Recording "Live" with a HD24

[michaelst]

Tax return will arrive shortly - allocated to purchase a HD24. I work for 2 bands that both want live recordings.

I mix the shows with a Midas Venice 320. What I'd like to do is use the direct outs on the channels into the HD24 and remix on my computer (using N-Tracks probably).
I'll be picking up a 24 channel balanced patch snake. I need 17 channels for one band, 21 for the other.

I know the Venice direct outs are post-fader, so if i change them to switched to pre-fader, the signal will be dependant on the trim(gain) pot. Normally, I have to good gain structure - all channels peaking at zero.

The HD recommends the peaks on each channel to be -12 to -15. This might present a problem if they are at zero on the Midas. Is there anything I can do to have better control on the input to the HD24?

 

[mshilarious]

The HD recommends the peaks on each channel to be -12 to -15. This might present a problem if they are at zero on the Midas. Is there anything I can do to have better control on the input to the HD24?

No the operating level of the HD24 is -15dBFS = +4dBu. It's the average level that should be -15dBFS, not the peaks. You should be fine if you calibrate trims to 0VU.

 

[xstatic]

You will run out of headroom at the Midas before you hit the HD24 too hard. The biggest problem is the post fader direct out. You can't swithch the direct outs on a Venice to pre fade unless you open up the console and resolder a buss wire on every channel. This will also void your warranty. I believe though if you send the Midas into their service repair in Minnesota they will do the mod for you for about $150 ( plus shipping). I recently did several multitrack recordings at the Sundance film festival using the same console with a different HD recorder. Make sure you make good use of your bussing so that you can try to retain some abilities to do the live mix without affecting your track volumes. I reccomend mixing the show in mono so that you can use all 4 busses. If the band is pretty good with their dynamics you should be able to do a good mix just riding the busses and then your tracks to tape will be pretty consistent.

 

[mshilarious]

Void your warranty? Man, that's rough. In the A&H Mixwizard manual, they even show you how to do the mod! And I think on their Mixwizard v3, it's a jumper. I wouldn't pay no $150 for a mod that takes 15 minutes.

 

[xstatic]

15 minutes to carefully cut, make a new wire, and resolder leads? It will take far longer than that. It has to be done on all 24 channels. A wrong move and you may be sending the board in for repairs instead of just modifications. If it was just a jumper, no problem. I would be fairly surprised if opening up a mix wiz doesn't void the warranty there as well. Often times consoles that have dipsitches have them externally available. The Midas does not. I talked directly with Steve (?) who does the Venice repairs to find out the info that I did because I was interested in doing the exact same thing with one of my venices. If it were a Behringer I would not hesitate to rip it open and risk it, but I would seriously advise against voiding the warranty (which is a 3 year warranty by the way) on something as nice as a Midas.

 

[mshilarious]

15 minutes to carefully cut, make a new wire, and resolder leads? It will take far longer than that. It has to be done on all 24 channels. A wrong move and you may be sending the board in for repairs instead of just modifications

It might take ME a half-hour, but I meant sending it in--yeah, I bet it takes them 15 minutes. On the A&H, that wire is near the bottom of the channel PCB, it's real easy to get to. You don't have to pull the board to do it. They shouldn't charge such a high price for a simple mod that arguably should have come from the factory that way. Although if that includes the shipping back & forth won't be cheap.

In the A&H warranty, it states: Conditions of Warranty 2) The equipment has not been subject to . . . alteration other than as described in the User Guide or Service Manual. The direct out mod is described in the User Guide, along with a detailed diagram. They also have approved mods to the aux channels to make them pre-/post- fader, on, and EQ.

I never worry about the warranty because I buy everything used and I make unapproved mods, but I'd think twice about a company if they had an unreasonable warranty policy.

 

[michaelst]

Thanks for all the great info, guys.

I'm taking my Venice over to Telex in Minnesota next week to have a channel checked out (#7 is crunching), so I think I'll have them do the post-to-pre mod when they have the cover off.

Maybe I can hire myself out in the future to do mobile recordings (I may have to, to make up the money spent on the HD24).

 

[HangDawg]

Void your warranty? Man, that's rough. In the A&H Mixwizard manual, they even show you how to do the mod! And I think on their Mixwizard v3, it's a jumper. I wouldn't pay no $150 for a mod that takes 15 minutes.

I just bought an Allen & Heath GL-2200 and I'm about to do the post to pre fader thing. It kind of sucks to crack open a new piece of equipment but it has to be done as I use this board to record live and the direct outs need to be pre-fader.

 

[xstatic]

I am glad that it only takes you a half an hour. If it takes a professional a half an hour, you can expect that a non pro may take as much as 2 hours to get it done then and it may not be done as well. I think Midas's warranty is absolutely excellent. If it were me selling consoles I would absolutely void a warranty if a customer popped the lid and started doing mods without prior approval and authorization.

Personally, given the cost of other repairs at other places, $150 for a 24 channel mod is very fair to me I agree that the direct out's probably should have come pre fade, but they don't. That was Midas's decision to make ( for whatever their reason was), and we all should know that stuff before we decide to buy one I love my Midas stuff, but I always warn people about the limitations of a Venice before buying one. They are really all about the sound quality, not the features. And since no other console comes even remotely close in an even remotely similar price range.....