Quest for Tasty Tube Tone (geetahr)

[punkin]

Ok...I'm hooked up to the point of over-kill with my big shout amp rigs. I've got a Peavey JSX head and a newish Mesa Dual Rectifier. I have a single 4x10 speaker cabinet. Lately I've been wanting for a less metal sound...I'm looking for something a little tastier. Something that will put out a smooth squeaky tubey sound without having to get into heavy distortion...that's the best I can desribe what I'm wanting to accomplish. The sound I'm looking for is found all throughout the "Four Non-Blondes" album. Anyone familiar with this sound? Any thoughts on the combo of gear needed to smooth it up?

Thanks

 

[Hi_Flyer]

I dunno about that Peavey, but those Dual Rectifiers are supposed to be able to do everything from nu metal crunch to Fender clean, and everything in between... I don't know exactly what the guitar tone on that 4 non blondes album sounds like, but I think I have an idea what you're looking for... Is it like a kinda dirty sound? Not exactly distorted but not exaclty clean? If thats what you're looking for, I think the key to that dirty clean tone is less preamp gain and more power tube saturation, so you need to dial in a tone with less gain and just crank the amp volume. The best way to get it is from a cranked low wattage tube amp. Or get a Power Soak or some kind of attentuator... Some of those high gain monsters don't sound so good with the gain backed off though, check out some smaller Fender tube combos and see if thats what you're looking for.

 

[travelin travis]

Ok...I'm hooked up to the point of over-kill with my big shout amp rigs. I've got a Peavey JSX head and a newish Mesa Dual Rectifier. I have a single 4x10 speaker cabinet. Lately I've been wanting for a less metal sound...I'm looking for something a little tastier. Something that will put out a smooth squeaky tubey sound without having to get into heavy distortion...that's the best I can desribe what I'm wanting to accomplish. The sound I'm looking for is found all throughout the "Four Non-Blondes" album. Anyone familiar with this sound? Any thoughts on the combo of gear needed to smooth it up?

Thanks

I'm not real familiar Four Non-Blondes guitar sound but from your description, I hear the Black Crowes guitar sound.

 

[travelin travis]

I just listend to "what's goin on". I got a pretty similar sound out of a Line6 Duoverb amp that i owned using the Marshall Plexi models. I would'nt reccomend a Line6 but this might help you in narrowing down that sound.

I owned a dual rec a long time ago and from what i remember it had 3 modes. One was high gain, which i called the red channel, one was an overdrive, which i called the orange channel, and the other was clean, which i called the grean channel. Have you played around with the orange channel?

Also, as I remember, playing around with the effects loop knobs gave the amp a bit of a different sound, even with nothing in the effects loop. You might wanna give it a try.

 

[famous beagle]

I'm not real familiar Four Non-Blondes guitar sound but from your description, I hear the Black Crowes guitar sound.

Ooooohhhhhhhh. Rich Robinson's tone makes me drool. It's so beautiful.

 

[punkin]

Wow...some fast replies...thanks.

The Mesa starts to achieve what I'm wanting but not until it's at an ear splitting, skull rattling volume level and this does seem to happen at a point where final tube saturation lives but at a fairly clean setting. (the orange channel). I wonder if the amp could be biased to favor this saturation setting a little more easily?

These death amps have been parked for awhile simply because of their over-kill. I'm in the market for a slightly more "reasonable" combo amp. I rarely play outside of the studio any more. If I could find something that fits my "tasty" description, I would be a happy camper. Been doing all my practicing lately through an amp modeller and/or my little zVex just so I can work at less painful levels.

The sound is a more cleanish sound very little grit I guess some might call "creamy" sounding but harmonics are something that I'm hearing. It sounds almost like a clean amp running really hard.

Thanks again!

 

[scrubs]

http://www.zzounds.com/a--2676837/item--FEN0217300000

 

[punkin]

looks like the link is down...

 

[travelin travis]

Wow...some fast replies...thanks.

The Mesa starts to achieve what I'm wanting but not until it's at an ear splitting, skull rattling volume level and this does seem to happen at a point where final tube saturation lives but at a fairly clean setting. (the orange channel). I wonder if the amp could be biased to favor this saturation setting a little more easily?

These death amps have been parked for awhile simply because of their over-kill. I'm in the market for a slightly more "reasonable" combo amp. I rarely play outside of the studio any more. If I could find something that fits my "tasty" description, I would be a happy camper. Been doing all my practicing lately through an amp modeller and/or my little zVex just so I can work at less painful levels.

The sound is a more cleanish sound very little grit I guess some might call "creamy" sounding but harmonics are something that I'm hearing. It sounds almost like a clean amp running really hard.

Thanks again!

Man you just described what every tube droolin guitar player eventually wants: "It sounds almost like a clean amp running really hard."

The power tube saturation sound is awesome. I think you will need to look at a lower wattage amp to get that sound. I know what you mean about the Dual Rec. It can sound real nice but damn me if it ain't fuckin loud! I'd look at something with 50 watts max. Probably more like 30 watts.

Try to find some sound samples of a Fender tweed. That is one hell of a beautiful tone. Personally, a Fender Twin ain't my thing at all.

 

[travelin travis]

Ooooohhhhhhhh. Rich Robinson's tone makes me drool. It's so beautiful.

You ain't lyin! Man, that is "the" sound. I saw them early this summer and they were still rockin harder than ever. That's one band that will never fade away in my mind.

What does he play thru, amp wise?

 

[travelin travis]

I think I know the amp I want but I can't afford it, a Fender VibroKing.

 

[punkin]

Man you just described what every tube droolin guitar player eventually wants: "It sounds almost like a clean amp running really hard."

The power tube saturation sound is awesome. I think you will need to look at a lower wattage amp to get that sound. I know what you mean about the Dual Rec. It can sound real nice but damn me if it ain't fuckin loud! I'd look at something with 50 watts max. Probably more like 30 watts.

Try to find some sound samples of a Fender tweed. That is one hell of a beautiful tone. Personally, a Fender Twin ain't my thing at all.

Exactly...clean but not and has a squeaky harmonic sound. I'll run with your recommendation and look into the "Tweed". I wonder if the rectifier power supply is critical to getting this sound? I understand how the power supply "sags" a bit when the PA is driven hard I just wonder if this drop in supply to the PA plays a part in this effect.

 

[travelin travis]

Exactly...clean but not and has a squeaky harmonic sound. I'll run with your recommendation and look into the "Tweed". I wonder if the rectifier power supply is critical to getting this sound? I understand how the power supply "sags" a bit when the PA is driven hard I just wonder if this drop in supply to the PA plays a part in this effect.

also, if you get the chance check out a 50 watt Marshall Plexi. Even check out some of the modeling amps to get an idea of what type of amp you might be looking for. If you check out any modeling amps, check out Fender tweed sounds and Marshall Plexi sounds. Some of the modeling amps come close but there's nothing like a tube amp.

 

[hiwatt357]

You ain't lyin! Man, that is "the" sound. I saw them early this summer and they were still rockin harder than ever. That's one band that will never fade away in my mind.

What does he play thru, amp wise?

Isn't he playing Harry Joyce amps currently?

 

[travelin travis]

Isn't he playing Harry Joyce amps currently?

I have no idea what he plays thru.

 

[hiwatt357]

I have no idea what he plays thru.

From an article in Guitar One from June, 2004: AXES '54 Fender Esquire, '65 Gibson ES-335, '53 Martin D-28, Guild 12-string, James Trussart, Zitlau electric, Zemaitis electric AMPS '50s Fender Vibrolux, Deluxe blonde Tremolux; Harry Joyce heads and cabs; Wizard heads.

And from http://www.richrobinson.net/gear.php:

1954 FENDER ESQUIRE
1964 GIBSON ES-335
BLONDE TELECASTER
BLACK CUSTOM SHOP TELE DELUXE
BUTTERSCOTCH CUSTOMSHOP TELE WITH B-BENDER
YELLOW CUSTOMSHOP NOCASTER WITH B and G-BENDERS
EARLY 60'S DAN ARMSTRONG WITH TOM HOLMES PICK UP
GIBSON CUSTOMSHOP FLAME TOP (TOM MURPHY)
ZEMATIS CUSTOM GUITAR
ZITLAU ELECTRIC
1929 NATIONAL DUOLIAN
1968 GIBSON GOLDTOP LES PAUL
JAMES TRUSSART (CUSTOM) 2X
JAMES TRUSSART LES PAUL
JAMES TRUSSART TELE
GRETSCH SEMI-HOLLOW
GUILD 12-STRING
1954 MARTIN D-28
1963 MARTIN D-18
HERITAGE MARTIN OMV 28
1970 MARTIN D-21
1964 MARTIN D-28
GIBSON DOVE
DAN ELECTRO BARITONE GUITAR
CUSTOM SHOP P-BASS
TELE BASS
RICKENBACKER BASS
BURNS BISON BASS
KAY UPRIGHT BASS
SITAR
1944 CHARLIE CHRISTIAN LAP STEEL
1944 CHARLIE CHRISTIAN SEMI ACOUSTIC
FENDER SHOWBUD PEDAL STEEL
BARITONE DULCIMER
STANDARD DULCIMER

AMPS
MID 50'S TWEED FENDER DELUXE 2X
MID 50'S TWEED FENDER TREMOLUX 2X
MID 50'S TWEED FENDER VIBROLUX
MID 50'S TWEED FENDER PRO
MID 50'S TWEED BASSMAN
60'S BLACK FACE SHOWMAN AMP
MATCHLESS CLUBMAN COMBO 3X
60'S GRETSCH COMBO
MATCHLESS CHIEFTAN 120W HEADS 2X
1971 MARSHALL 50W
HARRYJOYCE 50 WATT HEAD 3X
HARRY JOYCE 100 WATT HEAD
HARRY JOYCE CABINET
WIZARD CUSTOM RICH ROBINSON HEADS 2X
BLONDE FACED FENDER TREMOLUX
ORANGE HEAD 2X
AGUILAR PRE AMP
400 WATT MESA-BOOGIE
AGUILAR 1 15 CABINET
EPIFANI 2 12 CABINET
SVT CABINET

I thought I had read something in the HIWATT forum about his using Harry Joyce amps, but I didn't have time to look anything up until just now.

As far as the thread originator's question...

I was going to recommend a 50 watt amp (or thereabouts) as well, but there are a lot of choices out there. Fender Super Reverb, Fender Bassman, Peavey Classic 50, or even a HIWATT Bulldog 50 (if you can find one).

 

[Outlaws]

It sounds like you would like the Fender ProJunior maybe. You can unhook the speake and plug into your cab with it. That would still be loud enough then to jam with quiet enough to crank.

 

[punkin]

Thanks to all. Anyone have any info on Roger Rocha's setup? I've been googling but don't find much.

 

[travelin travis]

From an article in Guitar One from June, 2004: AXES '54 Fender Esquire, '65 Gibson ES-335, '53 Martin D-28, Guild 12-string, James Trussart, Zitlau electric, Zemaitis electric AMPS '50s Fender Vibrolux, Deluxe blonde Tremolux; Harry Joyce heads and cabs; Wizard heads.

And from http://www.richrobinson.net/gear.php:

1954 FENDER ESQUIRE
1964 GIBSON ES-335
BLONDE TELECASTER
BLACK CUSTOM SHOP TELE DELUXE
BUTTERSCOTCH CUSTOMSHOP TELE WITH B-BENDER
YELLOW CUSTOMSHOP NOCASTER WITH B and G-BENDERS
EARLY 60'S DAN ARMSTRONG WITH TOM HOLMES PICK UP
GIBSON CUSTOMSHOP FLAME TOP (TOM MURPHY)
ZEMATIS CUSTOM GUITAR
ZITLAU ELECTRIC
1929 NATIONAL DUOLIAN
1968 GIBSON GOLDTOP LES PAUL
JAMES TRUSSART (CUSTOM) 2X
JAMES TRUSSART LES PAUL
JAMES TRUSSART TELE
GRETSCH SEMI-HOLLOW
GUILD 12-STRING
1954 MARTIN D-28
1963 MARTIN D-18
HERITAGE MARTIN OMV 28
1970 MARTIN D-21
1964 MARTIN D-28
GIBSON DOVE
DAN ELECTRO BARITONE GUITAR
CUSTOM SHOP P-BASS
TELE BASS
RICKENBACKER BASS
BURNS BISON BASS
KAY UPRIGHT BASS
SITAR
1944 CHARLIE CHRISTIAN LAP STEEL
1944 CHARLIE CHRISTIAN SEMI ACOUSTIC
FENDER SHOWBUD PEDAL STEEL
BARITONE DULCIMER
STANDARD DULCIMER

AMPS
MID 50'S TWEED FENDER DELUXE 2X
MID 50'S TWEED FENDER TREMOLUX 2X
MID 50'S TWEED FENDER VIBROLUX
MID 50'S TWEED FENDER PRO
MID 50'S TWEED BASSMAN
60'S BLACK FACE SHOWMAN AMP
MATCHLESS CLUBMAN COMBO 3X
60'S GRETSCH COMBO
MATCHLESS CHIEFTAN 120W HEADS 2X
1971 MARSHALL 50W
HARRYJOYCE 50 WATT HEAD 3X
HARRY JOYCE 100 WATT HEAD
HARRY JOYCE CABINET
WIZARD CUSTOM RICH ROBINSON HEADS 2X
BLONDE FACED FENDER TREMOLUX
ORANGE HEAD 2X
AGUILAR PRE AMP
400 WATT MESA-BOOGIE
AGUILAR 1 15 CABINET
EPIFANI 2 12 CABINET
SVT CABINET

I thought I had read something in the HIWATT forum about his using Harry Joyce amps, but I didn't have time to look anything up until just now.

As far as the thread originator's question...

I was going to recommend a 50 watt amp (or thereabouts) as well, but there are a lot of choices out there. Fender Super Reverb, Fender Bassman, Peavey Classic 50, or even a HIWATT Bulldog 50 (if you can find one).

man he has some kick ass amps. i'd give up a nut, maybe both for those amps.

 

[hiwatt357]

man he has some kick ass amps. i'd give up a nut, maybe both for those amps.

Yeah, I reckon "Shake Your Money Maker" sold enough copies to where he can afford such. Heh.