need help miking my amp (sound samples included)

[traciiroxx]

I posted a few weeks back trying to get help on miking my amp, but didn't really get anything that helped. I decided I would post some examples of what I was getting to see if people could tell me what I am doing wrong. I have included 4 samples. Three of them are of a Marshall VS30R, and 1 is of a Fender Pro Junior. The mic is a Shure SM57 running through a Tascam 414 Portastudio into an SBLive on my computer.

Marshall:

Center -

Edge (mic parallel to floor, placed just inside the edge of the speaker -

Halfway in between the edge and center, with the mic facing the actual cone of the speaker -

ProJunior - center -

I think the projunior sample is the only one that sounds decent, the others sound harsh. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

 

[cramer21]

mixes

I am no means a pro at recording, many others may be able to give you better feedback, but for me, the cleanest sound, meaning where I can "hear" the different sounds of the guitar are on the 1st one (center1).
The Projunior has a diferent sound, but seems a bit muffled, a little too bassy.
i admit, I prefer to be able to hear the Hi's, and on the first track, they come thru very well.
Of course, this is just my humble opinion.

 

[noiseportrait]

I think you need to work on the sound coming out of the amplifier more than mic placement. doesn't your amp have some kind of eq? It looks like you are doing fine as far as mic tecnique. You might want to also try pointing the mic just off to the side of the center cone. Don't worry, you're are on the right track.

 

[Scottgman]

I think the Pro Junior sample sounded the worst. Maybe for a particular style of song it would be fine. I thought the other samples sounded pretty good. I might do a little tweaking on the amp like turn down the gain, maybe roll off the highs or mids a little, etc.

But you have to remember the point is how the guitar sounds in the mix-- unless you are going for some solo guitar virtuoso type of thing where guitar is the only instrument recorded. I think any of those samples would sound pretty good in a mix (again I thought the Junior sounded the worst).

Have you tried doubling the guitar parts and/or using another mic? I used to have a VS100 combo and got some pretty good sounds from micing the front and back of the amp. Doubling the guiatr parts will usually result in a "fatter" sound that might be what you are trying to accomplish.

Cheers!

 

[traciiroxx]

gain

Thanks for the help. The sounds I have been getting do actually sound fairly decent in mixes. When I record parts that require less gain they don't sound nearly as harsh. But for a lot of the stuff I record I need to play with the amount of gain heard on the recordings to get artificial harmonics to ring through. Any suggestions on how to get it a little less harsh without cutting down the gain. (The gain on the amp is barely above 5 as it is)

 

[Scottgman]

I would turn down the gain for the main guitar tracks then go back and overdub the pinch harmonics. That's how Zakk Wylde gets his insanely huge sounding pinch harmonics-- he doubles (or triples) them.

The turning down the gain trick-- as I understand it-- is really effective when you have more than one guitar track. The first track may not sound that agressive, but when you start layering more tracks in the mix, the guitar tone will start getting some balls. Also, with layered guitar tracks, using less gain will help reduce mud.

Good Luck.

 

[traciiroxx]

another recording

hey this is a recording of one of the ways i have been micing my amp. Its hard to explain. I place the mic kinda by the edge, but then point it towards the center. I think this recording actually sounds good. I'd like to hear feedback.

 

[grinder]

Re: gain

Thanks for the help. The sounds I have been getting do actually sound fairly decent in mixes. When I record parts that require less gain they don't sound nearly as harsh. But for a lot of the stuff I record I need to play with the amount of gain heard on the recordings to get artificial harmonics to ring through. Any suggestions on how to get it a little less harsh without cutting down the gain. (The gain on the amp is barely above 5 as it is)

Use heavy compression and then you can bring the gain down without losing the harmonics.

 

[Doug H]

Post your volume and gain settings, and typical eq. Is that amp solid state tube or hybred? If it's a hybred then where are the tubes?

A lot of that harshness is coming off of the amp itself IMO. I thought the middle Marshall sample sounded pretty good, just kind of brittle. May needed more mids.

Most Marshalls I've heard sound pretty dry at lower master gain settings. Even some of the solid state combos I've played sound better with the master dialed up. I know on my amp (jcm800 4210) trying to get a warm sound with the master at 2 is nearly impossible. I Maybe get a passable metal sound with the gain and preamp dimed.

I usually play with the master at about 9 and the pre amp volume somewhere around where it starts to cut in. Amps been doing funny things lately tho lol. Might not be the best thing for the amp, but it's the best sound I can get without peeling the paint off of the walls.

Doug

 

[Scottgman]

His amp is the Valvestate line. They are hybrids. Tubes in the preamp and solidstate power.

 

[Scottgman]

Re: another recording

This link is dead.

 

[Doug H]

His amp is the Valvestate line. They are hybrids. Tubes in the preamp and solidstate power.

I've never played those, but I'd say it was worth a shot making sure the pre amp has some volume, like 6 or 7, then adjusting the master gain to trim it down to the appropriate recording volume.

 

[traciiroxx]

amp

The amp is actually not a hybrid, it's purely solid state. Only the 65 watt and higher valvestates had tubes in the preamp. The typical settings on my amp are Gain=5.5 Bass=8 Treble=5.5
Contour=5.5 and Volume=3.5 (which is not quiet by any means)

Sorry about the dead link here is the real address

 

[Doug H]

No preamp volume?

 

[traciiroxx]

preamp volume

No, there is only a master volume for each the clean and overdrive channels.

 

[grinder]

Re: preamp volume

No, there is only a master volume for each the clean and overdrive channels.

Isn't the gain the same thing as the pre volume?

 

[Moonrider]

Here's a link to one of the best discussions on miking a guitar cab I've ever seen. Be forewarned, it's rude, crude and has a ton of good information.

http://recpit.prosoundweb.com/viewtopic.php?t=4095

 

[Doug H]

Re: preamp volume

No, there is only a master volume for each the clean and overdrive channels.

Nothing to try there then. The middle position and asdf sample both sound pretty good to me. I have a hard time micing my amp too. I think reflectins off of the wall behind the amp may be coming into play a lot.

 

[Doug H]

Here's a link to one of the best discussions on miking a guitar cab I've ever seen. Be forewarned, it's rude, crude and has a ton of good information.

http://recpit.prosoundweb.com/viewtopic.php?t=4095

that rocked, thanks for the link.

 

[TexRoadkill]

Re: Re: preamp volume

Isn't the gain the same thing as the pre volume?

Yes.

You can get okay tones and sometimes the right tone out of a solid state amp but if you want to make things easy then use a tube amp. I've got one of the Marshall AVT amps and I rarely like it on anything.