new amateur looking for mic advice

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downstream

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Hello,
I'm just starting out doing some home recording. I know a bit about instruments, but don't know anything about microphones, short of information i have picked up from speaking with friends and reading the microphone FAQ posted here. I'm on a tight budget and would like recommendations for a microphone i should purchase. I'll give as much detail as possible on my setup and what i would be using the mic for.

The style of music is slow, mellow, instrumental post-rock (sigur ros, tortoise, etc). Most things I am recording like bass, guitar, keyboards, drum machine, are going first through any pedals that might be used, to a Yamaha MC-802 mixer, with a t.c. electronic m300 effects processor hooked up to the loop (used mainly for digital delay on the guitar and reverb on other things like the drum machine). Then the outputs of the mixer are hooked up to my soundcard. I realize this may not be the best way to record some of these instruments, but until i can afford nice amps and microphones, it will do. Obviously I can only record one instrument at a time with this setup but thats fine for me for now, until i can afford some type of multi-input soundcard setup.

Now, the thing i need the microphone for is for certain instruments that don't have a line out, such as xylophone, melodica, accordion, etc. There will also be slight vocals i might add to certain songs but they will not be prominent. There is also a small possibility i might want to record some acoustic guitar but this is not a priority. Also it should be noted that, as of this time, we are mainly just recording things to help with the song writing process and to have something saved to be able to continue working on it, but as of right now I don't have a way to do so for these instruments, short of a cheap radio shack mic i borrowed from my parents. Probably the most we would be using these recordings for would be very early demos for giving out to friends or family, so it doesn't need to sound awesome, just nice. At some point in the future, we may end up using a studio of some sort, or at least a friend with a better recording setup, to do a final recording, but maybe not, depending on how things turn out here. It should also be noted, that most of the music I am into is fairly lo-fi, so i'm not too particular about getting the absolute best sound possible, however i like to be smart with my money and just want to make sure my money is going in the right direction, as in the mic i buy will be fairly appropriate for the job i am doing. My budget could be anywhere from $100 to maybe $200 or a bit more if needed, and I would like to start with one good, all purpose dynamic mic, and then maybe a bit later invest in a condenser mic of some sort, within a similar price range, so recommendations for either would be great. A local music shop currently has the following available, Shure SM57, SM58, and Beta 57A in stock, so i was considering one of those, but i don't mind looking elsewhere if there is better value for my money in a different mic. Also, recommendations for recording methods for instruments of this type, such as mic placement (where and how), would be appreciated. Keep in mind i'm a beginner without much understanding of x-y configurations, compression, and eqing, so if you get too technical it will be over my head. Keep it simple enough for me to understand and achieve my simple purposes.

Also, one more question, my bandmate has offered to donate a Shure BG 1.0 mic for recording purposes, but I can't seem to find much info on this mic, as in is it any good at all, and if so, what is it best suited for recording?

Thanks so much in advance,
Brian.
 
If you're just starting out and only have a budget of $200, I'd say go with the SM57 and a Behringer B-1 condenser until you can upgrade.

Good luck!
 
downstream said:
most of the music I am into is fairly lo-fi, so i'm not too particular about getting the absolute best sound possible, however i like to be smart with my money and just want to make sure my money is going in the right direction, as in the mic i buy will be fairly appropriate for the job i am doing. My budget could be anywhere from $100 to maybe $200 or a bit more if needed, and I would like to start with one good, all purpose dynamic mic, and then maybe a bit later invest in a condenser mic of some sort, within a similar price range, so recommendations for either would be great. A local music shop currently has the following available, Shure SM57, SM58, and Beta 57A in stock,

Based on everything you're saying, sounds like an SM57 will do the trick nicely. It fits the situation you're describing to a T.

downstream said:
Also, one more question, my bandmate has offered to donate a Shure BG 1.0 mic for recording purposes, but I can't seem to find much info on this mic, as in is it any good at all, and if so, what is it best suited for recording?

Thanks so much in advance,
Brian

Try the mic out, it may be all you'll ever need! I wouldn't worry about what someone else thinks of the mic if it's available to you, try it and see!

War :cool:
 
I agree about Behringer B1! Its an awesome deal. The mic is great and you get a very durable shockmount and a case with it. Can't really go wrong with that buy...
 
The music sounds really cool.

Buy a Shure SM57 or option two would be buy two Shure SM57s. They are amazing mics, and if you are still recording 10 years from now you will still be using them on a daily basis, or if 10 years from now you decide you do not want to record anymore you will be able to sell the SM57s for pretty close to what you paid for them.
 
I'm really sorry to differ here, I have only one SM57 and never use it. There's always a mic that sounds better on any application.

I'm using MD421, MD441, M88, M69 or M201 as far as dynamics go.

And I'm not talking condensers of ribbons.

I'm not familiar with the Behringer B1, but I can't imagine it'll sound better than Studio Projects and Marshall MXL mics, which are often cheaper.

I would recommend a used MD421 or Md441 if you need a versatile and really great sounding dynamic mic.

A very versatile LDC is the SP B3 with it's cardioid, omni and fig 8 patterns.
 
I had the same kind of choice to make and the first priority for me was versatility. I went with the SM57 and the Studio Projects B1 and never looked back. It's a good combination.
 
Han,

With all due respect....downstream's budget is $200. I agree on the MD421, but it's beyond his budget at present. IMO the SM57 is a mic that most people rely upon years after the initial purchase. It isn't called a "workhorse mic" for no reason.

When downstream's budget allows he can get that MD421...place it on the amp grill and stick that SM57 on the backside of the speaker. It's narrower and can fit into a tight space as such.

He could also look into the Senn E609. :-)
 
Because he is looking at a fairly wide variety of instruments to record I would suggest a pair of small or medium diameter condensers like a MXL603S. If he wants to do more vocals I would recommend one 603 and one v67G
 
Another mic to check out in this price range is the Studio Projects B1.

I am not too familiar with the Behringer B1, but except from the last couple of days, it usually gets bad comments here on the board. May or may not be justified -- but make sure you check out the SP B1 also before buying the Behringer (and also the MXL V67G).

An then if you're into SDC, then there would be the Oktava MK-012 to check.


-- Per.
 
Here is John McEntire's microphone collection:

AKG C-414 TL-II (2)
AKG C-422 Stereo
AKG C-451/2 with various pads and capsules (6)
AKG C-408
AKG D-112
AKG BX-11 with built-in reverb
Altec 201B
Audio Technica 4033
Audio Technica 4047
Audio Technica ATM25
Beyer Dynamic M88 Classic (2)
Beyer Dynamic M500 with Stephen Sank modification
Earthworks TC30K (2)
Marshall MXL V77 (2)
Neumann KU100 binaural system
Neumann M249b
Neumann M269c
Royer R121
Schoeps CMC6 (2) with various capsules
Schoeps CMC6-xt
Sennheiser MD421-II (2)
Sennheiser MD441-U
Sennheiser MKH 40
Shure SM57 (2)
Shure SM7
Shure SM98 Beta (2)
Sony C-37a (2)
Sony C-37P
Sony C-500B (2)
STC/Coles 4038

Looks like the only ones in your price range are the SM57 and possibly the MXL v77, whatever that is (tube condenser?). I don't know a huge amount about tortoise themselves I must confess. Didn't they record an album at electrical once? I think everything I ever heard from them was keyboards and samples.

AFAIK sigur ros use dynamic microphones on vocals? At least I've seen one studio shot with an sm58 style design although it might well be one of those shure condensers or something? The availability and expense of microphones in Iceland might be a scary matter tho!

Your profile also doesn't list your location. I'm assuming you are in the states somewhere but if not then you won't be able to buy MXL microphones easily.

At the end of the day it probably doesn't matter that much about the microphone I suspect. The SM57 is probably a good choice, it's famed as the microphone to stick on something when you are not sure what to use! It's probably one of the microphones with the widest range of applications. OTOH if you have phantom power, you might consider a condenser microphone such as the MXL v67 which is about $100. Either microphone would find places in your setup for years to come I expect. Would be good if you could try them both and see what you think. Condensers tend to be preety magical on vocals in a sort of capturing all the nuances kind of way, which is good if that is what you want.

If you have an amp, you could mic it with the sm57 and use it for vocals and you might even get good results on the accordian. A condenser will give you more detailed results, and would be nice on acoustic. But hey, if you are going to use a lot of effects, maybe it doesn't matter so much anyway.

However, you know what, I would use that Shure BG thing and save your money. It's made by shure so presumably will be of reasonable quality. My guess is it is a microphone that Shure made for the budget market and is almost certainly a dynamic designed for vocals (vocal mics being the bulk of the low end market). So it should be fine on vocals and I expect it will be okay on the other instruments you list too, you might even be able to use it to mic an amp, and it's free and you might not get results with an sm57 that would be different enough to warrant the extra money. I think you should at least try the shure BG. Then if you find you want to try something different to it, you might get a cheap large diaghram condenser or something.

I'm not suggesting that some cheap budget shure mic will be as good as an sm57 BTW, just that it's free and might cover a lot of the applications listed to an extent that in an untreated home recording environment, the sm57 not might warrant the extra money for the applications listed.

Try the shure BG and see what you can do with it first.
IMHO a free microphone is one of the best kinds of microphones you can get, especially in your situation.

love

Freya
 
What Treeline said- Studio Projects B-1 would be a good choice- $80. I would choose it over the Behringer if only for SP's tech support and customer service, which beats Behringer all to hell. The other good suggestion is Shure SM57, which is a cheap but rather functional industry standard dynamic. It's not as sensitive as the B-1, so it shines in places with a lot of annoying background noise, but isn't as good on quiet, delicate instruments.
There are a lot of good serviceable cheap dynamics out there that you can find cheap on ebay. Some of my favorites are AKG D770 and Sennheiser e835. Either one is a good substitute for the SM57, and can often be had for under $50.
Han- I don't know what some of these mics cost in Nederland, but the Sennheiser MD421 is a $300 mic, and a 441 is over $600. Not only are those mics over his budget, but are not necessary to do the job he has described.
I would buy the SP B-1 and the SM57. That's $160 for 2 mics with very different properties which will give you a choice for different situations.-Richie
 
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I think studio projects is a good choice over Behringer. It sounds like the studio projects B1 is not much more than the behringer B1 so theres no contest really as the word seems to be that the studio projects mikes are better and obviously studio projects actually *have* customer support and it's supposed to be really good to boot.

If you are going to buy behringer, You should nearly always consider their cheapest models because anything more and theres probably something better for similar money. In large diaghram condenser microphones the cheapest would probably be the behringer C1 which I expect will be about $35 (going on the prices here) and is thus the cheapest large diaghram mike I have ever heard of. No idea what it sounds like tho, and obviously behringer do not have a good reputation on the whole.

If anyone has heard this mike I'd love to hear about it.

I think the SM57, Studio Projects B1 and MXL V67 are all worth looking at and good suggestions but do check out the freebie mic first! :)

love

Freya
 
Thanks!

Hey,
Thanks for the advice everyone. Much more response than i expected. I'm going to test out this BG mic, and then possibly consider the sm57. I am definitely interested in a condenser mic, I like the idea of being able to pick up nuances in vocals (or the clicking of the melodica keys for example), so I'm going to do some more research, but the Studio Projects mic sounds interesting. I'll try to look at most of the stuff suggested though! I'm located in Canada, near Toronto which has several good music stores, but if something is not available i can always order online...
And if i need more help in future I sure know where to come!
Thanks,
Brian
p.s. special thanks to freya for the lengthy and informative posts!
 
though i have no personal experience with them, the oktava mk012 are prettly well respected around these parts, for inexpensive yet quality mics. people use them on everything from drum overheads, to acoustic stringed instruments to vocals... you can pick up a matched pair on ebay for about 275.00 US dollars... or you could get one for around 120-150... and still get a sm57 and be right on budget or maybe just a tad over. i think for some of the instruments youre talking about, accordian and xylophone... and what not, you need a condensor... an sm57 just wont pick up all the nuances of those instruments. then on the other hand, if youre recording live and dont have good isolation and dont know a lot about mic placement, a condensor may give you some trouble. i would recomend reading posts by harvey gerst... he knows more about mics than canadians know about maple leaves... as im buying gear, i find it is always better to spend a few extra bucks in the start and get quality gear that i can still use 20 years from now, than to skimp and buy gear that i will always have to keep upgrading...
 
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