NEW CD recording - Finally satisfied with a home-made production :)

[Saz]

Hi guys,
About 2 months ago my band released its 2nd full length CD. I did the recording and production myself. We had it mastered afterwards. Check out two of the tracks if you like:

01-Blueprint

03-DOD

Style Approximation: Crossover metal. Influenced by 90's bands like: Fear factory, Machine head, Stuck Mojo, Life of agony....

I recorded&mixed this album myself with Cool Edit Pro. [Drums were recorded on 8 tracks; we used rented microphones, and a PC with an 8 track recording card which we purchased with the band] After I was fairly satisfied with the "mixed" sound, we had an "aquaintance" do some mastering on it. He really pumped up the low end, and made the high frequencies crystal clear. A little too much low end in my opinion. It tends to overrule the guitars.. But my fellow band mates disagree, they truly dig the sound, so if they're happy, I am as well..

To hear HOW the mastering "affected" the sound, click:

mastering-example-sample

I'm not claiming that this result is how it SHOULD be, it's just OUR final result, as good as we could get it for almost no budget, and in almost no time, using ONLY digital tools and a PC for recording, mixing AND mastering.

The mastering really brought it alive in my opinion. [most people agree on that, but some well-trained pros might still be sceptical about the sound.. As long as people know what to reference it to, I'm fine with their opinion. I must state that this is a home-made recording, no Andy Sneap production!]

I expect quite "harsh" comments here, since I know that a lot of pros post here, who will not be impressed that easily I'll take the chance. Maybe I'll get some useful tips! This was my first "extensive" full length production, so give me some slack plz. :s

It is by far the best result that I ever got from a home made recording. I know it doesn't sound perfect, I have about a million remarks about it myself, but I am very curious to YOUR opinion about it. I'll be glad to give feedback to interested readers.

Greetz,
Saz

Badly Preserved homepage

 

[Pedullist]

since I know that a lot of pros post here

It's homerecording.com. There are some pros around, but they're pretty nice to us. As you long as you don't call your music 'professional sounding', you're safe.

And most of us aren't harsh people.

Sounds good! Very tight band too! Reminds me of the stuff Wireneck posts. You should check out his music sometime. In fact, check out more music. That's what this board is all about. Post music, get responses, listen to music, and respond to it. Good fun!

About the mastering: huge improvement indeed.....I think you should ask yourself: why sounds my homemade recording so damn muffled. Perhaps if you can fix that by buying a better soundcard (or better mics, just guessing here), you don't need the "aquaintance" next time

Hé, verrek je komt uit Nederland....

 

[Saz]

Thanx pedullist! I’m glad you like it.

Wireneck?? That’s one of the regular posters here, I assume? You probably don’t mean the band wireneck.. I’ll check it out, I always like listening to other people’s attempts!

>> I think you should ask yourself: why sounds my homemade recording so damn muffled. Perhaps if you can fix that by buying a better soundcard (or better mics, just guessing here), you don't need the "aquaintance" next time

Well, the soundcard used is a Terratec EWS88MT, and that’s a pretty darn good piece of equipment if you ask me.. I recorded everything on 44,1 kHz and mixed 16 bit, but the Terratec can record up to 96 kHz and mix on 32 bits! I might try that next time, with a faster PC. We used “basic” shure mics for vocals, and “Audiotechnica” mics for drums. We did NOT have condenser mics, so that’s partially why the unmastered recording sounds muffled.

And as far as the guitars go.. [this is fun] They were all done with a Line6 POD directly! No real amp, all the way digital, and all the way emulated! I'd honestly like to know how many of you could have guessed that...

And as far as the mastering by the “acquaintance” goes.. Do you think that it’s “smart” to go WITHOUT mastering by an “objective” ear?? I rather like this “third party” step..

My opinion is that ONLY a well trained person, who STILL can listen to your mix objectively [which the producer can NOT after hundreds of hours of listening to the tracks] can shape a good MASTER, because he can still use his “FIRST IMPRESSION” to determine accurately WHAT exactly is lacking in the sound, and his experience to carry his thoughts out..

Do you perhaps have any idea HOW a unmastered mix is supposed to sound?? I do not, so I just did something and hoped for the best…

>> Hé, verrek je komt uit Nederland....

Verdomd, dat is nog waar ook!

Greetz,
Saz

 

[Pedullist]

You know what? I'll respond in dutch, it's much easier. Screw the americans...LOL

Wireneck?? That’s one of the regular posters here, I assume?

Inderdaad! Ik wist niet eens dat het een band was. Ben al tijden uit de metalwereld. Niet dat ik er niet meer naar kan luisteren ofzo (sterker nog, ik mag nog graag naar Carcass, Strapping Young Lad en Opeth luisteren), maar op een gegeven moment was ik.......eh......metaalmoe. Zal de leeftijd wel wezen....

We did NOT have condenser mics, so that’s partially why the unmastered recording sounds muffled

Aha! Dat maakt wel een boel uit ja. De Terratec is inderdaad een prima kaart. Dus daar ligt het niet aan. Wizzikoknie hè? Ik wilde je trouwens echt niet op de kast jagen met die opmerking ofzo, maar de verschillen tussen de niet-gemasterde en de gemasterde stukken waren enorm groot. En dan vooral op het vlak van de hogere frequencies. En ikzelf neem met de schijtkaart bij uitstek op (de Creative Audigy), en het klinkt bij mij toch minder dof. Dus ik vroeg mij af hoe dat kan.

I'd honestly like to know how many of you could have guessed that...

Alle pro's op dit board kunnen dit horen, dat verzeker ik je. Misschien sommige homerecorders ook, maar die interesseert het weer geen reet Eindeloze discussies hebben we erover gehad op dit board. Ik heb ook een Pod trouwens (twee zelfs). Ty Tabor van King's X ook. Wie weet wie nog meer.

Do you perhaps have any idea HOW a unmastered mix is supposed to sound??

Voordat ik verder ga: jullie kennis heeft het goed gedaan, begrijp me niet verkeerd.

Maarre, ik heb teveel initieel goeie opnamen verprutst horen worden door 'mastering professionals'. En ze vragen er toch een boel geld voor. Ik heb het idee dat ze onder het mom van 'de klant weet toch niet hoe het werkt' wat standaard multiband compressor/maximizer presets loslaten (bij voorkeur zonder te luisteren) en het dan wel best vinden. Dus ik heb het persoonlijk een beetje gehad met het soort mensen. 'Als' ik mijn volgende cd professioneel laat masteren dan laat ik mijn cd eerst twee maanden liggen en zal er vervolgens BIJ GAAN ZITTEN. En misschien doe ik het wel gewoon zelf....eigenwijs als ik ben. Ik heb toch geen fans, hahaha. Ja, misschien op dit board. Maar die doen niet zo moeilijk.

 

[SLuiCe]

NO DUTCH GODDAMIT!

 

[SLuiCe]

Yea good sound! The mastering definitely enhanced them highs and lows eh? Thanks for posting that!

By the way, you see any pros around here, you tell them to get lost. We like our ignorance here.

 

[Pedullist]

NO DUTCH GODDAMIT!

Shut up, mommy and daddy are talking dirty...

By the way, you see any pros around here, you tell them to get lost. We like our ignorance here.

LOL

 

[F_cksia]

he pedaalaap WIJ waren toch mommy and daddy? wij talken toch dirty? en nu komt er ineens een nieuwe bij en ja hoor pedulkerel gaat weer vreemd.

IK MAAK HET UIT!

 

[F_cksia]

en SAZ.., van jou ga ik uberhaupt niks luisteren..



















..maar dat is voornamelijk omdat ik hier geen speakers heb in het internetcafe.

 

[Pedullist]

LODGVHL

(ligt op de grond van het lachen)

 

[Lt. Bob]

Icenay Ongsay.

 

[Pedullist]

he pedaalaap WIJ waren toch mommy and daddy? wij talken toch dirty? en nu komt er ineens een nieuwe bij en ja hoor pedulkerel gaat weer vreemd.

IK MAAK HET UIT!

Wel grappig dat ik een (pedul)kerel ben, en jij dus het vrouwtje....

 

[SLuiCe]

I'm gonna be sick.

 

[TripleM]

Screw the americans

Another one of those elitist Dutch dicks.

I listened to Bluprint and the mastering example. The mastering took the harshness out and made the overall sound considerably warmer. But it was a much quieter mix.

As for Blueprint... Real tight band. Lots of stuff going on. Goes in lots of directions. It has a decent enough thumping low ends. Good screaming vocals.

Some of the guitars are a little abrasive sounding. Most of it is ok, but some parts get a little crispy. The guitar in the intro is a bit overly mid-rangy.

Some weird sound on the kick drum. Has a "clickiness" to it. I noticed this on both samples I listened to.

 

[SLuiCe]

I never did like that SLuiCe fucker. If he wasn't so good looking I wouldn't even talk to him...

ya whatever...

 

[participant]

Blueprint -

Hmmm... sounds like some of tubedude's stuff... big, full mix... a LOT like
Creed (except for the voice)... then it changes... more punk like... very
complex... now, it's doing the Jonathan Davis/Korn thing... how are you recording
guitars? With mics? They sound a bit too dry to me...almost like PODs... (but
that's being VERY picky)

Ah... the outro influenced by your Metallicas/Megadeths...

Really professional level stuff... some of the cymbals sound funny... too much
between 4k-8k on 'em (IMO)... not enough shimmer. There's also some clipping
in the Metal outro part... drums/bass having problems with each other.

Powerful stuff. Really nice guitar mix... drums could come up a hair (snare/toms)
Should get you plenty of listeners.

DOD -

Nice drum sound to begin... ok... this sounds quite a bit like Sevendust (except
the vocal)... but the delivery and arrangement is very similar to 7dust...

Great layers of guitar... tight performance... now the 5 ***** are coming for
this song... yep... a good Sevendust impression. (Sing.... yell... sing...)

Overall, a better mix than the other song.

Nice job... sounds like a lot of work.


Chad

 

[F_cksia]

Wel grappig dat ik een (pedul)kerel ben, en jij dus het vrouwtje....

Heuh.. ja van die avatars van je wordt ik ook niet veel wijzer de laatste tijd.



saz.. sorry voor het interruperen van je thread (fck ik kan niet eens meer normaal nederlands praten hier), ik zal zo gauw het weer mogelijk is je nr luisteren. in fact ga ik nu meteen een koptelefoon kopen.. I'll be back.

 

[Saz]

Some of the guitars are a little abrasive sounding. Most of it is ok, but some parts get a little crispy. The guitar in the intro is a bit overly mid-rangy.

Yeah, the midrange might be overdone a bit, but IMHO the mastered sample has more of that than the unmastered sample... I was a bit TOO eager to get a cutting CHOP CHOP sound á la the old Machine Head.. I had absolutely no idea of the impact of mastering, since I never witnessed something like that before..

Some weird sound on the kick drum. Has a "clickiness" to it. I noticed this on both samples I listened to.

The kick was triggered, because our drummer insisted on it. It took me quite some work to equalize it to a more realistic sound. It still does not sound realistic, but when compared to the original sound... oh my god..

I made a sample of the original kick sound as recorded, and after equalizing:

Bassdrum sample

**three kicks unmixed followed by three kicks with EQ**

I already stated this to the band: NO triggering next time. At least NOT without a better module..

But I'm glad that at least I got the kick to sound warmer, still cut through the mix, and be heard continuously..

how are you recording
guitars? With mics? They sound a bit too dry to me...almost like PODs... (but that's being VERY picky)

I am very impressed... The guitars ARE all POD. Your hearing is most excellent! {assuming that you did not read my post a bit up where I already revealed that I used POD ) No microphone placement, just the line6 AIR simulation.. The guitar sound is indeed a bit too "direct-sounding".. But it does offer a lot of other "aspects" that I look for in a guitar sound, and could never record before. I chose POD, because it GIVES me more than it LACKS of the sound that I look for.

For live use I'm still looking for a good setup. I want a FAT and TIGHT hi-gain sound, but I also want my rig to be 19" all the way.. So I won't settle for a 5150 head, because I'm getting tired of connecting all those separate "parts" all over again.. [like FX, wireless system, EQ's and all of the adapters and cables..] So I'm going to check out how much line6 improved their sound with their new PODxt..

Nice job... sounds like a lot of work.

It was quite some work yes.. The drums were recorded with clicktracks, and this was a new topic to our drummer.. It costed some extra time, but I'm glad that he eventually managed to record with it. We recorded 11 songs, so the recording process kept us busy for a bit more than a week.

I only had 1 week to mix it, so I was mixing on it approximately 16 hours a day, until my day-night pattern got "inverted".. I'm not an experienced "mixer" so, I had to try a lot out first, to see what I actually was doing.. I had to familiarize myself with compression and other fx while mixing, so that really was a pain..

I totally agree on most of your points. Snare should have been more present, but I had to "accept" the result that I got after a week. We planned a CD presentation, and well.. the CD just had to be pressed and ready by that announced date!

The mastering-dude also was pressurized btw: He was very busy himself with private things that particular week, but we begged him to try to master it for us. It was like tuesday, and we had to send it for pressing on friday, to be sure that the CD's would be ready on time. So either he did a mastering-attempt, or we would have had to send the "unmastered" mix for pressing 1000 CD's...

He ended up mastering it between midnight and morning.... (Most of it in one night, some double checking in a second night) He never heard the songs before, so I think he did a good job for the 50 euro he charged us..

 

[Pedullist]

F_cksia is right.....Saz, pardon me too for spoiling your thread.

 

[mbuster]

Niet alleen deed ik gebruiken een vertaalprogramma om dit te schrijven, maar u het Nederlands bent poops. Iedereen maar uw geschommeld op hond weet dat mijn tiende rangleraar uw amandel komt slaan.
Door de manier, Pedullist, uw omhoog barsten avatars me. Hey Saz, het aardige werk. Vooral voor een haan hider.