Recording/Audio Production Schools

  • Thread starter Thread starter ez_willis
  • Start date Start date
Went to Dallas Sound Labs here. Not graduated yet, but almost. So far, it's been a learning experience, and I 'kinda' knew my stuff already before entering the school, but i went anyways.

Now, I started a recording label back in 2002 named Mindset Entertainment (3 artists). All pro done. Anyways, of course it wasn't going much anyways, small steps. Now a days, after going to the school (mostly my fault), I'm working with known names in the music industry, selling productions (instrumentals) in the upper $4k easily (usually deals with 5 up to a full album production that can go up to the $40-50K), talked to multi-platinum artists about newer projects, been on the radio numerous times, and currently got hooked up by my teacher for the Dallas Angels, of course, some of you know who the Angels are, and they reside everywhere. Multi-million dollar investments are coming my way, once I get the presentation finished. In post production & mastering, I got to lay my hands into a new movie that's part of that film festival, not a bad movie either. There's a lot of tips & technical crap that I learned that I probably wouldn't learned as fast with regular gear. For those who know who he is, I'm working with Kanye West's people, and his new twin artist group that about to come out with a CD, Chris Charles, and more. Above that, now I got connects to a few radio stations, and XM radio stations. My teacher is one who helped put the Meko & Neko together for OpenLabs, and also knows Yamaha & AKG presidents real well (at least I know of those 2). I got to meet these fellows, and they real nice. Ok, I could have went out and bought a 500K SSL console, 2-3 million in the building, 100K in the outboard gear, and various other stuff to learn on it.... However, it wasn't logical. Put me in any studio, and chances are I probably will know how to use everything with near no learning curb to start operation. If I was to buy my own gear, and place me in one of Harbor House Studios' control rooms, I would probably get it, but tinkering around for days.
Today, 12 artists with Mindset Entertainment
 
"this paper telling me about your school means shit. We just installed a new console this week in our studio, do you know how to run it?"
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i'd tell him to give me a signal flow chart and 2 hours in the control room...
 
I'm doing a 2+2 to get my gen ed done in my hometown, then going to belmont university in nashville for audio engineering technology.

My friend went there and in his freshman year the guy he was interning with hired him. So he dropped out.

He now has his own studio 3 years later. Another one of my friends (Brian Moore) is taking art classes at a community college and just bought the studio that he has been working at for a few years. I'm excited because I know that whatever happens, I will have somewhere to go to get work. If i stay in Nashville, I can intern under my friend down there, and if I stay in my hometown, I can intern here. I knew that audio engineering was a hard field to get into and that its almost impossible to find a job in such a field, but I knew that I had to do it as well because i love it. I couldent stand doing anything else for the rest of my life. I just hope that the connections I have made can swing me out far enough into the business to help me out. I'm also interning over the summer at Brian's studio because I agree on the fact that experience means a lot in this business.

I know this thread is about schools that you have completed degrees from, but i wanted to share my story and see if it is realistic for me to think that I can get in easy because I have connections. I'm not trying to be cocky and im sorry if I come off as that, saying I know this person or that person, but these are guys I've known since church summer camp as kids.

sorry if it came off as rambling...



-surf
 
surfmaster said:
i wanted to share my story and see if it is realistic for me to think that I can get in easy because I have connections.
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No, it's not realistic. You'll need to push that dream deep down inside of you and never let it surface again. Hopefully there's a factory nearby that needs someone to inspect buttons for quality control(x 13,000 per shift) or take Part A from this machine and put it on top of Part B on that machine and press the red button to force them together, for the next 35 years.

If they were regular old childhood friends, I would say you had a pretty good shot of getting a gig at one of their studios, but you met them at church camp, so it's different.
 
ez_willis said:
No, it's not realistic. You'll need to push that dream deep down inside of you and never let it surface again. Hopefully there's a factory nearby that needs someone to inspect buttons for quality control(x 13,000 per shift) or take Part A from this machine and put it on top of Part B on that machine and press the red button to force them together, for the next 35 years.

If they were regular old childhood friends, I would say you had a pretty good shot of getting a gig at one of their studios, but you met them at church camp, so it's different.
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I should clarify, because at 17 you seem really gullable, which is normal for that part of the country, I just don't want to be held responsible for the female that would be on the receiving end of a lifetime of anger and hostility you'd have from inspecting 13,000 buttons per day for the next 35 years.


WITHOUT KNOWING YOU OR EITHER OF THE PEOPLE YOU REFERENCED, IT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE FOR ANY OF US TO KNOW IF IT'S REALISTIC FOR YOU TO THINK YOU'D HAVE A GOOD CHANCE OF LANDING A JOB AT ONE OF THEIR STUDIOS.

Whew!
 
surfmaster said:
i wanted to share my story and see if it is realistic for me to think that I can get in easy because I have connections.
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The key word in that sentence is "easy". To answer that question literally, the answer would be that connections only get you so far, and even then it depends upon the quality of the connections you have and - evn more - the quality of connections you can develop after those initial connections help you in.

In my expereince (other may have different experiences), in this racket "connections" - in the form of nepotism and in building and working personal networks - are a HUGE factor. This is true on both sides of the glass. They, however, are only as useful as the reputation you build along with those connections. If you start building (for whatever reason) a less-than-stellar reputation, then even the best connections aen't going to help you a great deal because nobody is going to want to attach their name to you as someone who recommends you or hires you if they have questions about your ability to do the job well. They have their own reputations to consider.

This is not one of those industries where connections alone will get you to the top...at least not for long. Connections won't get you lead engineer or producer status on anything but the crappy clients no one else wants. Connections may get you into a front door or two that you couldn't get into otherwise, but from there it's sink or swim and totally up to you to make a name for yourself as someone whose reliable, likeable and qualified, or you won't get the gigs and the doors will stop opening.

G.
 
thanks for all the advice guys i love critique like this. First off, i didnt just meet these guys at a church camp, they are family friends who I went to church and school with and who I have grown up with, along with their older siblings being close friends with my older siblings. Brian has listened to some of my stuff and flat out told me that he would hire me out of high school because he thinks I have an ear which can be tought, but knew that I should get my degree if that is what is in my heart.

But I know that there is no way for me to do anything just because I know somebody.

Sorry if i made it sound that way, or if I came off as sounding like the high schooler who wants to be the guy that hangs out with the bands, I tried not to. I know that I need to build a rep and i've been working on that for a year now doing projects for high school bands and live demos with a friend's help for larger acts in rochester. I understand that theres no such thing as a free lunch.

But really thanks for all the advice and pointers.


-surf
 
surfmaster said:
thanks for all the advice guys i love critique like this. First off, i didnt just meet these guys at a church camp, they are family friends who I went to church and school with and who I have grown up with, along with their older siblings being close friends with my older siblings.
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Yeah, ummmm, I was joking.
 
I've told this story a thousand times already on this site. I'm pretty sure no one wants to hear it again. I'm for going to school at least for networking purposes.
 
I have had interns at my studio. Didnt know there ass from their elbow. Maybe others have had different. Oh sure, they know how to backup up a ProTools session, or how to install and format a hard drive but mic a drum kit! Fugedaboutit! In todays industry I think going to school for recording is insane. As a sideline great, as a secondary fine. Primary income, no. I also think that what you can learn on your own and from places such as this site is impressive. Some stuff( music, recording, mixing) here sucks but some is very well recorded and mixed. If I had to do it again and I wanted to get into recording as a full time gig here is what I'd do. Learn as much as I could. Read Mix and alike. Hookup with a local studio that has GOOD reputation. Work for free cleaning, being a runner or whatever. Express your interest in your goal to be an engineer. DO THAT JOB EXTREMELY WELL. I think engineering is one field that if you really know your shit and have tallent a degree does not matter AT ALL. Maybe Im wrong but I dont think so. Work your way into an assistant position, then engineer then maybe head engineer. I have known many people that have done it that way Surfmaster right here in Rochester ,NY
 
jmorris said:
I have had interns at my studio. Didnt know there ass from their elbow. Maybe others have had different. Oh sure, they know how to backup up a ProTools session, or how to install and format a hard drive but mic a drum kit! Fugedaboutit! In todays industry I think going to school for recording is insane. As a sideline great, as a secondary fine. Primary income, no. I also think that what you can learn on your own and from places such as this site is impressive. Some stuff( music, recording, mixing) here sucks but some is very well recorded and mixed. If I had to do it again and I wanted to get into recording as a full time gig here is what I'd do. Learn as much as I could. Read Mix and alike. Hookup with a local studio that has GOOD reputation. Work for free cleaning, being a runner or whatever. Express your interest in your goal to be an engineer. DO THAT JOB EXTREMELY WELL. I think engineering is one field that if you really know your shit and have tallent a degree does not matter AT ALL. Maybe Im wrong but I dont think so. Work your way into an assistant position, then engineer then maybe head engineer. I have known many people that have done it that way Surfmaster right here in Rochester ,NY
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When you enter a school it is really easy to tell who is there to truly learn and who is just there to make a grade. Maybe if you had screened the interns you would have found one of the good ones. At the school I attend we learned how to mic a kit before we learned anything about protools.
 
...

Berklee College of Music 2002 graduate (MP&E)
University of Tulsa 2000 graduate (Performance)

I had a great experience at both schools, I now own my own studio and do freelance work in Nashville, mostly for EMI and it's many branches.

Without the school I wouldn't be doing as well as quickly, plus a ton of contacts were made. Meeting Massenberg and learning from him was my audio nerd highlight.
 
jmorris said:
I think engineering is one field that if you really know your shit and have tallent a degree does not matter AT ALL. Maybe Im wrong but I dont think so.
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100% correct. I'm going to school so I will know my shit upon entering an internship. I'm not expecting the school to give me job placement or the degree to mean anything to anyone. It's kind of like a trophy in that no one gives a shit, but it makes you feel a little bit better anyway. I think of schooling as kind of like an internship where you're paying someone to show you the ins and outs of everything. It's all experience in the end.

I like my school because they don't tell you what buttons to press to do something, just how that something works. So when we get into the studio during our time slot, we figure out how to use that particular piece of equipment based on our knowledge of how the function. This gives us practice in thinking on our feet with time restrictions. So when a potential employer says they've got a new board and asks if I can use it, I can confidently say yes knowing that I know how to use a variety of equipment and more importantly how the equipment functions, even though I have probably never touched the board in my life.
 
....

An artist may have talent and can paint amazing pictures, but a great art school can refine those talents and give understanding as to why the paint works the way it does, and why different brushes act differently.

A great mentor and professor can take you beyond art, they give you guidance to keep you from dead ends. Also an understanding of why you are what you are, and why you do what you do.

Not to say a great studio won't hire someone without training as an intern and be able to mold them, but I have used interns from Full Sail, the Conservatoy, and Berklee (all well checked out) as well as people with a love for the craft. In those experiences, the ones with degrees blew the socks of of the ones that have done a little recording here and there.

Good jobs come from knowledge, talent, and connections.
I obtained alot from school, including help for placement upon graduation if needed. I kept my ears open and obtained a job without it, a year later we opened our doors at my place. With the help of a great business plan and great investors, we are opening a retreat style studio in a year.

Schools help advance you career more quickly mostly because of the people you meet. Also alot of self taught guys can't tell you why a compressor works. Because of what I learned my job is easier because I understand things like that. I can track down problems more easily, because of that knowledge, and fix it. They don't teach you that in a studio, they just teach you how to track and mix.

All I can say is, whichever path you take, good luck.

Keep your ears open, ask ALOT of questions and work your tail off, it's worth it. I wouldn't work in another field.
 
Blue Groove, I understand your points and they are well taken. Maybe my town is different. Maybe other areas are more of a music town and have a better resource of people but here, some of the top engineers are self taught. Well, the few that we have. Most of the big studios closed or are closing. The same I think in many towns. The pool of interns is very unimpressive. I am presently looking for someone to assist on live gigs. Just someone that has a little knowlage ,help tote in the gear, help with mic setup, gaurd equipment, adjust a mic when needed and then at the end of the night help pack up. $125.00 cash for 6 hours work ,tops. Cant find anyone. In conversation with interns they all seemed to want the glory work without earning their place in the studio food chain. Im like, " no, you wont run an entire session yourself until you can prove to me you know what you are doing." In all aspects, from technical, people skills, being able to write a clear tracks sheet, track studio time and bill properly without the studio loosing. Knowing when to talk and offer an opion and when to be quite.
 
....

I agree with you jmorris, some of the best were self taught, I'm just stating that now with the availability of schools, it's a good idea, the studios shouldn't have to teach joe blow how to use a patch bay or gain structure, or that eqs can subtract sound, not just add. That way they can record more, screw around teaching less. Most of the guys I know that I graduated with, including myself, built walls, painted, got food, did wiring... just to sit in as a second or third on a session, a year later we got to sit in as a first on little nobody local sessions, after showing our mettle after hours on the "intern band" sessions.
 
I am presently looking for someone to assist on live gigs. Just someone that has a little knowlage ,help tote in the gear, help with mic setup, gaurd equipment, adjust a mic when needed and then at the end of the night help pack up. $125.00 cash for 6 hours work ,tops.
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fuck man

i wish i could find a job offer like that around here

=/
 
Ironklad...

Yeah, youd think people would jump at the chance for that cash. I really just want someone to help more or less gaurd the gear when Im busy. Its just me so when I load in, someone should be inside the club watching the gear after the first load. Plus its heavy! Shit the 150' splitter snake alone will break your back. When it is tear down time, it would be nice to have someone help and make sure all mics are accounted for, help hump the gear back to the truck. Not too demanding.
 
....

That is really odd that nobody is willing to work for that kind of cash.
Three years ago i would have killed for a simple gig like that.
 
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