SM-57, SM-58 and e835

C

Centropolis

New member
I am very new to recording and was handed down from my brother a Shure SM-57, SM-58 and a Sennheiser e835.

Generally speaking, my understanding is the Sm-58 and e835 are vocal mics and Sm-57 is an instrument mic.

My newbie question is, what makes the 57 and instrument mic and not the 58? Can I get away with miking an electric guitar amp with an 58 or the e835?

Another newbie question is, will using a large diaphragm condenser mic such as a Rode NT-1A on miking an electric guitar amp a good idea or is the signal too strong for sensitive mics?
 
The windscreens are the difference.

There is no reason the NT1 cannot handle a guitar amp...I have the loudest one (Sunn Model T) and it still doesnt kill most modern LDC mics.
 
You can use the 57 for almost anything. I read somewhere (on Sure's site I think) that a 57 has been used on the podium for the President for the last 30 years.
 
Centropolis said:
I am very new to recording and was handed down from my brother a Shure SM-57, SM-58 and a Sennheiser e835.

Generally speaking, my understanding is the Sm-58 and e835 are vocal mics and Sm-57 is an instrument mic.

My newbie question is, what makes the 57 and instrument mic and not the 58? Can I get away with miking an electric guitar amp with an 58 or the e835?

Another newbie question is, will using a large diaphragm condenser mic such as a Rode NT-1A on miking an electric guitar amp a good idea or is the signal too strong for sensitive mics?
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You CAN use the NT1 on an amp--the question is do you WANT to? You have to try it and find out. I sometimes use a condenser as a main amp mic when tracking clean sounds; I also use it back a few feet as a second "room" mic sometimes when recording distorted guitar. The main mic in that case is usually a dynamic (like your 57).

There's no better (or funner--is that a word?) way to find out than to try 'em yourself. You'll get a good sense of what works when and learn about the mics along the way.
 
darrin_h2000 said:
The windscreens are the difference.

There is no reason the NT1 cannot handle a guitar amp...I have the loudest one (Sunn Model T) and it still doesnt kill most modern LDC mics.
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So if the windscreen is the only different, the pattern and frequency response is the same for the 58 and 57....then I can enssential use the 58 for everything that what others mostly use the 57 for? Am I on the right track?

What I am trying to do is sell the mics I don't 'need' and then make some money to buy a decent LDC. My 'decent' is in the price range of the NT1.
 
You should be able to turn the shures for $60 ea on the first day of a craigslist ad...while people are there let them deal with you on the sennheiser...while it is almost as good as the SM58 its not that popular so expect $40 for it...add about $100 and you can find something decent to bid on at Ebay...but I wouldnt settle for the bottom of the line of an off brand...you could have an AT40 series used arround there.
 
darrin_h2000 said:
You should be able to turn the shures for $60 ea on the first day of a craigslist ad...while people are there let them deal with you on the sennheiser...while it is almost as good as the SM58 its not that popular so expect $40 for it...add about $100 and you can find something decent to bid on at Ebay...but I wouldnt settle for the bottom of the line of an off brand...you could have an AT40 series used arround there.
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Thanks for your comments!

I was just talking to a local sales person on the phone and I described what I wanted to do. He told me that he thinks my weakest link is not my microphones but rather, the mic preamps on my old-school Fostex MR-8Mkii. So he suggested that I should keep the mics and spend the $200 to $300 on entry-level (but not the cheapest) mic preamp like a PreSonus Bluetube. He said it should make a more significant difference in sound quality everything else being equal.

What do you think? I know this is kind of change of my original topic. ;)
 
Centropolis said:
Thanks for your comments!

I was just talking to a local sales person on the phone and I described what I wanted to do. He told me that he thinks my weakest link is not my microphones but rather, the mic preamps on my old-school Fostex MR-8Mkii. So he suggested that I should keep the mics and spend the $200 to $300 on entry-level (but not the cheapest) mic preamp like a PreSonus Bluetube. He said it should make a more significant difference in sound quality everything else being equal.

What do you think? I know this is kind of change of my original topic. ;)
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Run the other way as fast as you can...trust me...the Presonus blue tube is something Ive had experience with...and it is a bad peice...if you decide to go that way anyhow Ill sell you mine for half the price...its sitting on a karaoke rig right now...useless in my studio.

Sales people push things because they are told to...not because they care about what YOUR goals are...Ive never seen one that knew shit about recording...and its pretty apparant that this one doesnt either.
 
darrin_h2000 said:
Run the other way as fast as you can...trust me...the Presonus blue tube is something Ive had experience with...and it is a bad peice...if you decide to go that way anyhow Ill sell you mine for half the price...its sitting on a karaoke rig right now...useless in my studio.

Sales people push things because they are told to...not because they care about what YOUR goals are...Ive never seen one that knew shit about recording...and its pretty apparant that this one doesnt either.
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So I assume your opinion still is to get a better mic and stay with the Fostex preamp. And that will improve the sound more significantly?

BTW, what do you find not good about the Bluetube considering the price point?
 
Not necessarily. You might profit from a better preamp. In the cheap range I like M-Audio DMP-3. I'm not a fan of the Blue Tube either. If you want 2 SM57's, just unscrew the ball cap of the SM58, and don't bash it or spit on it. Voila! It's an SM57. Oddly enough, I prefer the Sennheiser to either one for most stuff, but that puts me in the (significant) minority. For an inexpensive all around condenser mic that's very good on cabs, I like AKG C2000B, and Shure KSM32 has become an industry standard, but costs a bit more. Good Luck-Richie
 
Centropolis said:
So I assume your opinion still is to get a better mic and stay with the Fostex preamp. And that will improve the sound more significantly?

BTW, what do you find not good about the Bluetube considering the price point?
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The Bluetube is just a bad pre...its a toob pre...the tube doesnt work...they just add distortion noise at the highs to make you think you are warming it up...they are for suckers.

The DMP3 that was reccomended above is a good option...and can be found used cheap.
 
Yonce N Mild said:
I'd keep those mics. You'll find uses for them down the road guaranteed. You can never have too many 57s.
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Then I would have to fund my M-Audio DMP3 some other ways. Maybe selling a few of my flashlights (yes I know...weird hobby).

With the SM-57s, I remembered using them before for vocals and I would have to be very mindful when I am singing straight into it. It's like I can really tell the signal when I am 'off the sweet spot'. I guess I can get those cheap ball-shaped form thingy to put over the 57 to turn it into a 58? :)
 
Thats true...you will allways find uses for those dynamics...use that preamp money and bid on a used Shure KSM32...thats what Id do in your situation If I wanted a LCD.
 
You'll generaly get beter mileage from upgrading the pre.

Pretty reasonable mics, like the shures, through a better pre will almost certailnly give you a better result than getting a slighly better mic and running it through the same ultra lowend pre

Just be certain to get something with a good amount of useable gain as those dynamic mics eat it up. I think the DMP would work out as a good place, at least to start from
 
Bristol Posse said:
You'll generaly get beter mileage from upgrading the pre.
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Depends on how bad the pre is. I've seen pres for about $25 per channel from Peavey's *low end mixers* that claim 0.0007% THD and noise floors that border on the limits of the laws of physics. You really can't upgrade significantly from there no matter what you do at the pre. The state of the art has come a long way in the last few years to the point that a lot of very low end hardware these days is incredibly good.

The microphone, by contrast, can make a *huge* difference in the sound with relatively small component changes, from FET changes in a condenser (using lower noise parts) to capacitor changes (reducing harshness in the highs) to going with a different capsule entirely (or even a ribbon instead of a dynamic or a condenser). It's pretty easy to make a significant improvement in sound by changing mics.

Although the SM57/SM58 definitely are useful for some things, I would never recommend them as somebody's only mic. They just aren't accurate enough or flat enough to hold up well when you start layering lots of tracks. Just my $0.02.
 
Centropolis said:
Then I would have to fund my M-Audio DMP3 some other ways. Maybe selling a few of my flashlights (yes I know...weird hobby).
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My man, if you're already selling stuff and all you have gear-wise is a couple of cheap dynamic mics, consider giving up this whole music gig and taking up a less expensive hobby... this jouney could well require you to sell both your house and your soul!

... walk away....

:eek:

Kidding of course, but it only gets worse. +1 on the preamp by the way...
 
I use the e835..I find it a very good mic, especially robust the amount of times Ive dropped it off my desk...if you're selling the other one for $40 let me know, Id maybe hang on to these if I was you...they're all good and you may find yourself looking for them in the future??
 
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