Real Amps vs J-station, POD etc...

[64Firebird]

I love the sound of my amp, but I also love the sound of my J-Station. I don't think one sounds any better than the other. The J is a lot easier to use for recording and the amp is way ahead for playing live, so that's the way I use them.

Whenever new technolgy comes along some people talk about how much better it was before while others grab onto it and run. I see the POD, and others, as just another tool to make a sound. Somebody always comes along and exploits the things that others call weaknesses and does something great with it.

I'm sure that when people first started to make eletric guitars there were others that didn't like the way they sounded. Afterall, A telecaster doesn't sound anything like an accoustic guitar. But, I can't think of where music would be today without Les Paul and Leo Fender. Can you?

So what if my J-Station doesn't sound like a "real" amp to some ears. That isn't the point. The point is, does it sound good?

 

[JR#97]

One of the things I don't think a lot of people realize is that most modelers and emulators try and model/emulate RECORDED tube amps. Do recorded tube amps rumble your chest and make your arm hair stand-up? no... so that's why I don't get to up in arms when my Sansamp gear doesn't sound/feel just like my Marshall or Mesa. Whatever works, go for it... personally, I use my Sansamp stuff for recording more than mic'ing up my amps. Mostly because I'm too lazy to fiddle around to find the sweet spot plus adjust eq on the amp and at the board, etc... but also because of volume issues, tube amp inconsistencies, and the fact that I can always count on my Sansamp stuff to get me the tone I want quickly and accurately. Giggins is a different story. I prefer to use my Marshall, Roland, and Mesa because they just sound so good live. The Sansamp does to, but it's also about having the toys and showing them off!

 

[Track Rat]

I'm not an amp snob. If it sounds good and fits what you're trying to do, then that's what I use. If it doesn't, I keep looking, be it a POD, a Marshall, a Rockman or whatever.

 

[bongolation]

The advantage of using a modeler for recording is that they will save man-months in production time. They may not be 100% as good as amps, but they make up for it in flexibility and speed, speed, speed.

 

[Cyrokk]

I record about 2 to 4 rhythm guitar tracks per song. Usually I'll start by hooking the modeler up to the clean tone on my amp, mic the amp, and play a sample of the song I'm recording through each preset (with no fx except distortion) until I find the sound which will best express the feel of the song. I do the same with just the modeler into the preamp, and at the end of this laborious process I'll usually have half the tracks mic'd and half through the modeler.. Unfortunately, it takes me a couple months to sort through all the presets for just one track, but I far surpass anything I could've done with just a Strat, Epiphone, and a Crate amp.

Not only do I get great results, but it's also been a great learning process. What better way to learn what, say, a Mesa Boogie Rectifier sounds against a Marshall Stack? As well as what combinations of distortion sound best, like a classic fuzz tone against a Rectifier for sludge with attack. And this weekend, I learned that two Rectifier sounds combined gets that wacked, flaky, overdone distortion that I've never liked. Now I know what to avoid.

I don't have any cash to blow on the "real thing", and when I've finished the guitar tracks, I can't tell any difference. Hell, as far as I'm concerned, anyone who spends time trying to pick apart the modeled sounds in my recordings isn't someone I'd want listening to my music anyway.

Cy

 

[Speeddemon]

I'm with you guys. Whenever I mic my little Roland 405 40W amp, it sounds kinda honky/nasal, but going into my Korg directly from the Genesis 3 sounds FAT and GREAT! directly. instant gratification.
If I had a 30' x 15' treated room, a Royer R121 and a Sennheiser MD421 lying around, and say a JCM800 2205, VOX AC30, Fender '71 Twin Reverb, Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier, Roland JC-120, Mesa Mark IV and IIC+ and my soon to REALLY acquire Engl Savage Special standing ready, it would be a different story. But it would also mean a monthly insurance fee that would cost more than the Genesis 3.... Get the idea?

It's all about 1 thing.
convenience. It's homerecording for christ's sake, no one here has those 7 mentioned amps ready in a WELL SOUNDING room, and besides, when converting your songs to mp3's, a lot of your so-called tube feel gets lost anyway...

I'm just saying that
a)it's HELLA CHEAPER
b)it's HELLA EASIER
c)it's HELLA nice to play 'cranked' at 2am in your attic studio
d)Joe Schmoe ain't gonna hear the difference.

If I HAD the means, I'd mic a GOOD amp in a GOOD room with a GOOD mic, through a GOOD pre-amp and a GOOD compressor.
But I'd like to drink some beer and have some food for the next 10 years...

 

[Lopp]

Mesa Mark IV and IIC+

I don't care what anyone says about you. You sometimes hint that you do have good taste.

And yeah. I ain't against modelers/emulators either. If it does the job in the mix, it is a good thing.

I only prefer to play though my Boogie Quad on the Mark IIC+ setting.

 

[64Firebird]

Everybody agrees with me!?! That's no fun. Where's all those guys that hate modelers? C'mon, here's your chance to make your point.

 

[Lopp]

I think the point of the "modeler haters" is that modelers cannot replace a good amp. I.e., a modeled Marshall is NOT a Marshall. It doesn't sound or react the same way.

I personally don't like the modelers I've tried. However, I love the Tech21 SansAmp. It comes the closest to acting like a real amp. The modelers always seem to fall short when I demo 'em.

That doesn't change the fact that if a modeler works for your song, it works.

 

[Badger]

Well, in my opinion, a pod or a jstation doesnt sound like a real amp when you are just listening to it in the room. Recorded, I cant tell the differance. It sounds enough like a real amp live, that if i was a gtr player, thats what I would gig with because of the ease of setup. I love my hammond, but if I had a choice of playing a bar gig on a Roland VK or my C3, I would go with the roland.

 

[guhlenn]

i play different through a tube amp then through a modeller... IT's kinda awkward to me when the sound is that flat comin through monitors... my brain gets confused...

bigger point i think is that people always shout that they don't have money for the twenty amps... that's not the point.. you don't get the twenty amps with just one modeller...

the modeller should have a more unique sound imo, since modelling a marshall is not a marshall... it's the modelled version..

I think the power of new equipment is that it should not try to resemble the old, but rather invest in it's own personality... like you said; the telecaster sounded NOTHING like an acoustic... and that's why people liked it right?... if the moddellers where to choose a totally different direction i would definately have one (in the gothic-industrial and noise scene people have the most bizarre distortion sounds... kinda like that ya know?)

Use whatever ya like, i don't care... but it's not the same now is it?

Guhlenn

 

[Speeddemon]

I think the power of new equipment is that it should not try to resemble the old, but rather invest in it's own personality... like you said; the telecaster sounded NOTHING like an acoustic... and that's why people liked it right?... if the moddellers where to choose a totally different direction i would definately have one (in the gothic-industrial and noise scene people have the most bizarre distortion sounds... kinda like that ya know?)

Guhlenn

That's why the Genesis 3 scores points over the POD and others: it has the Warp function where you can morph to different amp-models together to a 'hypermodel' and if you want, you can morph this new 'hypermodel' with another ampmodel and so forth. It's pretty cool to morph a Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier with a Marshall '78 Master Volume to create the ultimate metalsound: ballsy, fat, screamin' and roarin'!
And ofcourse you can morph a fuzz with a fuzz with a fuzz to get some wicked distortion....

 

[guhlenn]

hmmm... i heard about this gewnesis thing before...

so what does it cost?

Guhlenn

 

[smilestoned]

The morphing thing sounds really cool.

Me myself have a pod and to be honest I am that lazy that I only use sounds which I downloaded from others and there are so many really good, no, fucking great sounds that I would not even think about tweaking. I must have over 500.

But I think there is nothing better than a real amp when you know how to mic it.

 

[Lopp]

Dammit Speed, you're giving me an urge to get a Genesis 3.

 

[flapo1]

How about using these kind of units as a preamp/effects unit for use in a solid state amp?

Would it sound good?

 

[JR#97]

How about using these kind of units as a preamp/effects unit for use in a solid state amp?

Would it sound good?

I use my sansamp gear with my Roland JC120 all the time. Pretty damn good... I can sound like a Marshall/Fender/Mesa, but at loud volumes, it just doesn't "feel" like a tube amp... like anyone in the audience can tell. I get compliments on my tone all the time when I run the Sansamp stuff. The Roland JC series are probably the cleanest amps on the planet! And durable! I've had mine since 1986 and it's still kicking ass. I've cleaned the pots twice, dropped it down the stairs, spilled beer on it... it still looks good even!

 

[powderfinger]

i read something about how weezer did a small tour when they only used PODs instead of amps. this is when they were just coming back from their hiatus and did some tour where they toured bowling alleys and places like that for kind of a small gig joke type tour to get back into the swing of things. they apparently used PODs into the PA because of the ease to set everything up.

 

[Badger]

i read something about how weezer did a small tour when they only used PODs instead of amps. this is when they were just coming back from their hiatus and did some tour where they toured bowling alleys and places like that for kind of a small gig joke type tour to get back into the swing of things. they apparently used PODs into the PA because of the ease to set everything up.

I think the day will come when eletronic drums and amp modelers will be the norm, people might trot out an actual amp tust for novelty

 

[64Firebird]

I think the day will come when eletronic drums and amp modelers will be the norm, people might trot out an actual amp tust for novelty

I think you're right Bdgr. Amp mods could make everything easier.