Public service shout out

[famous beagle]

I 100% agree. I would much rather have 5 amps that do one thing incredibly well, than one amp that does a few things okay.

But you've got that wrong though! It's the $1500 and $2000 amps like Marshall, Fender, Orange, Vox, etc. that usually do one thing really well, and the $300 and $400 amps like Crate, Line 6, etc. that do lots of things but not very well.

It seems that the less expensive amps try to make up for their lack of great tone (or at least what most people would consider great tone) with more "features."

Regardless, I think what the original poster is trying to get at is the adage, "Buy cheap, buy twice." And I certainly agree with that.

 

[cusebassman]

But you've got that wrong though! It's the $1500 and $2000 amps like Marshall, Fender, Orange, Vox, etc. that usually do one thing really well, and the $300 and $400 amps like Crate, Line 6, etc. that do lots of things but not very well.

It seems that the less expensive amps try to make up for their lack of great tone (or at least what most people would consider great tone) with more "features."

Regardless, I think what the original poster is trying to get at is the adage, "Buy cheap, buy twice." And I certainly agree with that.

I was ranting on this topic and tossed what I had to say, but this sums it up for the most part

I'm in the same boat as most, and understand that not everyone can afford the money or space needed for lots of top quality amps, but I am not one of the ones suffering from sour grapes syndrome, justifying the fact that I can't afford all those nice toys by saying that they aren't really that good anyway.

A lot of expensive amps sound great in the context they were designed for, and often don't work well outside their expected range. You can also find ones that are very versatile. You can also find cheaper amps that fall under these two categories, but it isn't as frequent... I'd say there are a lot more mediocre (or worse) sounding amps in the cheap zone than there are, on average, in the more expensive realm, however you define the monetary limits.

Same goes for recording gear, and most other things... an AT4040 through a DMP-3 sounds nice, and is more than adequate for most home studios, and is good for many applications. On the other hand, a nice Neumann through an Avalon or Neve pre of some sort is likely going to have something the previous setup does not, but it may only be best suited for vocalists, not everything you need to record.

 

[Zaphod B]

Sorry to confuse - I was making fun of Eric Clapton, from the standpoint that any amp HE owns or has played through doesn't stand a chance of sounding good from the outset.

Point taken.

 

[ggunn]

I've got a 1964 blackface Deluxe Reverb (not a reissue), and I love the way my old Strat sounds through it. Yes, it was kind of expensive, but I've played through many, many amps and none of them do it for me the way that this one does. It's OK, I could afford to buy it without putting a second mortgage on my house or selling my kid into slavery.

My point is that tone is a very subjective thing and there are lots of ways to approach it. Yes, there are players who are high end snobs, but there is also a sort of reverse snobbery from the other side that is just as bad. We don't need any of it. Find what works for you and go with it. If you can get the sound you want from a $10 amp you found in a pawn shop, then great. If you feel like you need something else that happens to be more expensive and you can afford it, well then, that's great, too.

 

[cusebassman]

Yes, there are players who are high end snobs, but there is also a sort of reverse snobbery from the other side that is just as bad. We don't need any of it.

But without snobbery, some of us might have to realize and accept that we aren't the best players to ever walk the Earth

 

[lpdeluxe]

I'm no snob, but I appreciate good gear; at the same time, for what I play, the gear I use does the job (not that Fenders and Gibson and Music Man are shabby).

So many musicians are caught up in the "I gotta sound just like _______" that they never get the point of music, which is to express yourself through instruments and voice.

I like different amps and instruments (I play a Dobro, a '30s Regal, several fretted and fretless basses, acoustic guitar, harmonica and electric guitar) because I enjoy trying to exploit the sonic features of each combination without thinking "wish this sounded like Eric Clapton/James Taylor/Hubert Sumlin" (and on and on and on).

I've been an artist all my life, and it's always amazed me the way a guitarist who plays the solo off a record is hailed as a guitar hero. C'mon, guys,that's not ART, that's IMITATION. When you're starting out, imitation is how you learn...but that doesn't mean you have to make a lifetime career of it.

So you don't have to have the "perfect" amp because it's only gonna be "perfect" for one thing. I don't use my pallet knife to letter a poster with, and I don't use the lettering brush to paint a landscape in oil.

 

[Gear_Junky]

and sometimes you NEED features.

 

[ggunn]

I'm no snob, but I appreciate good gear; at the same time, for what I play, the gear I use does the job (not that Fenders and Gibson and Music Man are shabby).

You (not specifically you, but the general "you") are not a snob until you look down your nose at folks who have made different choices than you and declare them to be wrong or in some way inferior because of those choices. High end (priced) gear or "lower" tier stuff, it makes no difference.

 

[cusebassman]

You (not specifically you, but the general "you") are not a snob until you look down your nose at folks who have made different choices than you and declare them to be wrong or in some way inferior because of those choices. High end (priced) gear or "lower" tier stuff, it makes no difference.

As has been mentioned above, you can also be a snob from either side - looking down on those whose gear isn't as good as yours, but also looking down on people FOR using high end stuff, and not staying "true" to the poor side of musicianship, which for some reason is "cooler".

 

[lpdeluxe]

You (not specifically you, but the general "you") are not a snob until you look down your nose at folks who have made different choices than you and declare them to be wrong or in some way inferior because of those choices. High end (priced) gear or "lower" tier stuff, it makes no difference.

As the saying goes, it's not the arrow, it's the Indian.

I just came from a completely different background from a lot guys who play guitar, and I'm pointing out the salient issue. It's so striking that every few years I mention it.

If you learned to write War And Peace perfectly, word for word, you'd be a plagiarist; if you painted Van Gogh's Sunflowers, brush stroke for brush stroke, that wouldn't make you an artist.

The bar is set so low for guitarists that for a lot of people, slavish imitation is the highest form they can imagine (I remember a guy showing up for a jam who could play the intro -- I think it was -- to Barracuda note-for-note but couldn't find an A major chord if you held a gun on him).

Gear is a tool for expression; your expression may be playing blues shuffles in E for the rest of your life (and we could probably name two or three who have successfully done so) or you just might be the next Jaco. Either way, it's not the gear that will make you one or the other or anything in between.

I know this is a contentious issue, but there it is. As usual, my opinion is worth a virtual $.02.

 

[acidrock]

In the end it boils down to priorities.I think most members of the board would have the means if they set their minds to it.Music is a big part of our lives but not the only part.Taking into consideration that decent gear can be had cheaper than ever these days it makes the decision even harder.Whether it be a watch,a car or an amplifier once you pass the price/performance point your return on your money lessens.If you are making money with the amp you can more easily justify the cost,if you're a hobbyist it's a little harder to do so.

Bottom line,go for it if you want to and can afford it.If I buy a $300 amp and I take my family on $1200 trip I can have my cake and eat it too,all the while keeping my priorities in line.

 

[hungovermorning]

But you've got that wrong though! It's the $1500 and $2000 amps like Marshall, Fender, Orange, Vox, etc. that usually do one thing really well, and the $300 and $400 amps like Crate, Line 6, etc. that do lots of things but not very well.

It seems that the less expensive amps try to make up for their lack of great tone (or at least what most people would consider great tone) with more "features."

Regardless, I think what the original poster is trying to get at is the adage, "Buy cheap, buy twice." And I certainly agree with that.

And amps like Ampeg, Gisbon, and Sound City do things great for a few hundred dollars as well. If we're only talking new, I completely agree, but if we include a used amp and a little leg work, $400 can get you something pretty spectacular.

 

[foo]

I've got a 1964 blackface Deluxe Reverb (not a reissue), and I love the way my old Strat sounds through it . . .

You're my hero!

1964 was the best year that I ever heard - there's just something about them. Had one and had to sell it ten years ago . . .

The point is that amps and sound is a very subjective topic. If you can hear the difference, then you're going to do whatever it takes to get the sound you want. If you can't hear the difference, then it doesn't matter anyway!

 

[SHEPPARDB.]

I'm no snob, but I appreciate good gear; at the same time, for what I play, the gear I use does the job (not that Fenders and Gibson and Music Man are shabby).

So many musicians are caught up in the "I gotta sound just like _______" that they never get the point of music, which is to express yourself through instruments and voice.

I like different amps and instruments (I play a Dobro, a '30s Regal, several fretted and fretless basses, acoustic guitar, harmonica and electric guitar) because I enjoy trying to exploit the sonic features of each combination without thinking "wish this sounded like Eric Clapton/James Taylor/Hubert Sumlin" (and on and on and on).

I've been an artist all my life, and it's always amazed me the way a guitarist who plays the solo off a record is hailed as a guitar hero. C'mon, guys,that's not ART, that's IMITATION. When you're starting out, imitation is how you learn...but that doesn't mean you have to make a lifetime career of it.

So you don't have to have the "perfect" amp because it's only gonna be "perfect" for one thing. I don't use my pallet knife to letter a poster with, and I don't use the lettering brush to paint a landscape in oil.

I would agree that there is no "perfect amp".But, a great pallet knife with a
footswitch that turns it in to a great lettering brush would be very useful if
you had to do both frequently.

 

[SHEPPARDB.]

I think some of you got my post while others did not.My point was to offer
what I feel like is a good bit of advice,not to be a gear snob.
After years of cheap amps(and expensive ones)that were one trick ponies,
I started looking at my purchases in a different light.My first thought now
when I am trying an amp is not "Wow, this amp has a beautiful clean",but
rather, what are it's limitations.Will it go from Brick house to Red house?
Highway star to highway song?Why?pt 2 to with a gun?Slither to pride and
joy,etc.,etc.
If you are a hobbiest,get what you can afford,or what you feel is within reason for a hobby.More power to you and I,m sure you will enjoy.
I'm no snob,gear or otherwise.Just pointing out that $300 here$300 there
adds up to the same total as something that was not thrown together in China.Just offering some food for thought.

 

[acidrock]

Would you rather have one really hot girlfriend or three nice ones?

.My point was to offer
what I feel like is a good bit of advice,not to be a gear snob.

I view it more as a personal preference than advice.Yes a $1500 amp IS going to sound and perform better,it should.This applies to almost every purchase we make in life.

 

[JPXTom]

In all honesty, there will never be a result to this that everyone agrees on..some need the expensive stuff, some dont...some need tubes, some dont...I think this thread was started off with a decent premise...dont waste money on things just to have them, when u know u want something better..but what if u really just want that thing thats cheaper? I say thats always good...whatever u know is the best...however(and half of this may go against my last post..but hey..we all have mood changes haha)..dont kid yourself either...but we all have expenses in other areas, and hoenstly for a 17 year old, saving 1200 bucks for an amp is highly inpractical...sometimes you have to sacrifice..but others you dont...all in all, message received.

 

[Mr. C]

Robben Ford quote from Feb. '08

I just read this quote last night which fits this thread perfectly:
"The best way to develop your own sound is to choose whatever gear you can afford, and then spend a lot of time using it. You really have to wrestle with a guitar and amp to find your own voice. You're not going to find it by searching the world for the perfect amp or guitar." (GP Feb.'08)

This quote made my day because I just don't have the money or at least can't justify spending $1500 on an amp. After all I have a family to take care of and I buy what I can afford.

 

[donkeystyle]

Just a reminder to all of you tone seekers out there that if you can save $300.00,then you can save $1500.00.Dont let a lack of patience decide
your next amp purchase.A quality amp should be in every guitarist arsenal.
I think a lot of the so called shoot outs of smaller amps round here are being
conducted by people that have no experience outside of the bedroom studio.
You certainly couldnt use any of those things and expect to have any headroom in a live situation.Why would you think it any more versatile in the studio?
Anyway,not trying to pick a scrap,just saying that most people that can afford $300.00 can afford high end if they want to.Skip that 6 pack after work
or the bag of pot.Eat ramen noodles for a month.Get a part time job.But dont
settle for shit tone.

To an extent I do agree with you, but there are some great buys out there. Also, most of the time you don't want or need the kind of headroom you get out of a high wattage guitar amp that's intended to be used for large live gigs.