Starting @ Full Sail...

  • Thread starter Thread starter Thirst
  • Start date Start date
T

Thirst

New member
hey guys hows it going.. Well whats new with me in my quest to be the man.. lol ok so im reading books on compression and figuring out signal processing and where it comes from and I come across this school while looking at a pro tools website thinking about ordering the digi 001.. I see they have a pretty in depth program in the recording sound area.. I call and request info and let me tell ya this place is pretty amazing.. As others have heard im sure alot of you know about this schooll

www.fullsail.com

Ive read up on it and asked some engineers around here n one that actually works at a multimillion dollar studio in boston over here graduated from there.. There studios are nothing short of amazing.. Anyway i get the info look threw it and WHAM, decide this is where I want to go, I fly down Jan 9th for a behind the scenes tour of the campus and what not to check things out.. but ive already seen pictures and read there course descriptions they have listed.. This place might seem ok to the ones that already own there own studio or work in this area but man im soo happy I found a place like this, its rather expensive but I think it'll pay for itself back times 4.. The engineer over heres salary is really rediculous, i realize not everyone gets paid like him but I want to be the sole person working on my music projects, I dont want to have to ask anyone how to do anything.. Anyways I figure If I cant get signed making my own music Ill work on someone elses music... Alright sorry for the long post tell me what yall think.. enjoy...


I wrote this after I did a search...


I just did a search on fullsail here.. I must say im dissapointed alot.. I think alot of the people that dont know what there talking about talk shit about fullsail.. this is why i think this

1. i read studios shy away from fullsail graduates... BULLSHIT.. go online to fullsails website and look at the students resumes there fucken rediculous, A student from fullsail is way more likely to get the job over some intern..

2. its expensive.. ITS 34,500 FOR AN ASSOCIATES DEGREE.. Do they have any idea how much a bachelors degree cost to attend North eastern here in boston, its 40,000 a year, and they have to attend for 4-5 years.. or even something simple like umass lowell, its 8k to 11k a year, 4-5 years thats 40-50k thousand dollars not to mention full sail fits it into one year with 35-45 hours of class and labs...

3. Its only 1 year... yea ok, its 35-45 hours a week in class's with everything ranging from pro tools certification courses to business management and teaching ways about the industry..

4. They dont have campus residence, YOUR LIVING expenses are worked into your loan, and apartments down there in florida are so cheap there damn near giving them away..

5. theres a 57 acre facility and over 66 studios on CAMPUS, with only a 2900 student head count, that means theres like a 4:1 student to teacher ratio

6. Are you serious that studios shy away from these engineers, take a look at there resumes these recording arts majors are running some of the nicest studios here.. not to mention there job placement program..

7. out here in boston, its 8-900.00 for a decent, a deeecent lookin 1 bedroom aparment.. LOOK wat u get in florida for 569.00 and even a lower rate for students.. www.aimco.com/summerwalk



Im very upset with people that didnt go to school mocking this school. I live in boston and the engineer I record with is a teacher at berkley.. He told me himself to go to fullsail if I wanted the hands on training and learning id need to do what I want.. Another thing is the starting pay for an engineer, somehow someone got it mixed up that there not well paid.. Well my stepfather is an electrician making 50-60k a year, my mom does not work and our house is nice, Im not sayin engineers are rich but jesus they make alot more then alot of others do. And the deal with fullsail is if any program gets an overhaul in your major of field they let you come back and attend for free... I think alot of people are full of shit here now, no not becuase they talked shit about this school but simply because they are unaware of the facts at hand and think its foolish to spend 34k on a degree, well my friends i dont know where you live but its alot more to go to school where im from then that is, im not saying that it isnt alot of money becuz it is but jesus there studios are multi million dollar studios... I dont get it ive read and done the research.. Id love to talk to them same people that were talking all the garbage about this school but that post was back in january... anyway tell me wat u think..

I truly think its amazing how people will mock and shoe off something becuz they didnt get a chance or never wanted to do it.. Ive learned so much not going to school, all my projects are just from me and I have only been doing music PERIOD for 8 months.. But even i know when 2 people apply for a job, the one with the degree will walk out employed.. now im not sayin these fullsail grads are more knowledged then some of you engineers but they definately walk out of there knowing how to operate an 88 track controle board or all the outboard diagnostic equipment being used.. I jus dont know wat to think or say to people like that....
 
only someone who didnt go to school would say something like

" your better off interning and learning cuz a studio shy's away from full sail students"

youve got to be a real moron to say something like that, I dont care what kinda job it is or where ur applying, if 2 people apply for designing job and the one that doesnt have a degree can draw wayy better then the man with the degree, the man with the degree will get the job, JUST Becuz its common sence, hes been to school, hes proven hes responsible, hes proven hes dedicated, im not sayin tha person wit out the degree is dedicated, but only people who didnt go to school would say that... I praise the ones that didnt go to school and sound engineers seriously i got soo much respect for yall, but in this day and age to apply at def jam for an engineering spot it takes more then experience... and even then there aint many schools that will give you more hands on activity's then fullsail..
 
Last edited:
lol yes.. 20 years old out of the army.. I didnt get a chance to go to college like most others doin now at 18... Im jus tryin to put a foot in the right direction...
 
Last edited:
Well good luck with it.... a word of advice though.... (and you won't understand it now, but hopefully you'll remember it later on!)

Going to recording school will not give you any real advantage after you graduate if you apply at a studio.

You will still have to pay your dues being a runner and working your way up whether you've gone to school or not. The last thing you want to do is develop some sort of know-it-all attitude coming out of school.

Graduating school is really the START of your education... school is simply preparing to start REALLY learning. And your luckiest break will be if you get in as a runner in one of the better studios with excellent engineers. That's the time you do your job, shut-the-fuck-up, and LISTEN and OBSERVE how the engineers conduct their sessions. THAT'S your real education.


As to your general comments about people and recording schools.... like i said -

1) you can spend a couple of years and a ton of money to go to recording school, end-up learning a little just so you can then work in a studio as a runner and hopefully work your way up......

OR

2) you can spend your spare time studying all you can about recording, spending only a modest amount of money in the process, end-up learning a little just so you can then work in a studio as a runner and hopefully work your way up......

Whatever works best for you...!

Good luck at school!
 
Listen to Blue Bear- he's knows what he's talking about.

I'm not going to mock Full Sail- I've never been there. But I'll paraphrase some statements made by a dear friend of mine who did go there.

"I learned more about engineering working with you on a 4-track back at college."

Mind you, he learned TONS of stuff about recording and the industry while at Full Sail, but he was saying that he learned more about the creativity and ingenuity of recording working with me. We were both know-nothing kids, but we created some amazing stuff by being persistent and creative.

"Their job placement policy sucks. They taught us how to solder electronics and concider a job in manufacturing to be a relavant placement." (I'm not kidding.)

"I mainly learned to know everyone's name. EVERYONE. I've seen people get fired from a session for not knowing who it was that walked in the door." (I'm not kidding. If you thought it was just about knobs and sliders, you are in for a surprise.)

Sound like a bitter guy told me those things?

Not at all. He got a job (with an alcoholic, psychotic studio owner who went through assistant engineers quickly) right out of Full Sail. He worked at that studio for about a year and a half because he was meeting people, making contacts, and getting enough real experience to justify the abuse. He got the job because he was a Full Sail student... oh, and he had helped his parents run a multi-million business all his life.

After leaving that job, he took out a small business loan, bought a couple ADATs (yes, it was a little while ago), and an 8 bus Soundtracs board (used and beatup) and started his own studio. 5 years later, he sold it for just over a million dollars and moved back to his hometown with his wife and new baby- and took over his parents' eductaion business.

He is now making 3 times as much money, has twice as much time with his family, and *still* has a mid-scale studio in his house- which he owns- and still gets occasional mastering work from Sony and RCA (I think.)

Not because he went to Full Sail, but because he was born and raised a business man and chose to make recording his business. Ful Sail gave him the initial foot in the door and that's the only reason he went. As soon as he got the job offer he left and didn't finish his "degree."

Good luck and enjoy! Don't let the glitz and glamour of the sales pitch you are going to get in January cloud your thinking- its business and nothing else.

Take care,
Chris
 
Please do not hobble yourself with debt or squander (if you have it) your Army education assistance. Find a Junior College with coursework in audio recording and go there, spend you savings on gear to get experience on you own. Record bands for free, provide free mastering, whatever, to get experience while you get your A.A. (if that is what you want). If you do get your A.A. (A.S.) and want, spend your money on a Bachelors degree.

I do not have knowledge about FullSail, but I do have knowledge about career schools, and I have reviewed the FullSail web site. FullSale is a better name. Going the A.A. via a J.C. may not be exciting, but neither is poverty and disappointment. FullSail is selling a dream. Buy reality.
 
wheelema said:
FullSail is selling a dream. Buy reality.
Click to expand...

god damn that smashed me.. I cant say nothing in reference to that.. I feel like crawling under a rock n not talking to anyone ever again about full sail...
 
Here's the thing about the studio business. Nobody is hiring.

There are probably less than a few dozen studios outside of LA, NY or Nashville that actually have a paid staff. The rest are full of interns, friends and other wannabes trying to get a break or just doing it because they love it.

If you want to be an audio engineer than buy some gear, read up and practice. If you are going to make a serious investment into your career then you need to make sure you are making a smart investment. I think there are many ways you could spend $30K that would have much more tangible benefits. At the very least spend the money on your own gear so if you decide recording is not for you you will still have some assets that you can sell.

I recently went through the same process looking at helicopter pilot schools. They all paint a rosey picture of the industry but the truth is you spend $50K to get into an industry where your lucky to make $20k/year to start.

All the cool jobs pay for shit and hard to get. It's pretty much a law of nature.
 
I second the vote for going to a community college if you are interested in this stuff. A buddy of mine went to Valencia Community College in Orlando to study recording and engineering. I dont know the details of the program, but i think they have at least a basic bunch of sound engineering classes. Plus if the army will pay for it you would only have to worry about rent and food.

I am sure there are other C.C's that have entry level sound programs.



anton
 
...

This does not pertain exactly to full sail, but it’s the same kind of story
I graduated with a BFA (bachelor of fine arts) in contemporary sculpture from Penn State University, studying under some really well known artists. A BFA is a tougher program to go through then just a BA, not only did I have to study visual arts, but I had to go through rigorous crits, philosophical debates, endless lectures on art history, etc...
Now I loved doing this, and learning is my foremost passion, but after I graduated, like many people in any kind of "art" program (music, visual arts, creative writing etc...) I could not find a job, or internship that wasn’t already filled, and I did not want to go to grad school right away.
So I have been working a 9-5 type job for over 3 years now, and in that time, to keep my mind occupied I taught myself everything I need to know about music, and how to create it.
Basically the moral of the story is this
Going to undergrad school for 6 years has yielded me no kind of job in my field, thus leaving me a "starving artist" type and having to work a 9-5 job to pay my bills for new equipment or whatever

Like blue bear said, you have to pay your dues no matter what
And you don’t learn that until you experience it for yourself, or you actually stop and listen to the people that have been through it already

peace
LB
 
Well I think thats the wrong approach, ok buy gear and then what? Now you have gear that you dont know how to use becuz you cant grasp things like signal processing or where it even comes from never mind get a grasp on good sound.. I think your opinion about school is wrong and i think your opinion about no body's hiring is wrong, and i definately think your opinion about 20k a year is wrong lol.. i mean theres e people over from from umass lowell working at a studio makin over 30k so im not sure how you or anyone else figures that.. buying my own equipment, useless i have no house or place to put it nevermind the funds to buy anything like that, lets remember, student loans are alot different then getting a personal loan.. and also i think since thats what you probably did you think its the only way, 30k at fullsail to u is a waste, well its not all paid at once and it carry's an interest rate of 2.9% over 16 years, so do tha math its not hurtin too bad.. I mean the only evidence ive seen so far that full sail is bad news is the fact that there credits cant be applied to any other university's, i dont care about there job placement program i think u should look for your own job.. Im flying down to check it out on jan9th, well ill jus have to ask the students if its a good school right? im also lookin at umass lowell and berkely except berkeley's price is rediculous so there probably out of the picture.. I jus happen to think theres more ways to learn then just buying ur own shit and trying to wing it from there...
 
Thirst said:
Well I think thats the wrong approach, ok buy gear and then what? Now you have gear that you dont know how to use becuz you cant grasp things like signal processing or where it even comes from never mind get a grasp on good sound.. I think your opinion about school is wrong and i think your opinion about no body's hiring is wrong, and i definately think your opinion about 20k a year is wrong lol.. i mean theres e people over from from umass lowell working at a studio makin over 30k so im not sure how you or anyone else figures that.. buying my own equipment, useless i have no house or place to put it nevermind the funds to buy anything like that, lets remember, student loans are alot different then getting a personal loan.. and also i think since thats what you probably did you think its the only way, 30k at fullsail to u is a waste, well its not all paid at once and it carry's an interest rate of 2.9% over 16 years, so do tha math its not hurtin too bad.. I mean the only evidence ive seen so far that full sail is bad news is the fact that there credits cant be applied to any other university's, i dont care about there job placement program i think u should look for your own job.. Im flying down to check it out on jan9th, well ill jus have to ask the students if its a good school right? im also lookin at umass lowell and berkely except berkeley's price is rediculous so there probably out of the picture.. I jus happen to think theres more ways to learn then just buying ur own shit and trying to wing it from there...
Click to expand...

Keep this in mind: Bruce (Blue Bear) is IN the business. He KNOWS what he's talking about. Maybe YOU are the one that's wrong, and not him. Afterall, he's had how many years experience compared to your no experience?



However. I had the choice to go to either the Art Institute of Seattle or a UW Extension Course. The difference was $36,000 and quitting my job compared to $2500 and going to school at night.

Working in a real studio while in those classes helped me grasp some simple things, but the bulk of my learning has been from asking stupid questions on this bbs (Yes, you can search for my posts and my first one was "What is a preamp?") and reading books.

The rest has been me buying a board and some mics and recording my band. Experience.



What the others are trying to say about studios is true. They're not looking for someone that's going to come into their studio and revolutionize the way they record and mix. As a matter of fact, they'll probably forget about a kid that's trying to change everything. They want someone to come in that will shut up, get them coffee, and keep the break room clean.
 
Thirst said:
I jus happen to think theres more ways to learn then just buying ur own shit and trying to wing it from there...
Click to expand...

Mixing is an art. You can't learn it by sitting in class and listening to a teacher.
 
^ and you also cant learn it by sitting with some equipment you dont know how to run in the first place, and develope sound when you cant understand things like signal processing.. so you make no sence dont talk if your points arent valid

and second I wasnt contridicting blue bear, i was contradicting the other dolomite who posted the oh so ignorant post about shit i DO THINK he knows nothing about.. You'll never convince me that someone damn good at what they do wont land a job either working for someone else or on his own... Now becuz i say I want to go to fullsail doesnt mean im going to learn everything I want, Im bringing all my recording stuff with me to fullsail and ill continue to excel in my recording ways, but how do u get off sayin an education isnt worth it, i dont get it.. and your just thinking studio as in some small peice of shit studio with one booth, the studios over here in the city where im from are nice and they have 2 graduates from full sail, 1 from umass lowell and 1 from berkely, the head engineer said there all awesome people that came there knowing there shit.. he said only difference was full sail is one of the few state of the art learning facility's in the US... you say buy ur own stuff n learn from that, plz man.. Im 20 and i live with my parents, time to get out and the best option is school... and why not learn about what I love doing..
 
Hey Blue Bear, if you don't mind- it might really advance this thread if you told us a little of how you got into the recording business.

And I'll share how I became a "pro" at it- though I'm only worthy of the word "pro" by the fact that I make money at it. Don't confuse the label with any expectation of ability beyond the fact that some people doing small projects concider my skills enough to pay for.

I write music and wanted to record it. When I was 15 I bought a cassette 4-track for $800. Best $800 I ever spent. I used it almost constantly for almost 13 years. I sucked at first, but at that time I was more interested in arranging the songs than making them sound good- and no one at that time had any illusions that home equipment could compete with pro equipment.

The guy who went to full sail was a high school senior at the time and wanted to help me record. He showed my how to hunt down noise in the signal chain and kill it. Lo and behold, the music started sounding good. I was hooked, completely, and became a sound quality nazi with the recordings. In addition to writing and arranging songs, I enjoyed the challenge of squeezing as much performance as possible out of my humble gear.

My goal wasn't to be an engineer or I could have focused on that aspect of it more. My goal was to produce my own CD because I could never afford studio time. That drove my hunt for a high quality of sound.

14 years later, all that knowledge came to play when an opportunity opened up at a place where I maintain the computers. They need someone who knows sound and video to be a house engineer and run the video department.

"How soon is the position open?"

"In 3 months. By the way, do you know Pro Tools?"

"Yes. On top of 13 years of analog recording, I've been recording digitally for 3 years. All of my clients have been satisfied with the projects they've recorded with me."

"Great. You're hired."

Of course, the truth is I had only played with Pro Tools FREE once a couple years back and had no idea how to use it. I'd been using n-track and Cubase for those 3 years. I bought a Digi 002 and spent the next 3 months living and breathing Pro Tools. I know how to use Pro Tools now and make my living, partially, off of that skill- along with the rest of the stuff I learned about the recording process and working with people over the last 15 years.

And it doesn't matter that all of those "clients" were friends or friends of friends. The statement was true, regardless of how little money (usually none) changed hands.

It wouldn't have taken 15 years if I had focused on it, but I also haven't paid a cent for education. It is real world experience that is relavant to the position that got me the job. And its a lot more than setting up mics and moving faders: managing expenses and personell, scheduling, maintaining the facility and equipment, training interns, teaching classes, giving tours to important visitors...etc.

Any way, I guess I'm rambling and probably not a good example. But I thought I'd share at least my unlikely, but real-world, example.

Take care,
Chris
 
YOUR 16 YEARS of recording, me going to full sail probably shaves 10 of that off, the other 6 i can learn what ever I like, besides what were you doing before that recording job? maintaning computers? yea that dont sound too fucken nice either pal, so you did your deeds you paid your dues you sound like a hard working guy, u sound like u diserved wat u got.. but man, dont confuse the facts.. full sail dont guarentee u NOTHING.. its what u put into it.. have u seen the going rate for an education these days.. sure i could sit at home n twiddle wit books n over the years take in shit, but i gaurentee it would be alot easier at fullsail or any other college willing to teach you.. Im really amazed you tought yourself all that.. to be honest ive tought myself cool edit pro 2.0, nuendo and fruity loops in the span of 7 months, i mean if u listen to my songs, there not bad, they could be better but there not bad, i make good music, i write my own music, i produce it but i dont understand how i make it sound good, sure i run it threw a parametric equalizer but how does it make it sound good.. ? how does the industry work? those are the things i want to learn.. not mockin ur settup its just not a possibility for me, i cant afford to bring strangers into my moms house up into my room to record, and learn from that.. i cant.. im forced to go another route..


Alright let me say this


why the fuck are you telling me this.. I mean thats how it is in every job you look at.. no matter wat career you choose, if your a nurse u start our interning shit jobs and decent pay and REAL SHIT hours.. Trying to be a tattoo artist which I AM, you have to intern and build up credibility.. Only things like being a lawyer and a doctor pay off right away and thats becuz you have to go to school for 8+ years... being a computer programmer pays well but u can be fired ona moments notice.. So far Ive swapped engines out of cars, painted cars, built computers, done tattoo's, won numerous art contests in school, play instruments and none of them compare to me recording a song that I wrote.. No matter what you did its shit at first but in the long run makes up for it.. There are engineers over here making 110k a year, Its just wat your willing to do to get there.. I was a cook for 3 years ina kitchen wit a chef, i worked from sweepin floors, to serving, then to helpin the head chef, ive done landscaping in the wintter shoveling and in the 100 degree weather we have, I truley think the people that are bad mouthing any school are the lazy ass prics who werent willing to work and instead sit there lazy ass's on computer chairs and have nothing better to do then bad mouth them.. If I could meet yall i seriously would cuz from a hard workers prospective whos made alot out of nothing youz a bunch of sad ass individuals if you think like that...
 
Last edited:
Thirst said:
If I could meet y'all, I seriously would because, from a hard workers perspective, [someone] who's made a lot out of nothing, you are a bunch of sad individuals if you think like that...
Click to expand...

I think I speak for all when I say it certainly is time for school. Which school, I'm not quite sure...:rolleyes:
 
theres always a dick in the crowd.. im here tryin to figure out why full sail is mocked thats all.. i read the course description at umass lowell and its the same, only fullsails equipment is new and they fit it in less time.. there both the same price the 4 year university is a little bit more.. ima hard worker as to some of the things ive accomplished in such a little time man thats all i meant..

I was supposed to go to sleep a while ago but i been up all night researchin schools tryin to find reviews on full sail and any other programs that are out there, instead i have to take a nap now and wake up in an hour to go to my job that pays me 6.75 an hour to hang up clothes ina store.. maybe now u understand my grumpiness..
 
Thirst said:
Alright let me say this


why the fuck are you telling me this.. I mean thats how it is in every job you look at.. no matter wat career you choose, if your a nurse u start our interning shit jobs and decent pay and REAL SHIT hours.. Trying to be a tattoo artist which I AM, you have to intern and build up credibility.. Only things like being a lawyer and a doctor pay off right away and thats becuz you have to go to school for 8+ years... being a computer programmer pays well but u can be fired ona moments notice.. So far Ive swapped engines out of cars, painted cars, built computers, done tattoo's, won numerous art contests in school, play instruments, make music, and work out.. No matter what you did its shit at first but in the long run makes up for it.. There are engineers over here making 110k a year, Its just wat your willing to do to get there.. I was a cook for 3 years ina kitchen wit a chef, i worked from sweepin floors, to serving, then to helpin the head chef, ive done landscaping in the wintter shoveling and in the 100 degree weather we have, I truley think the people that are bad mouthing any school are the lazy ass prics who werent willing to work and instead sit there lazy ass's on computer chairs and have nothing better to do then bad mouth them.. If I could meet yall i seriously would cuz from a hard workers prospective whos made alot out of nothing youz a bunch of sad ass individuals if you think like that...
Click to expand...
Well, I'm unemployed and killing time until we move to our new place the first of next month, whereupon I lose my broadband connection and have to hit the bricks.

Who in the heck do you think you are communicating with? I really want to use some profanity here, but I'm trying to be a better person. Hope you appreciate it.

Spare us your resume. Those of use who are conversant with the proper use of the English language have been around the block ten or twenty more times than you and seen more than we would like of foul mouthed egocentric little shits (whoops). Most of us are being really paternal and are trying to impart good advice.

For example, I was a teacher at a career school for the the better part of a year. It was a business. There was no alturism involved, the owners didn't give a damn about whether or not you got a job upon graduation. They tried to give good value because that was good business, but by it's nature the value provided wasn't enough to justify the expense. Nobody is suggesting that buying gear and staring at is going to impart knowledge. That's why the junior colleges were mentioned. You go to the J.C. and THEN you stare at the gear. The J.C. is going to give you EXACTLY THE SAME KNOWLEDGE as a career school, they just won't put you as deeply in debt. What? You think a career school has special knowledge?? Industry contacts?? Miracles in their back pocket??

Everyone with an I.Q. above 85 knows that the recording industry is tanking and major long standing studio are closing for lack of business. Make you little bet. Go to the graduating audio recording class of FullSail... tell 'em you're doing a study and can you write them after a year to hear about their experiences in the industry. Spend the year yourself going to your local J.C. and packing in lower division classes. Write them after the year is up to see how they're doing.

I'll send you a buck for every letter you send me that says they're working in the industry. I'll bet I won't have to pay out more than a buck or two.

Do what you want. If you don't want good advice, fine. Leave.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top