Newbie Here - How's my first test recording?

[Chili]

Yeah, you've got a lot of good advice from some very knowledgeable people.

About the reverb, it works nicely. Cubase default plugs aren't the greatest, but they aren't bad either and are cpu efficient. You can always experiment with others. It's like another color on your palette.

I've got an older version od Cubase and for me to freeze a midi/vst track, I have to solo that track and perform an Export> mixdown. There's an option to bounce it to a new track in the project.

If you're cpu is having trouble keeping up, be sure to shutdown everything else running on your computer, especially any anti-virus. You can use Task Manager (if you're using Windows) to shutdown some of the background processes. Recording all your audio files to a 2nd physical hard drive is a good way to ease the burden on your system. With a 2nd hard drive, your DAW won't be competing with the O/S for drive head time.

Look forward to hearing more.

 

[JonPaulP]

KineticSound, by putting space, do you mean putting pauses in the arrangements so the sound isn't continuous and resembles an orchestra more than a synth track? Or were you talking about the channels?

Thanks for the suggestions on recording the vst instruments. Does it diminish the quality? Also, is freezing the vst instruments essentially "recording" them? I remember when I froze the tracks, it looked like Cubase was saving them as wav files or something.

Yeah, I'm surprised about the CPU thing since my computer has a lot of RAM. I noticed that the CPU is the highest when I add a lot of reverb on multiple tracks with EastWest Symphonic Orchestra and Goliath.

Has anyone here tried the SIR1 reverb plug-in?

 

[Chili]

KineticSound, by putting space, do you mean putting pauses in the arrangements so the sound isn't continuous and resembles an orchestra more than a synth track? Or were you talking about the channels?

Thanks for the suggestions on recording the vst instruments. Does it diminish the quality? Also, is freezing the vst instruments essentially "recording" them? I remember when I froze the tracks, it looked like Cubase was saving them as wav files or something.

Yeah, I'm surprised about the CPU thing since my computer has a lot of RAM. I noticed that the CPU is the highest when I add a lot of reverb on multiple tracks with EastWest Symphonic Orchestra and Goliath.

Has anyone here tried the SIR1 reverb plug-in?

Yeah, reverb will eat a lot cpu cycles. Instead of putting reverb on each track, create an FX track for reverb then assign a Send from each channel to that track. That way you have only one reverb instance and a whole lot less cpu useage.

I probably don't have your version of cubase, but yes, it sounds like freezing your midi tracks is creating wav files for them. If your using VSTi's, this will help a lot too. As for diminishing quality: probably don't have to worry about that. If the VSTi is 24bit samples and your recording at 16 bit, then you might notice a difference. But you should be recording at 24 bit anyways; especially for this kind of material.

Cheers,

 

[KineticSound]

KineticSound, by putting space, do you mean putting pauses in the arrangements so the sound isn't continuous and resembles an orchestra more than a synth track? Or were you talking about the channels?

Thanks for the suggestions on recording the vst instruments. Does it diminish the quality?

Sorry, man. In re-reading my post, it's a little ambiguous. I was referring to reverb usage... how the different instruments sit in the imaginary concert hall we're listening in.

I agree with others that have suggested recording the vst instruments as audio tracks. Assuming you're using software plugins on each track, your computer will love you for converting the tracks to audio first. Just remember to record them dry and to save the original midi files in case you want to go back and make changes later!

 

[rayc]

Senza -The strings and voice do wah a bit in the middle - on the vox particularly it's as if you slipped with the melodyne or vocoder in the middle of each shorter note. Nice change for the forum.
The vocal vibrato is generally under control - warbles just a little at the end.
Good work - keep at it & listen to davidK always.

 

[JonPaulP]

Senza -The strings and voice do wah a bit in the middle - on the vox particularly it's as if you slipped with the melodyne or vocoder in the middle of each shorter note. Nice change for the forum.
The vocal vibrato is generally under control - warbles just a little at the end.
Good work - keep at it & listen to davidK always.

Haha, it sounds like I used melodyne on the vocals? I don't own melodyne, but was thinking about it.

I think you're talking about the notes being slightly off key in the beginning and end and being on pitch in the middle? Someone on another forum pointed that out to me too. I'm in the process of getting another vocal coach.

I was trained bel canto, then I switched to speech level singing (a throaty pop-style way of singing which gave me some kind of laryngitis) and now am trying to get back to bel canto. I noticed the pitch and vibrato problems too...I'm a little out of practice with my previous bel canto technique .

 

[rayc]

One of my fav artists of all time starts below the note, slides into it & ends up sharp - Tom Verlain from television - well at least on their 1st LP he did.
I really like what you're doing - the diff is that things stick out like the proverbial dog's doughnuts with your style of music and delivery - so the rod you've created for your back is stiffer than most. HOWEVER, don't be put off by my comments - I can't sing, I'm not even allowed to hum in the house. I do like most of what you're doing - it just needs some more work.

 

[JonPaulP]

I'm not put off at all and appreciate the honesty. If you and others hadn't pointed out the flaws, I probably wouldn't have noticed them. Thanks again for the input! Gives me a few things to work on while preparing to record.

 

[dreamer7]

dreamer7, thanks for the very useful advice! When I was comparing the synth sounds of my recording to professionally made recordings, there is definitely something lacking. How do you warm up the sounds? Do you think I should add reverb to make the instruments mix more? For the purpose of test recordings, I just added the VST instruments to the midi file without much tweaking, but it would be good to know some techniques for making them sound more realistic. I put one track of harmony in the left track and a different harmony track on the right. Should I put them in the middle along with the main track?

Hi again Jon, sorry for the late reply, I've been way busy lately.
Well, using a synth or sampler, it goes without saying (but I'll say it anyway ) that you'll never get as good a sound as a real orchestra. So you just need to experiment a lot with the tools at your disposal to get as close as possible and come to a sound that seems genuine enough and that you're happy with.

As others have said, reverb will make the instrument sounds sit nicely together, but can also muddy a mix, so you need to be careful. Sometimes I find that using echo instead of, or as well as, reverb works well, but then I make very different music to you and effects are a big part of the atmosphere for me. I almost never use a sound straight, even if it's from a synth.

I don't record on a computer yet, so others here can definitely help you more in that respect and also in more technical ways. I always work from my gut instinct. So my advice would be to really experiment a lot with the effects and virtual sounds that you've got and almost create your own library of what works and what doesn't work for you personally (wer'e all so different!).

Don't be afraid of using and piling on some sort of effect that you may think shouldn't work, because it might just sound right for a particular track. The great thing about computer recording is that you can always change it again if it doesn't work. Sometimes mixing seemingly incongruous sounds together can make something unique and like I said, if it doesn't work you can always go back to your personally created library of what does work.

I'm certainly no expert on classical music, but the main thing that occurs to me about orchestras is that there are sometimes many, many quite different instruments all imposing there unique sound on the whole, mostly within a large hall that has massive natural reverb and it's our two little ears that manage to sort out the overall mesh of sounds and pass that into our brains for us to marvel at. So, who knows what's really going on there and how the sounds are mixing together to create something extraordinary.

As far as your harmonies go, I think they're really well mixed and spread in your version of 'Ave Maria', but in 'Senza Catene' they seem much more down the middle and could probably do with a bit more separation. Having said that, your harmonies are just beautiful and both tracks have emotional power.

Hope you find your way forward without too many headaches, but you can have a lot of fun by experimenting and trying some unusual things out. You never know, you might even develop your own style that is still classically oriented but has your own mark on it. Originality is a goal that we should all be chasing in many ways.

My thoughts for what they're worth anyway, Jon,
Dreamer

 

[Obi-Wan zenabI]

ave maria

Really neat recordings! Great work. I like the Tympani on Ave Maria, but the stereo spread was way too extreme to listen to in headphones. Is the organ a stereo sample? You could probably leave it stereo and still center the voice and it will be nice and clear.

Singing criticism: Your "Ah" is not open enough... if you dropped your jaw more on the Ah of Mari-AHHH, it wouldn't sound so Nasal, and would match your otherwise excellent sounding voice. (better than mine, for sure!)

There were two other odd vowel things going on, one was on one of the "Do" words... it sounded really pop-style and did not fit with the style of the rest of your delivery.

I agree that the first recording had too much reverb. I'd love to hear the remix.

 

[JonPaulP]

dreamer7, thanks a lot for your thoughts. I found them very helpful! I know what you mean about mixing the effects around. I currently experimenting with some "rock" effects on some of the tracks I'm working on. It think it's gonna sound really cool!

Obi-Wan zenabI, thanks for the vocal tips. I believe the organ sample is stereo. Should I leave it in the center or duplicate the track and put one on the left and one on the right (or do both methods essentially do the same thing)? Should I try to pan the different instruments off center, but not to the extreme left or right?

I love how some people are also giving some useful feedback on the singing technique because I could take these observations with me to my coach when I start my training again in a few weeks.

Keep 'em coming!

 

[Obi-Wan zenabI]

JPP, leave the organ track "centered," that is, make sure you have the track in your DAW set to stereo, not mono. Vocals centered, too. The Organ, if it is a stereo sample, will have slightly different sounds coming from each speaker, leaving "room" for the vocals in the center.

Also remember that adding reverb makes something sound muddier and further away. You might clarify the vocals by backing off the reverb on them and keeping reverb on the organ (to give it that "back of the church" sound....

 

[JonPaulP]

Thanks for the tip. I think the organ sample is a stereo sample, but I'm not sure. It's from EastWest Goliath. I'm trying to find better organ samples, have any ideas?