Really thin guitar sounds.

[Lt. Bob]

Technically we are. This guy's heyday was almost 25 years ago.

oh God ........ I'm so fucking close to being dead!

Dammit!

 

[DrewPeterson7]

They do the rhythm stuff on the bridge pickup, but the leads are almost always done on the neck pickup. It gives them that little extra gain and smoosh to run the notes together a little better.

The Yngstyer's a strat player. If you own a SSS Strat and are soloing on anything OTHER than the neck pickup...


...you might be a redneck.

/Foxworthy.

 

[mattdee1]

The Yngstyer's a strat player. If you own a SSS Strat and are soloing on anything OTHER than the neck pickup...


...you might be a redneck.

/Foxworthy.

I play an SSS Strat, and for years and years I did solos exclusively on the neck pickup, on account of the smoother tone. But then, I changed my pickups, changed my pots to 250k, and changed my strings to a different type. Now, *gasp*, I've actually been finding a use for the bridge pickup because it no longer sounds like an ice-pick in the ear. I just wish I had done those mods sooner.

 

[DrewPeterson7]

I play an SSS Strat, and for years and years I did solos exclusively on the neck pickup, on account of the smoother tone. But then, I changed my pickups, changed my pots to 250k, and changed my strings to a different type. Now, *gasp*, I've actually been finding a use for the bridge pickup because it no longer sounds like an ice-pick in the ear. I just wish I had done those mods sooner.

I mean, I'm being needlessly reductionist here, and for blues stuff I'll occasionally use the middle or bridge - I'm a bit of a SRV fan, and he definitely got mileage out of all three.

But, at the same time, the neck pickup is really THE strat sound. Through a moderately driven amp, it's sex.

 

[GuitardedMark]

They do the rhythm stuff on the bridge pickup, but the leads are almost always done on the neck pickup. It gives them that little extra gain and smoosh to run the notes together a little better.

This is a ridiculous statement. This clearly shows how much you know about metal guitar playing. Neck pickup does not mean more gain and what is smoosh?!?!?! If anything with certain metal pickups, the bridge can give the effect of more gain but definitely not the other way around.

 

[GuitardedMark]

I think a lot of that depends on the type of music you play and the guitar sound you are after. I never really changed the amp from one gig to the next (except for volume), but I didn't use any effects and, for a metal band, I didn't really have that much distortion.

The venue doesn't change the amount of distortion you need

The only thing I would compensate for was the age of the tubes. When I put new tubes in, the amp sounded good with the presence at '5'. As time went on, I would have to turn the presence up to get the same sound. Once I had it all the way up, I knew it was time for new tubes.

Hmmmm.... Again a very curious post. I've changed the amount of distortion and the type depending on the gig. If I'm playing in a gig where I need to be louder I tend to pull the gain back. If its a quite gig I will push the gain a little more to compensate for the amp not breaking up as much. I also use effects differently. Why do you think there is a sound guy that sets up for each venue differently? If your a guitar player shouldn't you adjust to the room your playing in? The acoustics drastically change the sound of EVERYTHING. I'm contastantly amazed how much people minimize the room effect.

 

[Farview]

This is a ridiculous statement. This clearly shows how much you know about metal guitar playing. Neck pickup does not mean more gain and what is smoosh?!?!?! If anything with certain metal pickups, the bridge can give the effect of more gain but definitely not the other way around.

The darker sound you get from the neck pickup pushes the amp in a different way that gives a smoother respsonse. All things being equal, you get more output from the neck pickup because the strings are vibrating more there than close to the bridge (they are moving farther), which of course means more signal aka gain.

Let's see....I've worked with David Shankle, Kevin M buck, Micheal Angelo Batio, Vinnie Moore, Vinnie Vincent, etc... I guess I really don't know much about what these guys do or how they do it.

 

[Farview]

Hmmmm.... Again a very curious post. I've changed the amount of distortion and the type depending on the gig. If I'm playing in a gig where I need to be louder I tend to pull the gain back. If its a quite gig I will push the gain a little more to compensate for the amp not breaking up as much. I also use effects differently. Why do you think there is a sound guy that sets up for each venue differently? If your a guitar player shouldn't you adjust to the room your playing in? The acoustics drastically change the sound of EVERYTHING. I'm contastantly amazed how much people minimize the room effect.

Re-read the first line of my post. repeat as necessary until you fully understand what it is saying.

I think a lot of that depends on the type of music you play and the guitar sound you are after.

I was never in a band that used stage volume to push the sound. The room really doesn't have much of an effect on the sound that the 57 an inch off the speaker is getting. The FOH and monitor guys had to deal with how everything sounded in the room. Towards the end, my amp wasn't even on stage most of the time.

 

[GuitardedMark]

The darker sound you get from the neck pickup pushes the amp in a different way that gives a smoother respsonse. All things being equal, you get more output from the neck pickup because the strings are vibrating more there than close to the bridge (they are moving farther), which of course means more signal aka gain.

Let's see....I've worked with David Shankle, Kevin M buck, Micheal Angelo Batio, Vinnie Moore, Vinnie Vincent, etc... I guess I really don't know much about what these guys do or how they do it.

LOL!!! You call that metal?!?!?! sheesh! Michael Angelo Batio is a joke. Maybe I got confused but I thought we were talking about METAL guitarists. I've played a lot of guitar and understand the differences in sound between neck and bridge pickups but I've never noticed the neck having more gain. On paper your argument is solid. In application, I've never noticed it. I've noticed a dramatic tone and dynamic change, but not gain change.

 

[DrewPeterson7]

LOL!!! You call that metal?!?!?! sheesh! Michael Angelo Batio is a joke. Maybe I got confused but I thought we were talking about METAL guitarists. I've played a lot of guitar and understand the differences in sound between neck and bridge pickups but I've never noticed the neck having more gain. On paper your argument is solid. In application, I've never noticed it. I've noticed a dramatic tone and dynamic change, but not gain change.

Hey, metal means different things to different people, but I thought it was pretty clear from the very beginning that he was talking about shred players, many of whom DO spend a lot of time on the neck pickup while soloing.

Now, take a deep breath and relax.

 

[Farview]

LOL!!! You call that metal?!?!?! sheesh! Michael Angelo Batio is a joke. Maybe I got confused but I thought we were talking about METAL guitarists.

Again, if you would read more carefully...

I would stick my neck out and say that most Yngwie-type-whammy-tapmasters use the neck pickup for soloing. that's one of the ways they get the smoothness.

we could have avoided the entire misunderstanding.

I'm not sure exactly what you think of as metal, but I've been playing, recording, mixing, designing guitar rigs, etc... for the metal community for over 30 years, things have changed over that time. However, just about every guitar player that walks in here and does any sweep picking-type stuff does it on the neck pickup. I watch it happen every day.

I've played a lot of guitar and understand the differences in sound between neck and bridge pickups but I've never noticed the neck having more gain. On paper your argument is solid. In application, I've never noticed it. I've noticed a dramatic tone and dynamic change, but not gain change.

You're just not perceiving it as a gain change. But it is. It might not have the same effect for you depending on the gain structure of your amp and how far into it you are normally. If you have a generally fuzzy sound (instead of a crunchy sound) you might not notice. Even then, you should notice how single note parts have more smoothness and a more singing sustain with the neck pickup.

 

[GuitardedMark]

Re-read the first line of my post. repeat as necessary until you fully understand what it is saying.


I was never in a band that used stage volume to push the sound. The room really doesn't have much of an effect on the sound that the 57 an inch off the speaker is getting. The FOH and monitor guys had to deal with how everything sounded in the room. Towards the end, my amp wasn't even on stage most of the time.

I disagree very much that "The room really doesn't have much of an effect on the sound that the 57 an inch off the speaker is getting" The type of music being played has some affect yes, but it doesn't determine the affect of the room acoustics, the room does. I fully understand what the first line of your post said, I just don't agree. Hopefully we can agree to disagree.

A good quote I once heard; "people rarely believe someone has good sense unless they agree with them."

 

[GuitardedMark]

I'm not sure exactly what you think of as metal, but I've been playing, recording, mixing, designing guitar rigs, etc... for the metal community for over 30 years, things have changed over that time. However, just about every guitar player that walks in here and does any sweep picking-type stuff does it on the neck pickup. I watch it happen every day.

Maybe I'm a purist but I consider Ynvwie shred, not metal. Batio, wannabe shred+glam. Metal is such a broad genre it's hard to talk about specific ideas when generalizing with "metal".

 

[DrewPeterson7]

I disagree very much that "The room really doesn't have much of an effect on the sound that the 57 an inch off the speaker is getting" The type of music being played has some affect yes, but it doesn't determine the affect of the room acoustics, the room does. I fully understand what the first line of your post said, I just don't agree. Hopefully we can agree to disagree.

A good quote I once heard; "people rarely believe someone has good sense unless they agree with them."

Man, you're kind of coming off as needlessly argumentative, dude. And that's coming from me.

I think his point is, more or less, this - that the room, while it may have an impact on the overall sound, isn't really going to color the sound in the say quarter inch between the grill and the front of a SM57. Since he wasn't relying on stage volume to fill the room, he didn't have to worry much about how his amp would sound in the room, since no one would really be able to hear it. Instead, it'd be the engineer's problem, since most of the guitars would be coming through the mains. Any adjustments for the room could be done there.

Is this more or less correct?

 

[GuitardedMark]

Again, if you would read more carefully... we could have avoided the entire misunderstanding.

I'm not sure exactly what you think of as metal, but I've been playing, recording, mixing, designing guitar rigs, etc... for the metal community for over 30 years, things have changed over that time. However, just about every guitar player that walks in here and does any sweep picking-type stuff does it on the neck pickup. I watch it happen every day.

You're just not perceiving it as a gain change. But it is. It might not have the same effect for you depending on the gain structure of your amp and how far into it you are normally. If you have a generally fuzzy sound (instead of a crunchy sound) you might not notice. Even then, you should notice how single note parts have more smoothness and a more singing sustain with the neck pickup.

Man, you're kind of coming off as needlessly argumentative, dude. And that's coming from me.

I think his point is, more or less, this - that the room, while it may have an impact on the overall sound, isn't really going to color the sound in the say quarter inch between the grill and the front of a SM57. Since he wasn't relying on stage volume to fill the room, he didn't have to worry much about how his amp would sound in the room, since no one would really be able to hear it. Instead, it'd be the engineer's problem, since most of the guitars would be coming through the mains. Any adjustments for the room could be done there.

Is this more or less correct?

I appreciate the feedback. I want to know how I'm coming off, because if it's not accurate with how I think I'm coming off, it should be adjusted.

I really wasn't trying to argue and its very possible that I failed to consider the relativity of his statements. Needless to say, I stand behind my words (with the exception of the gain at the neck pickup, which I do think hes probably right on ) and I do think it's important to have multiple perspectives for people to read. I must admit I did get a little agressive because it seemed as though the "law" of recording was being preached and a lot of the things he said are a hard contradiction to things I've learned. I'd prefer not argue. I'd rather we both be able to give our opinions and give another perspective and agree to disagree.

Thank you though. I do appreciate the un-biased (hopefully) feedback.

 

[Farview]

Man, you're kind of coming off as needlessly argumentative, dude. And that's coming from me.

I think his point is, more or less, this - that the room, while it may have an impact on the overall sound, isn't really going to color the sound in the say quarter inch between the grill and the front of a SM57. Since he wasn't relying on stage volume to fill the room, he didn't have to worry much about how his amp would sound in the room, since no one would really be able to hear it. Instead, it'd be the engineer's problem, since most of the guitars would be coming through the mains. Any adjustments for the room could be done there.

Is this more or less correct?

That's exactly it.

 

[Farview]

Maybe I'm a purist but I consider Ynvwie shred, not metal. Batio, wannabe shred+glam. Metal is such a broad genre it's hard to talk about specific ideas when generalizing with "metal".

1. Find where I said that all metal leadwork is done on the neck pickup. I didn't. I was really specific, pointing only to 'Yngwie-type-whammy-tapmasters'.

2. Even shred and glam are just subgenre's of metal. Of course, before 10-15 years ago, there were only 4 or 5 subgenre's. Now, almost every band thinks they are doing something different enough to come up with their own genre.

Of course, I never said metal.

 

[GuitardedMark]

1. Find where I said that all metal leadwork is done on the neck pickup. I didn't. I was really specific, pointing only to 'Yngwie-type-whammy-tapmasters'.

2. Even shred and glam are just subgenre's of metal. Of course, before 10-15 years ago, there were only 4 or 5 subgenre's. Now, almost every band thinks they are doing something different enough to come up with their own genre.

Of course, I never said metal.

Right on. Well I just recieved my first negative feedback and boy was it a doozy I have a feeling I came off much more douche like than I intended. Needless to say I agree with everything above and I can accept that I mistook what you said and reacted rather immaturely. I deal with asshole mortgage brokers all day and I its been a taugh one today! Needless to say I dont want to piss people off and I should be more aware of my posts when I'm frustrated with sub-human brokers.

My apologies farview. I do see things a little differently but you also have some very valid points. I really wasnt pissed at you, its been a tough day and I shouldnt have vented toward you.

Sorry guys!

 

[RAMI]

Right on. Well I just recieved my first negative feedback and boy was it a doozy I have a feeling I came off much more douche like than I intended. Needless to say I agree with everything above and I can accept that I mistook what you said and reacted rather immaturely. I deal with asshole mortgage brokers all day and I its been a taugh one today! Needless to say I dont want to piss people off and I should be more aware of my posts when I'm frustrated with sub-human brokers.

My apologies farview. I do see things a little differently but you also have some very valid points. I really wasnt pissed at you, its been a tough day and I shouldnt have vented toward you.

Sorry guys!

Well, after that post, which is cool and rare to see on the internet, I'll come out and say that I was the one that gave the negative rep, which I've probably only done about 5 times since I've been here (and 4 of those were probably to Jordan)

So, I apologize for jumping the gun and should have let Farview answer for himself.

I'll make it up to you with some positive rep once the system allows me to do so.

 

[WhiteStrat]

Well, after that post, which is cool and rare to see on the internet, I'll come out and say that I was the one that gave the negative rep, which I've probably only done about 5 times since I've been here (and 4 of those were probably to Jordan)

So, I apologize for jumping the gun and should have let Farview answer for himself.

I'll make it up to you with some positive rep once the system allows me to do so.

I agree. That was a cool resolution--so I got him for ya.