want to do the right thing." I thought the tapes were returned to the record company...

 

[valverec]

That's the question, who they legally belong to...Kingdom Sound Studios, The Landlord or Joan Jett, That is why I would like to see the contract between Jett and Kingdom Sound.....I want to do the right thing.

John

Or you, in other words? Clearly if they were left behind and the landlord said to junk the stuff, then it doesn't belong to him. You would be "legal" owner in that scenario. So what would you do with the tapes if it turned out you were the legal owner?

 

[jasonbmerrill]

strange, the original thread there was no mention of selling it.

 

[Supercreep]

Man, oh, MAN, I GOTTA tell you, you guys have gotten SOOOOO worked up- and WAAAAAY out of line, about this.

I think you're wrong.

Jtartam NEVER said ANYTHING about SELLING the tapes. Some of you guys just about LYNCHED him when he posted that he had them and posted that "I have been trying to contact her to return the tapes to no avail..." You were way over the top.

Fail. He posted the thread in the "Free Ads for Music/Recording Equipment" forum. This is where one hocks items. This is not where one goes to determine how to find the rightful owner of an item.

I am no lawyer

Ok..

but from several completely unrelated business dealings I have had in the past, my understanding is that Jtartam was very, very likely the legal, legitimate, rightful owner of those tapes. After a certain period, property left in a rented space becomes the property of the landlord, to do with as he/she sees fit. We are told the landlord told Jtartam that he (the landlord) had no interest in the tapes and considered them trash- and that Jtartam could do as he pleased with them. Further, I understand that no less than the U.S. Supreme Court held that anything put in a dumpster becomes public property at that moment, and is no longer deserving of "privilidged information" status. I would imagine that includes unregistered copyright ownership.

I thought you weren't a lawyer?

Also, he didn't find them in a dumpster. He found them in an office building that had been vacated in a hurry.

The right thing to do was to return the tapes.

"Blackheart was adamant that no one had ever contacted them...?" Yeah, we all know how honest and straightforward record labels ALWAYS are... Gimme a break.

I was able to find out who management was and contact them within five minutes. Ten minutes later I had a response.

How hard could Jtartam have possibly tried?

Chances are, the tapes DO have some monitary value- maybe considerable value. If Jtartam really wanted to cash in, he probably would have gotten a lawyer and done thing like sending registered letters to Blackheart (thus giving lie to their "We never heard from him" BS) and then posted them on eBay, complete with a quote of legal opinion that they were his to sell.

Again, the right thing to to was to return the tapes. Jtartam might have done all the things you suggest, but he didn't. Whether it is because it just didn't occur to him or because he knew he shouldn't do it we'll never know.

There is nothing- NOTHING, in either this post or the other one about this matter, that suggest that Jtartam is not telling the truth. The most reasonable conclusion is that he is, indeed, telling the truth, and had the best of intentions when he first posted. It might appear that he joined this forum for the express of returning the tapes to Jett/Blackheart- but he posted 5 times about totally unrelated stuff. You guys should be celebrating HIM as the hero here. Supercreep GROSELY overreacted, and frankly, IMHO, deserves little or no accolades. Mods Noisedude and Chili seemed to pour gas on the flames, it seems- now, moderators are people, too, and make mistakes like all of us, but really, a position of authority carries with it the responsibility to think before one reacts. Whitestrat seemed to approach this matter with some consideration, but it was not until mshilarious stepped in that anything resembling order returned- only to have things stirred up again with this thread.

I'm not asking for accolades. I'd have done the same for you. Let me again direct your attention to the fact that Jtartam posted the thread in a forum where people sell gear. Why did he do that? Also, it is laughable that any effort was made to contact JJ's management, as I have demonstrated.

In any case, if the tapes were his, why did he hand them over?

I encourage Jtartam to retain a lawyer and retreive the tapes if he has a legal claim to them.

And frankly, I suspect I smell more than a little bit of good old-fashioned, green-eyed JEALOUSY here. Who among us would NOT like to own or possess a raw studio tape of almost ANY famous recording artist?

Some of you guys should be ASHAMED of yourselves- and you KNOW who you are.

I'm not the slightest bit ashamed. JJ didn't sell those tapes to Jtartam. He came into possession of them, and by his own admission felt that he should locate JJ to return the tapes.

If you lost your wallet, wouldn't it be nice if someone returned it to you with it's contents?

You would, wouldn't you.

How about if you found such a wallet? You would return it, right? Because you have class, right?

As far as I am concerned the tapes are now where they belong. Jtartam has recourse available to him if he feels he handed the tapes over in error.

 

[mshilarious]

Some of you guys should be ASHAMED of yourselves- and you KNOW who you are.

No, you aren't a lawyer; I am not either, but I am vaguely familiar with the concept of involuntary bailment. Another possibility is that a previous owner obtained the tapes via conversion, which could mean the tapes have void title. Not sure whether or not those issues apply, but it certainly seems that OP doesn't know that either. He should have consulted a lawyer BEFORE listing the tapes for sale.



And if you think the OP wasn't a listing for sale, you are being completely silly. Also note the OP on the original thread has been edited.


I think I've had enough of OP's speculation on whether or not he had valid title to the tapes. The TOS read, in part:

By clicking the Agree button, you warrant that you will not post any messages on this BBS that are:

• Offerings of products (tangible or intangible) and services that you do not have legal disposition over.

OP didn't know and still doesn't know whether or not he has valid title, so I consider his postings in violation of the TOS.


And with that, thread closed.