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JonPaulP
New member
A question, if you are getting a top producer to produce your album, is $20,000+ a reasonable fee?
Thanks.
Thanks.
Armistice
Son of Yoda
Depends upon a whole lot of factors you haven't mentioned...
S
stevieb
Just another guy, really.
First, I think you need to define "producer." (Frankly, I do not care for the "rapper" definition, which seems to be "any yahoo who wants others to think he's Mr. freakin' Big,") My understanding of what a producer is, is the person who "gets things done," be it lining up appropriate session musicians and recording engineers, or seeing to it that there is a good supply of drinking water. By that definition, the only producer who was worth 20 G's would be one with a proven, recent track record, evidenced by results in the market- the ultimate example would be a "hit maker," and I would suspect that if you got one of those for 20 G's, he'd be doing it as charity. Of course, that is a textbook example of "Be careful what you wish for, your wish might come true:" that level of producer tend to be control freaks- understandable, as they know what works, and will remind you that you said that's what you wanted.
On the other hand, if you mean "recording or studio engineer" when you say "producer," well, really, the same thing applies: the really good ones know how to deliver a certain "product," and you pay them for that ability- again, twenty grand is probably getting them cheap.
Getting them cheap, or paying way too much, as you could have been hustled into believing baseless hype.
So, either way, I think you may have come to the wrong forum (in a broad sense, not internet sense, of the word.) You should ask around in the market you are hoping to sell to: "Who is this guy? Can he really deliver? Has he made hits/stars before? Recently? Can I work with him, or can I at least check my ego at the door, to get the results he promises? Etc.
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JonPaulP
New member
Yeah, that's the kind of producer I'm dealing with. It did sound like 20K was a low figure he was willing to accept.
ez_willis
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in 1992, Andy Wallce was paid $20k by our label for a couple of weeks of pre-production, engineering, producing, and mixing our record. That was almost immediately after Nirvana's Nevermind blew up, so his demand was high.
frederic
New member
"Couple" would be two weeks, $20K total, so that's $10K a week. 50 weeks a year (two weeks vacation) and that's $500,000 per year.
Top notch producers make far more than that. $20K is reasonable if the guy is a hit-maker.
ez_willis
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newcomputeruser
New member
not to me - probably not to you
What is the guy going to do that is worth 20K to you ?
I would tell him to work for a % of the net profit.
If he says not then either he can't do squat or else the music isn't worth pouring that money into it.
If you are doing hiphoprap then forget the producer.
If you are manager of a pop star it might be worth it.
If you are doing the definitive classical collection then yes it the guy is really any good.
If you have to ask........... the answer is probably no.
Make sure you get the terms defined and everything you need in the contract with penalty clauses for failure to perform as you expect.
What is the guy going to do that is worth 20K to you ?
I would tell him to work for a % of the net profit.
If he says not then either he can't do squat or else the music isn't worth pouring that money into it.
If you are doing hiphoprap then forget the producer.
If you are manager of a pop star it might be worth it.
If you are doing the definitive classical collection then yes it the guy is really any good.
If you have to ask........... the answer is probably no.
Make sure you get the terms defined and everything you need in the contract with penalty clauses for failure to perform as you expect.
J
JonPaulP
New member
This is very interesting. Is a penalty clause standard when you sign with a producer?
He will also be getting points, so I assume that it is in his best interest that the album does well.
ez_willis
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is a label paying for it?
J
JonPaulP
New member
No, but he will be shopping it to the labels.
ez_willis
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would this be before or after he gets his money? and is he a nigerian that wants to deposit a $100k check into your bank account, but first needs a $20k check from you to pay of a local nigerian offical?
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JonPaulP
New member
It would be after, while we are recording. I'm pretty sure there would be something to sign in the presence of an attorney before I hand over any cash. And no he's not a Nigerian, he was referred to me by an executive in the industry.
ez_willis
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why hasn't that "executive in the industry" either signed you or called in various A&R guys to listen to the music?
IN MY OPINION***, if he thought it had the potential to make money, he'd be all over that shit. if he has a buddy that could really use $20k minus 10% for the kickback, he'd suggest that you pay this heavyweight "hitmaker" to pitch it to the majors.
not that i think the "executive in the industry" is unscrupulous in any way. if you have $20k that you can part with this easily, you deserve it.
ez_willis
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***my opinion is always right.
Supercreep
Lizard People
Souds like you are about to be hosed for 20k. Your bright-eyed optimism is like a beacon to bloodsuckers.
If your music had the potential to be a revenue stream for someone, they'd be getting you to sign a contract for a number of albums and the label's option to require a number more. This dude wants his pound of flesh up front. Doesn't that ring any alarm bells for you?
Also, if you are not already a touring act that is making money on merchandise or ticket sales, I would be extremely suspicious. There isn't much money in album sales any more.
Good luck.
If your music had the potential to be a revenue stream for someone, they'd be getting you to sign a contract for a number of albums and the label's option to require a number more. This dude wants his pound of flesh up front. Doesn't that ring any alarm bells for you?
Also, if you are not already a touring act that is making money on merchandise or ticket sales, I would be extremely suspicious. There isn't much money in album sales any more.
Good luck.
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newcomputeruser
New member
negotiate
nothing is standard except for them trying to screw you over.
they do this all the time and their lawyers have one sided contracts that protect them and ensure you pay up no matter what. never sign their contract!!!!
a penalty clause , performance clause, etc,. are things you need to talk to your lawyer about before you sign anything.
Those protect you. the other guy wont like them. you need to negotiate yet be sure you are fully protected. believe it that they will look out for themselves.
you want to make sure that the contract guarantees taht you get what you want, and if you dont, they pay you enough to make up for all your expenses and losses.
if all this guy is going to do is "shop" your songs around I would kiss the 20K goodbye. Better to stick 19k of it in a 401k and produce your own cd. look at what discmakers can do for you at the 1-2Kbuck expense level. try something like that for your first cd.
points is a bonus to him. he makes his 20k up front. should you get lucky he can rake in more.
so do you feel lucky? want to make his day?
can you afford to lose 20K?
do you have the experience and cred to be successful at that level yet? or should you gain some more experience and get a fan following first?
nothing is standard except for them trying to screw you over.
they do this all the time and their lawyers have one sided contracts that protect them and ensure you pay up no matter what. never sign their contract!!!!
a penalty clause , performance clause, etc,. are things you need to talk to your lawyer about before you sign anything.
Those protect you. the other guy wont like them. you need to negotiate yet be sure you are fully protected. believe it that they will look out for themselves.
you want to make sure that the contract guarantees taht you get what you want, and if you dont, they pay you enough to make up for all your expenses and losses.
if all this guy is going to do is "shop" your songs around I would kiss the 20K goodbye. Better to stick 19k of it in a 401k and produce your own cd. look at what discmakers can do for you at the 1-2Kbuck expense level. try something like that for your first cd.
points is a bonus to him. he makes his 20k up front. should you get lucky he can rake in more.
so do you feel lucky? want to make his day?
can you afford to lose 20K?
do you have the experience and cred to be successful at that level yet? or should you gain some more experience and get a fan following first?
LDS
New member
What exactly is he going to do?. Is he going handling everything from making sure you're tracking in the right room with the right stuff all the way to the final product getting sent for mastering?
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JonPaulP
New member
Hmmm, I was just talking to another artist in the same genre and she said that her producer's fee is about $10K a song and the producer is a reputable one. I also read that David Foster asked Michael Buble upfront for $500K to produce his album. I suppose it's not all that unusual for a producer to charge an upfront fee?
Yes, he will be handling everything during production as well as things outside of production such as touring.
Yes, he will be handling everything during production as well as things outside of production such as touring.
ez_willis
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it's industry standard for a label to pay the producer up front. you aren't on a label.