Preamp to complement Brick and SSA P1?

[Mr. Moon]

Yeah, the P1 is all purpose but it excels at vocals.

Why not get a small used mixer for now? I say used, because you know you'll want to upgrade past it in the future and you could probably pass it along for what you have in it.

Mackie, Soundcraft Spirit or the like, fine for drum recording for sure. Once you upgrade past it, you may keep it for a monitor mixer.

War

Hi War,

I have a small BearRanger mixer that I use for band rehearsal, but there's no way I really want to incorporate that into anything I'm recording. For the money the BearRanger mixer does what it does and is great for rehearsals, but IMHO, the preamps suck @ss. They are not "good" for recording.

I want to buy a piece of gear that I'll have around for the next few years (or forever) which will allow me to step forward and progress with my recordings rather than just tread water or actually slide backwards. I am looking for something that will be able to compete with the P1 and Brick and round out my preamp arsenal, rather than buy something that just pisses me off every time I hear something that was recorded with it.

...I think I'm leaning towrd the Sytek at this point, as I can get 4 channels for less than the cost of the 2 channels in the RNP (per preamp costs, not the entire unit, as the Sytek is more expensive). I have enough for the RNP and I think I know how I can spin this to work for me... My wife LOVES a great deal. I think if I point out what the retail of the Sytek is vs. what I can get it for, she'll see how I cannot afford NOT to buy it!!

...Either that, or I just hide it from her.

-mr moon

 

[chessrock]

You could just withold sex until she caves in.

 

[Mr. Moon]

You could just withold sex until she caves in.

Ummmm, yeah...

Maybe I could give HER a reprieve from sex for a few months if she lets me get it instead!!

-mr moon

 

[Bassman Brad]

Well, first of all, I want to emphasize that I don't have any personal on-hands experience with any of these units, so you may or may not consider my opinion to be useful. However, I've spent a lot of time recently listening to the 3D Mic Pre CD (vol. 1), and I've got a pair of well-trained ears and some decent playback equipment, so I feel that I have something to contribute to this conversation. This CD compares a wide variety of preamps with identical input signals and identical mics. From these listening experience, I've started to classify mic pre's into three distinct categories. You've got those that do the "clinically pure" thing. This includes Earthworks and Sytek preamps. Then, you've got the pres that have the "tube sound" vibe. Then Manley dual mono is particulary impressive to me in this area, although you can generally spot that "tube sound" pretty easily on just about ANY of the tube pres on the CD. Then, you've got what I would call the "enhanced" sound, which is relatively natural, but also somewhat "larger than life" somehow. These pres just make you go "Ooooh yeah" when you hear them. They sound "natural" when you listen to them all by themselves, and you can only tell that they are not the last word in accuracy when you do an A/B comparison against one of the pres that have truly mastered the "clinically accurate" sound (such as the Earthworks pre). In an actual A/B comparison, you can hear that the "clinically accurate" pres do, indeed, have a noticible increase in resolution in the high end compared to the "bigger than life" pres. The Grace 201 and the Focusrite Red series both absolutely kill in the category of "enhanced reality" preamps, based upon the comparisons that I've heard. Many of the old, classic transistor pres also seem to fit into this category.

Since you specifically have two pres that are designed to address two of these sounds, it seems to me that you need to look for one that provides the third point of the triangle. The Brick is a tube design (and not just a "starved tube" thingy, either, but a "true tube design"), so it clearly falls in the tube camp. I'm not familiar with P1, but from what I've heard about it, it seems like they are shooting for more of a "enhanced reality" sound, rather than absolutely, uncompromising accuracy (i.e. tonally, it probably has more in common with the Focusright Red series than the Earthworks ZDT). What this tells me is that you really need to find a pre that does the ultra accurate, clinically pristine thing to have an ideal compliment to what you already have. (After all, that was how you defined your question, originally. You wanted to know what preamp would be a good "complement" to your other two pres.) Unfortunately, it costs money to squeeze that last bit of ultra-vivid realism out of a signal. You've already got decent preamps that do the other two sounds pretty well. I suspect that the RNP will sound somewhat similar to your P1, and wouldn't gain you the extra tonal flexibility that you seem to be searching for. (Money spent that doesn't accomplish your goal is money wasted, no matter how much or how little it might be.) Furthermore, the others are correct that you might be better off spending the money somewhere else in the signal chain. Quite frankly, a carefully chosen mic in that price range will go a LOT farther in giving you more tonal flexability than a third preamp, when you already have two nice pres. If you just have to have a second channel RIGHT AWAY for stereo recording, you could just get another P1 (or another Brick). Otherwise, my recommendation is that you wait until you can get an Earthworks or a Sytek, or just forget about getting another pre entirely and spend the money on something else that you need.

Brad

 

[Mr. Moon]

Yes!!!

Ummmm, yeah...

Maybe I could give HER a reprieve from sex for a few months if she lets me get it instead!!

-mr moon

Hee-hee, it worked!!!

Between pointing out what a bargain the Sytek is and the "reprieve from sex" thing

...I was somehow able to convince my wife to allow me to purchase the Sytek!!!!

SWEET!!!!!!!!!



-mr moon

 

[vangore]

Uh ... okay. That should be pretty easy, considering they're only $800.

Seriously, though, I'd look at that.

Or just pick up anything, really. You got a brick, and it's cool and bla bla bla ... you got the Safesound and it's easy to use and sounds good - yippee skipee and all. I mean, for 500 bucks are you really expecting to bring something ultra special and gee-whiz-look-at-me cool to the table? At a certain point, gain is gain is gain. How many new and unheard of ways are there, really, to boost the volume on a mic for 500 bucks?

Maybe it's time to get a blender. You know, something that'll chop things up ... puree, etc. You could make ice cream floats and milk shakes with it. That would be cool.

ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh BURNED!!!

 

[chessrock]

Hey, I respect the guy who can use sex to bribe his wife in to letting him get a mic pre. That takes some serious skills.

 

[EVT]

Mr Moon,
Excellent!!
I actually would love to get the sytek too! We both seem to want a lot of the same gear!
By the way, sorry for the little rampage on the other post, my mind was running wild. I didn't mean to come accross rude or anything.

Where are you getting the Sytek?
I found this place that seemed good.
http://www.proaudiotoys.com/store/product.aspx?prdId=70367

I have the Safesound P1, and I'm saving to get the A Designs Mp2, which WAR helped me with info about it. I want to use the a designs for keyboards, and drum machines (dual channel preamp). Right now, I'm using the safesound for vocals, bass, and have started mic'ng my blues jr. amp with an sm57 for electric guitar.
http://www.frontendaudio.com/A Designs MP2.htm

I'm also interested in getting the Speck asc-t, for post production. Instead of running my fostex vf16 directly into my cd recorder, I want to run it through this first.
http://store.yahoo.com/mercenary-audio/specmodascma.html

evt

 

[Mr. Moon]

ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh BURNED!!!

That would have been so funny maybe 36 hours ago...

But thanks for your interest in this thread and for all your support! Now, I gotta go take care of some bidness I have with my wife ...all in the name of a Sytek, geeeeeeeeezzzzz.



-mr moon

 

[Mr. Moon]

Mr Moon,
Excellent!!
I actually would love to get the sytek too! We both seem to want a lot of the same gear!
By the way, sorry for the little rampage on the other post, my mind was running wild. I didn't mean to come accross rude or anything.

Where are you getting the Sytek?
I found this place that seemed good.
http://www.proaudiotoys.com/store/product.aspx?prdId=70367

I have the Safesound P1, and I'm saving to get the A Designs Mp2, which WAR helped me with info about it. I want to use the a designs for keyboards, and drum machines (dual channel preamp). Right now, I'm using the safesound for vocals, bass, and have started mic'ng my blues jr. amp with an sm57 for electric guitar.
http://www.frontendaudio.com/A Designs MP2.htm

I'm also interested in getting the Speck asc-t, for post production. Instead of running my fostex vf16 directly into my cd recorder, I want to run it through this first.
http://store.yahoo.com/mercenary-audio/specmodascma.html

evt

Thanks and don't worry about it, this is a frickin' internet forum and a source of information (for some), therapy (for some), and entertainment (for us all). Getting a little bit of flak really helps me think through my purchases and many times has helped me stay away from junk.

I'm getting the Sytek direct from the source, as they have them on sale right now! They seem to be a great company to do business with!
Here's their web address:
http://www.sytek-audio-systems.com/

OK. I gots some bidness to tend to...

-mr moon

 

[exit2studios]

You might want to contact Sytek directly. When I got mine, I was stretched pretty thin so Mike hooked me up with a "demo" had some rack rash for about 7 bills.

Great preamps btw.

 

[chessrock]

You might want to contact Sytek directly. When I got mine, I was stretched pretty thin so Mike hooked me up with a "demo" had some rack rash for about 7 bills.

I got the same deal. Got a refurb for cheap.

 

[dlt123]

Yeah, sorry I didn't get back to you for a while, but there was a period of extreme silliness (serious enough to require a few Monty Python quotes to get it all sorted out! ) and such which drew me away from your post. I apologize for this....

Anywho, I would take you up on your offer if you had a LDC mic that I also had and could record some acoustic guitar with the RNP, as that is one of the uses I have planned for it. I want to start getting into some stereo micing techniques and I have read that it is best to at least start with indentical mics (C-4's in my case) running through identical preamps so you can learn to differentiate what the postioning effects are rather than hearing the differentiation provided solely due to the dissimilar gear.

Rest assured, the TwinTrak is not in the running any longer ...I guess I was kinda blinded by all the shiney lights and cool knobs!

-mr moon

I'm not sure if I should ask this, but is the TwinTrak really that bad? I hear, what I feel, is some high-end snobbery aimed at this unit. I am considering it along with the Brick and SP VTB-1 pre.

I plan on using my pre for vocals and sound effects only. I would like to keep my purchase below $500. The VTB-1 goes for around $139 and it has received good reviews for it's price.

You are right, the TwinTrak looks good and I do hear some good reviews from some who own it, but could someone here who owns this unit step in and give their assessment?... or again, is this unit really that bad?

Thanks
DennisT