G
Goss-stick
New member
My mic goes into my mixer then into my digi002(protools). I'm trying to achieve that natural warmth sound what should i do or get?
Todzilla
New member
Get a good singer/music source, in a good room, through a good mic, through a good preamp and experiment.
Seriously though, if you're looking for a product that is going to magically impart warmth, you are going about it the wrong way, I'm afraid.
Seriously though, if you're looking for a product that is going to magically impart warmth, you are going about it the wrong way, I'm afraid.
G
Goss-stick
New member
Thats why I'm trying to get some input...
Todzilla
New member
Okay,
get a Neumann U-47 microphone
get a Neve 1073 preamp
get a UA LA-2A compressor
get a Cranesong A/D converter
This should help warm up your sound.
get a Neumann U-47 microphone
get a Neve 1073 preamp
get a UA LA-2A compressor
get a Cranesong A/D converter
This should help warm up your sound.
M
moresound
Loud Sun Studios
G
GASious Clay
New member
I'm new to this forum, but not new to recording... hello all. Aside from the helpful comments already received, and assuming you don't have the $20,000 laying around that the above mentioned list would likely run you... I'd start looking at your mic and preamp. It all depends on your source, there's not really a one fit solution, I'll give Mr. Zilla that... but there are types of pres that will help you out. The pres in your mixer are there to provide gain... and that's about it. Not a lot of thought went into them unless you have a great console or something, which I'm assuming you don't... At a budget level, the DMP3 is a fairly good preamp. Made by M-audio. I just recently tried one and it's not bad for the money.
Different pres will do different things, some color the sound in a particular way, some are very transparent... it's all about the sound you're looking for. Here's a free bit of advice that took me a while to figure out... "warmth" as a lot of people describe it, is harmonic distortion added to a a signal by a good quality transformer. That's what you're hearing. Some people go for the transformer sound, some people don't. It's up to you to find out.
Bulk pres are useful, but people build pres that will let you demo them for a while. They can get expensive, and you don't want to find out that your pre sounds really harsh on acoustic guitar after you bought a pre for an acoustic guitar.... Also carefully consider how many channels you want. You don't want to spend a boatload on a great pre and suddenly realize that you need one more channel. I've bought single channel pres before and had to wait around to get a second channel to do what I want with them.
In summary, define what you want... specific source, or all around, transformer or no, your budget, see if you can demo one before buying, and you get what you pay for...
I'd at least try to get some people on here with tracks of pres with transformers vs tracks with pres without transformers so you can see if you dig it, and go from there. You probably will. Hope this helps.
Different pres will do different things, some color the sound in a particular way, some are very transparent... it's all about the sound you're looking for. Here's a free bit of advice that took me a while to figure out... "warmth" as a lot of people describe it, is harmonic distortion added to a a signal by a good quality transformer. That's what you're hearing. Some people go for the transformer sound, some people don't. It's up to you to find out.
Bulk pres are useful, but people build pres that will let you demo them for a while. They can get expensive, and you don't want to find out that your pre sounds really harsh on acoustic guitar after you bought a pre for an acoustic guitar.... Also carefully consider how many channels you want. You don't want to spend a boatload on a great pre and suddenly realize that you need one more channel. I've bought single channel pres before and had to wait around to get a second channel to do what I want with them.
In summary, define what you want... specific source, or all around, transformer or no, your budget, see if you can demo one before buying, and you get what you pay for...
I'd at least try to get some people on here with tracks of pres with transformers vs tracks with pres without transformers so you can see if you dig it, and go from there. You probably will. Hope this helps.
M
moresound
Loud Sun Studios
Hey GAS welcome to the ZOO. 
G
GASious Clay
New member
Many thanks Moresound.. been reading for a while... years I guess. Figured I'd contribute my 2 cents every now and then...
Bristol Posse
Okey Dokey
Also Be prepared to be disappointed, or at least nonplussed
A nice mic pre can add a few sprinkles to the icing on the marzipan on the cake that is a good vocal recording, assuming you have the listening environment in which you are able to notice it
If the performance and/or the recording is sh!t, then you have sh!t that has been rolled in a few sprinkles......and that still is not good
95% or more of the warmth and greatness of a vocal comes from the performer, probably next in order of importance is the space in which it was recording, then the mic (both positioning and adeqaucy for the task) and then the pre.
Also to be considered is the correctness of the monitoring environment that will effect whether you can a) hear the difference in the pres and b) take real advantage of it in the mix (IMO/E anyway YMMV)
if all you are looking for is a little harmonic distortion you could even look at a few plugins, there are even some really nice free ones made by Bootsy
take a look here http://varietyofsound.wordpress.com/vst-effects/, the first one on that page is an EQ/Preamp simulator that adds harmonic distortion
I'd give that a go to see if it gives you what you want before dropping a dime on a new pre
Also the DMP3 mentioned above is a really good for the money pre with lots of gain, however it is also rather transparent and not a good choice if you are looking for "Warmth" from harmonic distortion (Greetings to GASious Clay BTW and no intent to flame you)
A nice mic pre can add a few sprinkles to the icing on the marzipan on the cake that is a good vocal recording, assuming you have the listening environment in which you are able to notice it
If the performance and/or the recording is sh!t, then you have sh!t that has been rolled in a few sprinkles......and that still is not good
95% or more of the warmth and greatness of a vocal comes from the performer, probably next in order of importance is the space in which it was recording, then the mic (both positioning and adeqaucy for the task) and then the pre.
Also to be considered is the correctness of the monitoring environment that will effect whether you can a) hear the difference in the pres and b) take real advantage of it in the mix (IMO/E anyway YMMV)
if all you are looking for is a little harmonic distortion you could even look at a few plugins, there are even some really nice free ones made by Bootsy
take a look here http://varietyofsound.wordpress.com/vst-effects/, the first one on that page is an EQ/Preamp simulator that adds harmonic distortion
I'd give that a go to see if it gives you what you want before dropping a dime on a new pre
Also the DMP3 mentioned above is a really good for the money pre with lots of gain, however it is also rather transparent and not a good choice if you are looking for "Warmth" from harmonic distortion (Greetings to GASious Clay BTW and no intent to flame you)
Last edited:
G
GASious Clay
New member
Yes DMP3 is transparent... should have added that.. thanks. Just figured he'd end up there budget-wise and got off on a tangent before clarifying.
Also Check out FMR audio RNP. I haven't personally tried it, but my friends have good things to say about it. I think it's around $250 a channel though... still pretty good for the $$$.
Haven't tried those plugins, I'll take a look and compare it to my Pre... see what's what... could be useful.
Also Check out FMR audio RNP. I haven't personally tried it, but my friends have good things to say about it. I think it's around $250 a channel though... still pretty good for the $$$.
Haven't tried those plugins, I'll take a look and compare it to my Pre... see what's what... could be useful.
Todzilla
New member
Gasious is right. So-called "warmth" (which is far too subjective a term to have any precision) is typically associated with harmonic distortion.
My point, obnoxious though it was, is that people looking for a simple solution to a highly subjective perceived problem, without experimenting intensively, are bound for disappointment. There are myriad devices out there purporting to "impart warmth" and with such enormous subjectivity in what is considered "warmth," I have come to consider it nothing more than a marketing gimmick.
That said, I built some Seventh Circle Audio preamps a while back, choosing the API and Neve clones, which feature big meaty transformers that impart harmonic distortion. THose, in conjunction with my Demeter HM-1 tube preamp, give what I consider to be lots of warmth. Hard to describe how the warmth created by these devices is superior to cheap tube devices, but it is really evident in a full mix. Individual tracks, not so much, at least to my ears. BTW, there's a shocking thread in the Gearslutz archives featuring a blind shootout of an ART TubeMP vs. a GreatRiver Neve clone preamp, where the majority favored the ART.
I've found that warmth has more to do with mic positioning and performance that putting any given device into the signal path.
My point, obnoxious though it was, is that people looking for a simple solution to a highly subjective perceived problem, without experimenting intensively, are bound for disappointment. There are myriad devices out there purporting to "impart warmth" and with such enormous subjectivity in what is considered "warmth," I have come to consider it nothing more than a marketing gimmick.
That said, I built some Seventh Circle Audio preamps a while back, choosing the API and Neve clones, which feature big meaty transformers that impart harmonic distortion. THose, in conjunction with my Demeter HM-1 tube preamp, give what I consider to be lots of warmth. Hard to describe how the warmth created by these devices is superior to cheap tube devices, but it is really evident in a full mix. Individual tracks, not so much, at least to my ears. BTW, there's a shocking thread in the Gearslutz archives featuring a blind shootout of an ART TubeMP vs. a GreatRiver Neve clone preamp, where the majority favored the ART.
I've found that warmth has more to do with mic positioning and performance that putting any given device into the signal path.
slinky
New member
Greetings all,
On the subject of pre amps - I have been trying to record an acoustic guitar - both steel string and classical into an Edirol FA 66 (audio interface)straight into a computer using both DI and Mics. Although the Edirol has fantom power, I am always finding I need to boost the signal in the EQ. especially when using a mic, (condenser). I am guessing that a pre amp is the answer. I am not looking for warmth here, although the option might be good to have. Any advice on this subject?
Talking about `warmth`, when I was looking for a guitar amp a few years ago,
I set up a solid state against a tube amp to hear for myself what the difference was. I have always kind of liked the `flat` sound you get with a transistor amp. You can always add warmth if you want with effects. Tube amps are always described as warm. My conclusion was that the warmth was the 3 dimensional quality you get with tubes - the solid state was very 2 dimensional or `flat` in comparison.
www.paulholzherr.com
On the subject of pre amps - I have been trying to record an acoustic guitar - both steel string and classical into an Edirol FA 66 (audio interface)straight into a computer using both DI and Mics. Although the Edirol has fantom power, I am always finding I need to boost the signal in the EQ. especially when using a mic, (condenser). I am guessing that a pre amp is the answer. I am not looking for warmth here, although the option might be good to have. Any advice on this subject?
Talking about `warmth`, when I was looking for a guitar amp a few years ago,
I set up a solid state against a tube amp to hear for myself what the difference was. I have always kind of liked the `flat` sound you get with a transistor amp. You can always add warmth if you want with effects. Tube amps are always described as warm. My conclusion was that the warmth was the 3 dimensional quality you get with tubes - the solid state was very 2 dimensional or `flat` in comparison.
www.paulholzherr.com
dco
New member
I agree with this.
G
Goss-stick
New member
@tod Look! I said, "what should i do or get?" i didn't say what should i buy to solve this problem. So no need for the sarcastic response.
@gas thank you! You been real helpful
Todzilla
New member
Sarcastic? I guarantee that equipment list, if employed correctly, will impart what I assume you mean by warmth.
And I apologize for confusing "get" with "buy."
G
Goss-stick
New member
Thanks for your help, its hard to tell sometime how a person is really saying something over the net. Thanks again!