Question....please help.

[g string]

Okay here is my situation,

I have a humble home studio in a spare bedroom, right now I use AT20XX series and SM57 mic's to record my vocals and guitars thru a firebox. I have thought about upgrading to some better quality mic's...but my question is, if I upgraded my mic's, would I actually benefit from them even if I didn't have and acoustically treated room? I realize that sound treating the room is important, but it's not really an option for me right now. And I would hate to spend ??? on mic's if it's not going to better my sound.

 

[bubbagump]

Sound treatment is silly cheap. For less than $100 in insulation and burlap you can treat a small room fairly reasonably. Check out Ethan Winer's site for some great DIY tips. http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html I guess what I am saying is treat your room if it sounds bad as any mic you get will have the room to deal with.

 

[Chris Shaeffer]

Well, the 57 is no slouch. With careful placement you should be able to get a useable sound out of it. I'm not familiar with the AT20xx's, but being bottom tier mics for their class I'd assume a better mic will give you more options.

I've used similar mics in horrible rooms and gotten decent results- its all in knowing how the instrument and the room interact, knowing how the mics work best for what you want to get, then putting the instrument and the mics in the right place to get the best sound. Use whatever you have (furniture, blankets, pillows, futons, etc) to control the room as best you can until you know get some idea what kind of treatment the room really needs. Its easy to solve one problem and create 3 more with room treatment...

It might not always be a *great* sound, but learning how to get the *best* with the situation you have is a really powerful process. Once you know what your firebox, mics and rooms are capable of, and not capable of, you'll have more fuel to research what your next step will be. If you just CAN'T get the annoying room tone out of the AT then a *better* LDC is probably not going to help as much as some room treatment, for example.

Have you read the big thread that's a sticky at the top of the mic forum, by the way? Priceless read- worth every moment spent.

Take care,
Chris

 

[Robert D]

Serious room treatment is more important to mixing than it is to tracking, at least at the home studio level. As long as you knock down the flutter echos by having a mix of absorption and difusion in the room, and there isn't an ambient noise issue, then you should be fine. The hand clap test is usually pretty telling, just clap your hands together loudly and listen to the room response. Flutter echos are usually pretty apparent with this test, and can be eliminated by making sure there are no parallel smooth reflective surfaces to bounce back and forth between. Wall tapestries, bookshelves, coatracks, carpet, practically anything you put in the room will help, including of course some auralex here and there. If you get the room sounding decent, close micing with quality condensors should be no problem. Just avoid omni mics unless you really like the sound of the room.

 

[bubbagump]

RobertD is certanly correct, but my point is, if the room sounds like poo, why bother recording in it as you'll just have a nice mic recording a poo sounding room. The room is very much the part of the sound. It is like buying a Neumann to record a saxophone missing half of its pads and using a tounge depressor as a reed. So either change rooms or treat the room you have then... worry about a mic. There is no need to screw with serious bass trapping. Sometimes hanging up a few quilts is all you need. Ipointed you to Ethan's site more to get an idea of the theory behind how a room works with sound. I hope you haven't run to Home Depot and started demolition on your room.

Assuming that is taken care of, yup, cardiod mics will be your friend. You have a reasonable selection of mics as Chris Shaeffer points out... so I would really look to your room and mic placement as your first orders of business.

 

[g string]

Thanks for the replies, I guess I will look into some sound treatment. Makes sense, since it is cheaper than buying a mic.

 

[chessrock]

if I upgraded my mic's, would I actually benefit from them even if I didn't have and acoustically treated room?

Probably not.

.

 

[gordone]

If your room is not acoustically treated and sounds bad, better equipment (accurate condenser mics/sensitive pres, etc...) will probably make your recordings sound worse!
Seriously!

My first home "studio" was in an untreated basement of a rental townhouse. Linoleum floors, low ceilings, bare drywall. Plugging my Soundelux or Neumann into a Great River MP2 sounded AWFUL! Why? Because all that great equipment gave me an extremely detailed recording of all the slapback echo that my lovely basement room provided.

I was better off with a SM58 (although still going into the Great River )

I soon put up some Auralex foam, and it sounded much better (ie close to "dead" !)

Just some food for though...

 

[soundchaser59]

I made 2' x 6' panels, 6 inches deep, pine frame, free standing on "feet" made of 18" 2x4's, filled with R19 fiberglass, covered with fabric, and with 1/2 inch thick sound board mounted on 3 inch standoffs on the back of each panel, sound board faces the wall, each panel about a foot or so away from the wall...... for $25 per panel. Now my room sounds flat compared to what it was without any treatment.

Everybody is right, better mics will give you more honest recordings of your room......which means worse mixes if you dont treat the room.

 

[gcapel]

sound treatment is cheap. I used six 6'x8' outdoor rugs for 15 bucks each from lowes. I also used 1" pvc sticks (10' @ 3.00 each) to use as curtain rods. I bought regular curtain supports which were 6 dollars for a pair and used 5 pairs. I bought it all at lowes. I covered a room 10'x11'. The new rugs smelled like crap for a while, but it works very well. I can record a drum kit now. It was impossible before using condensers in that room

 

[g string]

Thanks for all the good info.