Still searching for a mixer

  • Thread starter Thread starter Nick The Man
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Nick The Man

Nick The Man

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something in the 1000 dollar range, but it needs to have 8 buses and at least 16 channels .. (but most the time 8 bus boards have more anyways). i just want a really clean sound. i would really love the soundcraft ghost but its just too far outta my range ... maybe some day in the future i can own one... thanks in advance to anyone who contributes
 
This will sound fucking stupid to you but why do you want 8 busses?
 
well ive kinda based my recordings around it and i have a tascam fw-1804 which has 8 inputs, similar to the firepod. its just the way ive gotten the best results
 
Breeza has a point.... why not just use your direct outs, and if you need to combine channels to a track, then use a buss. When you use a buss, you are running thorugh additional circuitry. In cheaper consoles especially, this can amount to some noise, and even some signal loss. Any way you look at it, when you running through a buss, you are runing through additional circuitry. Sometimes this may sound better, but usually not.
 
I totally believe in using busses for mixing, my studio is set up around that as well. I have eight busses, but eventually want a 16 or 24 buss board.

Using direct outs is not anything like bussing tracks. If you are assigning tracks to busses, those tracks most likely have levels and eq already set before they are bussed, plus fx sends. Once the tracks are bussed they often go to more processing, like compression. Busses are like submixes, very different than sending a signal out the direct outs, which is usually pre- everything on the channel strip.

$1,000 is really pushing it for a 16-24 channel mixer with 8 busses. I think that the best option might be to find a used Mackie 8 buss series, a Soundcraft Topaz, or perhaps one of those Tascam analog mixers. The Tascam 3500 might be too pricey, but there were other smaller models. Used analog boards are pretty cheap these days, but you really have to check them out very carefully with a fine toothed comb before buying. Only buy a used mixer that you can inspect in person. At least that's my advice.
 
Direct outs are usually post everything if you get a good studio console. My console has 24 busses and tape outs per channel. I use the tape outs because they take the channel EQ, and the insert when sending to my converters. With a buss I would have to run through the additional summing amp. Busses however are extremely useful when you are mixing in the analog realm, and when you need to run two or mics or channels to the same output.

Most consoles can be either switched or fairly easily modified to run post on the direct outs as well.
 
xstatic said:
Direct outs are usually post everything if you get a good studio console. My console has 24 busses and tape outs per channel. I use the tape outs because they take the channel EQ, and the insert when sending to my converters. With a buss I would have to run through the additional summing amp. Busses however are extremely useful when you are mixing in the analog realm, and when you need to run two or mics or channels to the same output.

Most consoles can be either switched or fairly easily modified to run post on the direct outs as well.

What board are you using?

With direct outs you don't get the summing features of the busses, which is the whole point of using them. The original question seems to be in regard to mixing more than tracking. Or at least that's the way I read it.

Have you done any reading about Micheal Brauer's mixing techniques using busses? I read an article about his technique a few years ago and it really changed how I approached mixing.
 
I guess thats the difference. I took the original question as primarily for tracking purposes. For mixing I agree with you 100%. For tracking, I prefer to take the signal as soon as possible after being processed the way I need. I am fortunate that my console allows this. What I currently have is a 104 input D&R Merlin. Due to being designed specifically for studio chores, and it's inline format, my tape outs are post fade, which also puts them post EQ and insert point. They are even post automation, which I can not see any use for.
 
yeah i dont see the purpose of using tape outs or direct outs for my purpose .... that defeats the purpose of all my submixes
 
you could get a 6 bus mixer and use the main L and R outs as individual busses. This may open a few more doors for you. As long as the mixer lets you allocate each channel to L or R. otherwise you could just pan each chanel hard the way you want it and treat it as a mono channel?
 
Hey Rob, something I've wanted to ask you and this thread seems like an appropriate place...

You said that your D&R's floating buss setup allows you to use any tape out as a buss output by pressing a switch, correct? If that's the case, when you do this, does the channel fader become the fader for that buss output and disable it for use as a channel, or what? Basically, say you wanted to use channel 1's tape output as an output for buss 1, would you be able to assign the mic pre for channel 1 to buss 1, or does using it as a buss take it out of the equation? If you could expand a bit on that, its something that I occasionally try to wrap my head around. Thanks!

By the way, I personally use buss outputs for all my routing to my recorder, as my board has no direct outs.
 
Yes, my D&R allows me to use any channel as a buss master fader. At first it seems like it would just burn up channels. However, I can also use the group outs on the patchbay without a fader (like having a buss fader at unity). For tracking, i would rarely need a buss fader, since unity is usually what I want. Also, the console has 104 inputs on 96 faders, so even if I wanted to use 24 buss faders, that still leaves 72 channels available which should be plenty;) It also allows me to set up a mixdown with 24 busses and put the faders right infront of wherever I am normally working on the console which is convenient when your console is 10 feet long.
 
I'm not sure I've seen a 6 buss mixer. There are a number of 4 buss mixers, and of course many 8 buss mixers.

I think that even if you have an eight buss mixer it is really nice to have the stereo buss as well, as you do get use out that.

D&R Merlin, I've been interested in that board. How do you like it?
 
SonicAlbert said:
I'm not sure I've seen a 6 buss mixer. There are a number of 4 buss mixers, and of course many 8 buss mixers.
Yer i havnt seen any 6 buss mixers...

What do you use the busses for, grouping channels together for seperate outputs, is this cause you havnt got enough inputs on your soundcard for each individually.
I know for a fact that it will be extremely hard to find a good quality 8 buss mixer with at least 16 channels for around $1000..

Im not entirely sure on what you will be using the busses for so the following may be completely useless but it may not be.. :cool:

You could get a 4 buss mixer and use the Main L and R as 2 busses (like i said in a previous post)

I know this would only leave you with 6 busses and ideally you want eight but you could just use direct outs/tape outs for whatever else. But i know this means that it will be post fader, post EQ, post AUX's etc..

Doing this means that you can get a higher quality mixer with the money you have.

Also, you could use AUX sends as subgroups if your not using them for anything else? It would be post fader but instead it will be a pot (knob)?
 
yeah i use them as submixes .. like

1: Snare Top
2: Snare Bottom
3: Kick
4: Overhead Left
5: Overhead Right
6: Guitar Mic 1
7: Guitar Mic 2 - Room
8: Anything else - usually a room mic for drums
 
Nick The Man said:
yeah i use them as submixes .. like

1: Snare Top
2: Snare Bottom
3: Kick
4: Overhead Left
5: Overhead Right
6: Guitar Mic 1
7: Guitar Mic 2 - Room
8: Anything else - usually a room mic for drums
I persume you like to EQ it before you record it then? What software do you use for multitracking?
 
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