Natural speed limits...

[six]

Hi there

I'm not a shredder and I always prefer a good melodic solo over a combination of lightning sweeps and stuff where the listeners go "hu? what was that?".
nonetheless I think speed and technique in general ARE aspects of good playing, and i'm definitely not the "i go for emotions, less for speed"-type just because I haven't got the chops. I DO want to be able to play lightning licks now and then. But let me get to the point now: I think I am not able to - physically.

Ok, I don't practice that much, but I have the feeling that I'm close to my limits, which can't be expanded.

I also have a theory: Most of us won't ever be able to run a hundred meters in less than 10 seconds - no matter how and how long we practice. So why should every guitar-player be able to play as fast as Kotzen or Vai or whoever?

What do you guys think? Are only a few able to ever reach these speeds or is - theoretically - every player able to play like the mentioned "heroes" with the right training (unless he/she doesn't suffer from a bad bone-disease or something)?

 

[Jouni]

I think you're partially right, all of us are born with different physical talents, some with lightning speed, some not. I too am more of a slow, big, sluggish type, might be a reason I always liked to play rhythm, or recently, bass. But IF I'd like to run through strings like a demon on crystal meth, I'd suppose an amphetamine-coffee diet and hours of practice per day would help to get there with the speed, and lean-slim grimreaper-kinda good looks!!

genes versus practice.

 

[Dogbreath]

I'm kinda sluggish too and about as sharp as a bowling ball but I've found that pick technique is kind of the key. How you hold it and a relaxed wrist helped the most. But I'll never be a true shredder. No desire. I'd rather keep it melodic where you grab the listener by the ears in a nice way.

 

[Micter]

I'm sort of the other end of the spectrum. I have to work at playing slow. I have the ability to play really fast but make a consious effort to play melodic runs that fit the song. Anyway I was not naturally fast in my early days but through much practice developed into it. My point anyone can learn speed if they put the needed time into doing it. Trust me I was a hack for a lot of years before I got serious about my technique.

 

[ez_willis]

Ok, I don't practice that much

Well then how do you know you are at your "theoretical limit"? Semms like if you just practiced for a few weeks you'd be able to determine if you could get faster.

So why should every guitar-player be able to play as fast as Kotzen or Vai or whoever?

They shouldn't. In fact, if you do, keep it down, it rattles my brain.

 

[gbondo9]

Here - try this....it will help.
I promise.

Helpful Training Video

 

[Greg_L]

 

[Greg_L]

i think the fact that you dont practice much may have something to do with you not being as fast as you can be.

 

[metalhead28]

I do think that some people are more naturally able to achieve certain levels of speed, but I think most people could get much faster with practice. I don't think just anyone is capable of Shawn Lane speed, but you know what I mean.
When I play really fast I often use alot of legato so my fret hand fingers are moving way faster than my picking hand. I'm a picking minimalist. I've been coaching a friend who is a very good player to do some of my faster legato runs and his fingers just won't move fast enough. He's chipping away at it slowly but surely, where as for me it feels pretty natural. It does seem that there is almost a physical barrier for his finger speed. However, I think he'll break through it eventually if he keeps practicing. Same for just about anybody.

 

[Uladine]

I think everyone can get faster with practice and conditioning, but I also believe there are limits and we are not all created equal in that regard. Arthritis and hand injuries are obvious "speed limiters" but I'm sure there are many other aspects that can affect our "speed limit" (energy level, alcohol, caffeine, maybe even genetics or chemistry, I dunno). I also believe in knowing your limits and playing within them. Not to say don't ever strive to get better, you should always keep trying to improve your playing, but throwing yourself out there and trying to play stuff beyond your comfort zone in a live situation usually ends up sounding like crap, I see it all the time. Push yourself at practice, and your "comfort zone" will expand, and your confidence will come through in your playing and each note will sound sweet.

Some may disagree with me, I'm just stating my humble opinion.

I practice rarely as well so my comfort zone is pretty small hehe.

 

[Rochambeau II]

See if myhatbroke will give you lessons

 

[Codmate]

Yeah - everybody has a natural limit. But I think that 99% of people will be able to play very very fast indeed if they practice enough.

I would get 'Speed Mechanics For Lead Guitar' by Troy Stetina if you're serious about incresing your speed and accuracy with a pick.

Take up classical guitar (preferably with a good teacher) if you want to increase fingerstyle speed.

 

[travelin travis]

Yeah - everybody has a natural limit. But I think that 99% of people will be able to play very very fast indeed if they practice enough.

I would get 'Speed Mechanics For Lead Guitar' by Troy Stetina if you're serious about incresing your speed and accuracy with a pick.

Take up classical guitar (preferably with a good teacher) if you want to increase fingerstyle speed.

I had (have?) that book. I practiced that stuff for a whole month and all I got out of it was the urge to wear tight pants, makeup, and sling my guitar around my head.

Seriously though, if you have the discipline and motivation to work thru a book like that, you could definately develope some fast hands. The one thing in that book that really stuck with me is the little section on ear training. I'm much too lazy to make any use of the rest of the book.

 

[Rochambeau II]

and sling my guitar around my head.

How do you do that? Ive always wanted to know

 

[travelin travis]

How do you do that? Ive always wanted to know

easy there...........one thing at a time............you gotta get your makeup right before you can even think about doing the slingin thang.

 

[six]

hey, thanks for your answers and opinions so far.

yeah, I also have a book on the topic of technique and once in a while I really manage to practice over a few weeks. but honestly, the progress has been minimal so far.

a friend of mine, whose not a guitar-player but an athlete, once said "it's relatively easy to reach 95% of what is possible but it's a long way to reach 100%"

i think that's true for a lot of things, including playing the guitar. i must say though: if I have to practice like hell to speed up my stuff from 95 bpm to 100 bpm, I'll immidiately quit practising.

 

[myhatbroke]

I didnt read the whole thread but dude don't hold yourself back. Practice even more. The best way to learn to play fast is by playing slow. Get all your technique down perfectly at slow speeds and slowly speed it up. A big example is not lifting your fingers so much on the fret board. I learned this from Michael Angelo

 

[darkcubus]

it just takes practice to shred like that. it's like a little kid that excels at something because there is nothing they would rather be doing so they conquer it at insane speeds.

i don't care how fast you can shred if that's all you can do. if your primary goal is to be able to play fast and forget all sense of melody it would get boring faster than you can play. unless you're intentionally listening to yngwie or some intentionally brutal death/black metal or something. fast double picking works great as being shreddingly fast and allowing melody as long as it compliments the song and doesn't just exist as pretentious shredding.

to gain speed, try using smaller, thicker picks. like a dunlop jazz small 3.0 stubby or small tortex m3. watch lots of shredding practice videos, find shredding tabs and follow along. just keep practicing.

to me, well written melodies are key. but i have no idea what goes on at any point in time throughout my entire existence.

 

[Rochambeau II]

I didnt read the whole thread but dude don't hold yourself back. Practice even more. The best way to learn to play fast is by playing slow. Get all your technique down perfectly at slow speeds and slowly speed it up. A big example is not lifting your fingers so much on the fret board. I learned this from Michael Angelo

And also program the guitar in midi, and just tell people that you played it, right myhatbroke?

 

[Superhuman]

Pick as fast as possible on one string without fretting any notes - you will find that you can get pretty damn fast strumming. That speed is probably the fastest potential you will ever have for picking. The difficulty comes in linking the left hand to the speed of the right hand. A good way of getting the fingers working faster is by praticing legatto over two strings 123 & 1234 patterns as fast as you can. Your max current legatto speed is basically as fast as you can alternately pick with accuracy - there will probably be a gap between this speed and your maximum picking speed - this is the gap you need to work on closing. If there's a gap then you know you can improve, it just takes practice and a clear mental approach. Hope that helps.

Edit: Another tip, study the exact position of your right hand, wrist and arm when you are picking at your maximum speed and make sure that you use exactly the same technique (just slowed down) when you play slower parts. The point being, things fall apart with a lot of player when they speed up because they are changing their strumming technique as opposed to simply changing the speed of the strumming. Hope that makes sense!