strengthen cymbals/hihats

[pandamonk]

Alright guys.

Throughout the year i buy-up a few beginner drumkits, refurbish them, and sell them around xmas time. These kits usually come with those shitty cymbals and hihats that bend, warp and even turn inside-out. I don't want to spend any money buying new cymbals for the kits, and be left with these shitty ones, so is there anything I can do to strengthen them? I hate the thought of a kid getting a kit for christmas and the hihat flipping inside out the first time they play them.

I've looked up hammering techniques etc, and would be willing to give it a go, i have a couple spare, if i knew it'd do anything. I have a sneeky suspiscion that it's the alloy used and nothing I do will change it, but i thought i'd throw it out there anyway. I read something about hammering causing tension, so maybe hammering the bottom of the hihats would stop them flipping inside out.

Would do you guys think?

 

[mikeh]

I can't think of anything to do. As you indicate the construction of the cymbals (alloys, etc) simply create cymbals that are too thin and too weak to do anything with (other than a reasonable playing technique).

When I sold drums (at a store) I always suggested that the first thing to budget for was decent cymbals. As you know, you can put better heads on a starter kit, tune it properly and get a decent sound - but you can do anthing about cheap cymbals.

I've got very good technique and take pride that it has been years since I broke a stick or even dented a head - but I have to admit, even I have dented a couple of crap cymbals (I don't own any, but I have played on other crap kits with crap cymbals).

 

[Greg_L]

I think those cymbals are junk and there's nothing you can do to change that.

 

[PhilGood]

A long, long time ago I was faced with the same idea. What I ended up experimenting with was different hammering methods, but what really worked best (and really not even very well at that) was to re-temper the metal with a blow torch and quenching the cymbal in water. Occasionally I would end up warping a cymbal or getting it wrong and end up making things worse, but sometimes I would get lucky and make one sound pretty decent.

Don't do it though. It can get dangerous if you don't know what you're doing, and it will NEVER make it sound like a good pro cymbal because of the alloys and manufacturing process.

 

[Supercreep]

Pair 'em up and use them for trash hats.

 

[tmix]

Heck,
With the cost of brass and bronze, you might be better off taking them to a scrap yard and getting a buck a pound..

 

[ermghoti]

You'd be better off buying up cracked "real" cymbals and cutting them down in diameter.

 

[Rimshot]

You're thinking is a bit backwards

The only reason to hammer and lathe cymbals after they have come from the original manufacturer is to change the tone and performance regarding how they sound. If you are breaking cymbals all of the time, perhaps you are hitting them too hard and have them clamped in the stands like a vise.
There was an article a few years ago in I believe it was "Modern Drummer" about a man that specializes in re working cymbals to improve their quality. Do a search and check out what he recommends before taking a hammer and anvil to cymabals.
As somebody that works with steel on occasion, I'm curious about how you'd go about "tempering cymbals". It only works on steel. Bringing carbon into the raw iron/steel billets and then changing the configuration of carbon/ferrous molecules and then quenching.
Copper and tin and zinc is what cymbals are made from,

 

[pandamonk]

I'm not bothered about how they sound, they are just really really weak and pop inside-out really easily with light pressure on the hi-hat pedal.

Thanks for the suggestions guys. I thought about re-tempering, but don't have a blow torch and don't really know what I'm doing. I wouldn't mind having a go at hammering, I've got a few spares to try out on.

I read that hammering causes tension in the cymbal, so should i just hammer the bottom sides of the hi-hats? Can i use any hammer, or should i use a ball-peen hammer?

I hope it works, even just a bit. I would hate for it to flip inside-out the first time a kid played it.

 

[pandamonk]

I've just had a go at hammering, oh the fun, and it has worked. They don't pop inside-out, no matter how hard i stamp on the hihat pedal. They don't sound very good, but they never did anyway, and look pretty shit now.

What do you guys think of sanding them? I've seen a company "amedia" sanding cymbals on youtube. I don't have a lathe, but do have a rotary sander.

Fuck it! I'll give it a go, and let you know how it turns out.

 

[pandamonk]

Alright guys. Gave it a go and I think it went well. They look a hell of a lot better, and sound a little bit better too.

They still look and sound pretty shit but it's better and they don't turn inside-out anymore, which was the main problem.

Here's the finished result:

MP3 recorded with my phone. Don't judge based on good hihats but on really shitty ones, that come with beginner kits, which flip inside-out.